Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #130

[MistyWaters]

These are excerpts from an interview with Jay Abbott, now retired FBI but he was the special agent in charge at Indianapolis when the murders occurred and was involved in the early days of the investigation:

The FBI doesn’t have jurisdiction for murder cases, this was clearly a case in the jurisdiction for Carroll County/ISP, and Doug Carter, superintendent of the ISP, a great friend and colleague came to us and asked for our assistance.

As the special agent in charge at that time I had the authority to provide whatever assistance he might want. I was enthused to release every FBI asset, technical ability, anything we had to help him solve this case. ISP stayed at the forefront in charge of the case. There were days where the FBI had more personnel in and around Delphi than any other agency. Sometimes there were 100 agents I was trying to keep track of, all doing various things - whether with the command post, videography, voice analysis, crime scene experts, behavioral analysis experts, and numerous agents pounding the pavement and running down leads.

Each day that went by we felt we were going to be closer and closer and closer. The investigators Doug assigned were extremely competent, very reliable , very intuitive in how they investigated, they worked together seamlessly. We felt each day we would have that day. I was impressed oftentimes - in the position I was in - you want to be careful not to meddle and interfere with the investigators and just make sure they have the tools for success - but one of the things I was impressed with was, they would start their day with a prayer. Today is the day we finally bring justice to this case. Everybody genuinely wanted to see a positive outcome, solution, bring an end to it.

The exasperation and frustration is always there....It’s still very close to Doug’s thoughts and mine. When is something going to happen. The numerous things we had at our disposal and all the information and evidence that existed, it just boggles the mind. I feel and I know Doug feels the same way, there is somebody out there who knows something. They know the person, they know something about the murder, but they are fearful to come forward. They might feel themselves complicit in some way. To that person I'd say, we will protect you. You’ll be safe. You’ll be doing an incredible service to the families and community if you come forward.

Because I feel so strongly about some of the circumstantial - I mean, not circumstantial, but crime scene things that we will not speak about, that point to more of a signature that the killer left behind, we feel if that person comes forward that will be the thing that will help us tie it together....

There are things that occurred or are found at the crime scene that only the killer would know. It’s been explained to the family and others and certainly in the media that we just can’t speak about these things. We don't want the killer to know what we know. That person is not at freedom now. They wake up every morning wondering if today is the day they will finally be caught. Whether they care or not about this horrendous act that they committed, they will be caught.


This is from Fox 59 News:

This is such an excellent interview. It squelches any uncertainty regarding the magnitude and professionalism involved in this investigation, explains why the FBI became involved and outlines what type of support they provided.

 

[janewall]

Thank you! <3
Some people saw a dog in his jacket??!?

Oh yes. One theory was that BG lured the girls with a puppy he was carrying, that he may have said he needed help with or some such excuse.

The problem is, with those sparse pixels that comprise the poor-resolution photo image of him from Libby's phone, it's impossible to tell what he's got under that jacket. Or on his head. Or in his right pants leg, or on his back, or around his neck.

 

[cujenn81]

I don’t know how many words they have. Before 2019 conference they had three, right? Now it is four...So, maybe, they can find four more, not for us, for the VR software?

This being said - I believe the accent part, if the person traveled around, or was raised in Indiana, and then, moved, might be complicated.
(Whenever I visit my birth place, where I lived only in childhood, but where part of the family still lives, after a day or two, I start speaking with local accent.) Sometimes even the language you hear at home skews the accent, as it happened to my once-colleague, born in the US, in the family of Austrian immigrants.

However, I wonder if all avenues to place the guy have been exhausted.

This brings up a good point. Why didn’t they release the “guys” portion of the audio when they released “down the hill”? I think they slipped up initially (when they said the audio clip was just four words) because they knew about that other word — guys. But why hold that portion of the audio back?

 

[sunshineray]

Apologies, but I do not really understand your comment? Could you please elaborate?
I am not claiming there is a connection, just asking if it has ever been discussed in here? Because if it has I would like to read up on that. So what’s up with the huge break comment?

Sorry I haven't been on lately. I'd never heard of Amy's case before so I looked it up and found this...
https://www.news5cleveland.com/news...pments-in-amy-mihaljevic-murder-investigation

 

[UnapologeticallyAspie]

This brings up a good point. Why didn’t they release the “guys” portion of the audio when they released “down the hill”? I think they slipped up initially (when they said the audio clip was just four words) because they knew about that other word — guys. But why hold that portion of the audio back?

Good question.
My question is why did they handle any of this the way that they did!!?!

 

[sunshineray]

This brings up a good point. Why didn’t they release the “guys” portion of the audio when they released “down the hill”? I think they slipped up initially (when they said the audio clip was just four words) because they knew about that other word — guys. But why hold that portion of the audio back?

Maybe to ask any suspect, "On the bridge, what did you say to the girls?" for corroboration?

 

[Charlot123]

Thank you! <3
Some people saw a dog in his jacket??!?

A dog, yes. I think, even a baby goat. A respirator, an oxygen tank... It was when the thread was revived, shortly after the PC of 2019. I still remember how one participant commented, "with this, he'll blend right in". So it must have been the thread after "hiding in plain sight". This being said - I like people with active imagination! Perhaps, a goat is not such a bad idea, given that Delphi is farmland.

 

[JudgeJudi]

IMO It could be a blessing she did a factory reset not long before. Considering how fast phones can run out of storage if you take a lot of photos/videos and/or have a lot of apps. My nieces who are the same age as Libby always seems to have storage issues and wouldn’t be able to record a video more than a few seconds. I think of her whenever I receive the warning myself.

In February 2017 one Snapchat video could only be a maximum of ten seconds long, so if Libby was trying to film BG quickly and furtively, the most she would have got was 10 seconds.

In July 2017 there was an app upgrade that allowed you to record 6 x 10 second videos.

Snapchat now lets you record multiple videos at once

 

[Deleted member 102539]

This brings up a good point. Why didn’t they release the “guys” portion of the audio when they released “down the hill”? I think they slipped up initially (when they said the audio clip was just four words) because they knew about that other word — guys. But why hold that portion of the audio back?

I believe, since more or less short time before the April 2019-PC they detected, which person the BG would likely be, and only then the spoken word "guys" became very important suddenly. It will be an identifier and a strong one for exactly this person (although it is a term, which is used by many). IMO

 

[TL4S]

In February 2017 one Snapchat video could only be a maximum of ten seconds long, so if Libby was trying to film BG quickly and furtively, the most she would have got was 10 seconds.

In July 2017 there was an app upgrade that allowed you to record 6 x 10 second videos.

Snapchat now lets you record multiple videos at once

She could have recorded via the phone's video function, too. Do we know what the time limit is on that?

 

[Beachlife926]

She could have recorded via the phone's video function, too. Do we know what the time limit is on that?

The time limit on the video function is based on storage.
IMO based on the information we know I thought it was recorded on the video function based on the length (