Found Deceased IA - Mollie Tibbetts, 20, Poweshiek County, 19 Jul 2018 *Arrest* #44

[Al Hoffman]

His other crimes matter because they show a pattern of arrogant and complete disregard for the law for years. The judge also said CR may have to go on the sex offender registry. I'm confident all of it will be allowed. JMO

Well, he certainly will have many opportunities to validate his sex offender status on the inside, as he is pretty, and small.

 

[Al Hoffman]

I researched the significance of covering a body after a murder. I found it indicates a younger person and the feeling of remorse or not wanting to accept what they did. Other research showed using a knife could indicate some type of emotional attachment to the victim.

And sometimes a cigar is just a cigar...

 

[Mica]

It's a farm, a family owned business. Re MSM the paperwork was handled by a family employee. If she used the on line version of the SSNVS system, she was using an electronic verification system, just not THE E-Verify system. "Sure I e-verify, I vet the SSNs electronically on line." , and indeed they might have, but not with E-Verify.

THAT ALL HAVING BEEN SAID...

Per MSM the Senior Y Farm owner was on the Iowa Agriculture Board, lobbying the Feds to free up more farm worker visas. He must know the ins and outs of the system. His farm operated within the letter of the law, and his agent using the electronic version of the SSNVS gives him plausible deniability in court over this issue, and the shield of the SSNVS handbook and EEOC law gives him further legally sanctioned ground to justify his conduct.

NEVER skirt the shoals of the law, unless you know where all the rocks are first. To not cross the line, you must first know where it is at. The way the farm operated was by the letter of the law legal. To file charges, the Feds will have to show that they had actual knowledge that they were hiring illegals and/or somehow participated in the fraud, even though EEOC laws mandate that you can't ask hires questions about this. Certainly, there may well be administrative fines, just the cost of doing business.

Do you see all the marvelous wiggle room that this gives a well paid high dollar immigration law attorney in court, as part of a Criminal defense team for Y Farms and it's owners and staff. While we could fantasize about a RICO criminal conviction and Tort over all of this with triple damages, and involving other farms,; the owners could also throw the family member, who filed on the SSNVS as the registered authorized employer's agent, under the bus as she was the one ultimately responsible for the fraud. "We'll put money on your commissary books and pay for your phone calls. Of course, you'll always have a home here when you get out..."

Thanks for your kind post. Anything is possible. Only time will tell.

You’re welcome Al Hoffman. I am confident ICE and Homeland Security will do a thorough investigation. They went back to the farm for two hours of interviews. I’m curious if other employees fell through their vetting process, as CR did. As you said, time will tell. Thank you for your informative posts.

 

[MyBelle]

There's no reason to prove that the suspect is arrogant or that he doesn't abide by the law. All that matters in the prosecution of the suspect for the murder are the facts of the murder. Furthermore, it is implicit in the murder charge that he does not respect the law.

I didn't say the prosecutor would "prove" CR entered the country illegally or obtained fraudulent identity documents. Those are federal crimes, not state crimes but absolutely the prosecutor will mention it. Of that, I have no doubt. JMO

 

[MsBetsy]

Maybe he has autism/Asperger's. Unfortunately, a lot of the description given of him also fits signs of it. The staring at someone would only happen when the person was turned away though, I've never known anyone on the spectrum who was good at making/keeping eye contact. I would really hate for that to be the case since people on the spectrum are already seen as odd too often without being seen as dangerous too. MOO

I had thought of that too. If that's the case I'm sure the tests will reveal any type of Aspergers. But in most cases, the kind of behaviors associated with this disorder are obvious to others. There is definitely a problem with emotional attachments, and some don't even like to be touched or even be around people. But I think it's possible he may have a very mild form, I just don't think so imo

 

[otto]

I didn't say the prosecutor would "prove" CR entered the country illegally or obtained fraudulent identity documents. Those are federal crimes, not state crimes but absolutely the prosecutor will mention it. Of that, I have no doubt. JMO

I understand. It's your position that in the prosecution for murder, the prosecutor will attempt to introduce unrelated information during the trial. I'm not familiar enough with the Iowa courts to know whether alleged, unrelated prior bad acts are tolerated during murder trials. It seems to me that if the judge wants to keep the trial on track, extraneous information about what he did at the age of 17 should be very carefully managed and excluded.

 

[1987]

if convicted life without parole is just about the most there can be. so what if other lesser crimes add a couple years its not like he can be made to serve a couple more years after he is dead. I might have cared about the lesser crimes right up to the point of him killing MT. a line was crossed and the lesser things just aren't so important now. moo

 

[cody22]

I understand. It's your position that in the prosecution for murder, the prosecutor will attempt to introduce unrelated information during the trial. I'm not familiar enough with the Iowa courts to know whether alleged, unrelated prior bad acts are tolerated during murder trials. It seems to me that if the judge wants to keep the trial on track, extraneous information about what he did at the age of 17 should be very carefully managed and excluded.

I agree with you that the Judge will run this trial with a firm hand, as he/she should..... Now, the Media that is gonna hit that area, outside that courtroom may be a different kind of story to watch.

 

[otto]

I agree with you that the Judge will run this trial with a firm hand, as he/she should..... Now, the Media that is gonna hit that area, outside that courtroom may be a different kind of story to watch.

The media has gone nuts a few times already. First they accused, tried, sentenced and convicted a pig farmer on the basis that police searched near his residence. Now the fact that Rivera is an illegal immigrant is all that seems to matter.

Courtrooms are an entirely different set of circumstances. What Rivera did in 2011 and whether he was legally entitled to drive a vehicle have nothing to do with Mollie's murder.

 

[MsBetsy]

I understand. It's your position that in the prosecution for murder, the prosecutor will attempt to introduce unrelated information during the trial. I'm not familiar enough with the Iowa courts to know whether alleged, unrelated prior bad acts are tolerated during murder trials. It seems to me that if the judge wants to keep the trial on track, extraneous information about what he did at the age of 17 should be very carefully managed and excluded.

Unless, in my opinion, that includes prior behavior of assault or some violent crime. A pattern. But even that they may not need. Imo.....
Which I just reread your post and saw that's exactly what you meant.

 

[SteveP]

I get the sense, and I may be wrong, that many people hope all of CR's other alleged illegal acts, i.e., coming into country illegally, using fake id, driving without a valid license, etc, will come into the trial and kinda have a cumulative effect, so that the jurors think, well, he did all these other things, so he probably killed this young woman too. I get that, and part of me feels the same way, but jurors can't decide his guilt on one charge based on guilt in some other completely unrelated charge, and ultimately, none of those other things is part of his murder charge. If he was charged and convicted of all those other things, but not convicted of murder, would anyone feel that justice had been served by a minimal sentence, if any? I think not. Likewise, if he is convicted of murder, he is in prison for the rest of his life, and no other charge is going to keep him there after death, as a previous poster noted. JMO

 

[Al Hoffman]

if convicted life without parole is just about the most there can be. so what if other lesser crimes add a couple years its not like he can be made to serve a couple more years after he is dead. I might have cared about the lesser crimes right up to the point of him killing MT. a line was crossed and the lesser things just aren't so important now. moo

Well, to satisfy some of the more vitriolic posters on this thread....

After CR is found guilty of Murder One in Iowa, maybe the Feds could try and convict him of a list of Federal crimes, and scentance him to be buried on the grounds of a Federal prison as a further punishment, after he is released from Iowa's penal system.

I hope this rings the bell for somebody...

 

[otto]

Unless, in my opinion, that includes prior behavior of assault or some violent crime. A pattern. But even that they may not need. Imo.....
Which I just reread your post and saw that's exactly what you meant.

Yup. He has no criminal record, so there's no prior history of violent crime.

 

[TL4S]

What would we be talking about on here if CR was a legal US citizen, driving a car he owned, and with a valid DL?

Aren't there other topics about this case that could be looked into and discussed?

 

[MassGuy]

Well, to satisfy some of the more vitriolic posters on this thread....

After CR is found guilty of Murder One in Iowa, maybe the Feds could try and convict him of a list of Federal crimes, and scentance him to be buried on the grounds of a Federal prison as a further punishment, after he is released from Iowa's penal system.

I hope this rings the bell for somebody...

Well said. This murder trial and conviction is all that matters, and all that ever will.

 

[1987]

Unless, in my opinion, that includes prior behavior of assault or some violent crime. A pattern. But even that they may not need. Imo

he took LE to the body. how would not having a DL help convict him more than leading to the body, admitting to putting her in the trunk, telling the route he took?

 

[Confusion]

I had thought of that too. If that's the case I'm sure the tests will reveal any type of Aspergers. But in most cases, the kind of behaviors associated with this disorder are obvious to others. There is definitely a problem with emotional attachments, and some don't even like to be touched or even be around people. But I think it's possible he may have a very mild form, I just don't think so imo

Even if he did/does have it, it's not a defense for what he did. Having problems with relationships, social cues, self care, etc. doesn't mean you don't know right from wrong. It just seemed like people were sometimes describing my son and others I know with high functioning autism when I read descriptions of him given by others. The one thing that doesn't fit though is that my son (and most others I know) turn their anger inward rather than outward, and would be more likely to self-mutilate or attempt suicide than murder someone who had scorned them. MOO

 

[cody22]

What would we be talking about on here if CR was a legal US citizen, driving a car he owned, and with a valid DL?

Please don't get us going on fitbits or red shirts again....at least until the Texas college football games start tonight.....LOL !

 

[TL4S]

Please don't get us going on fitbits or red shirts again....at least until the Texas college football games start tonight.....LOL !

What about cell phone pings?

 

[SteveP]

What about cell phone pings?

Or Black SUVs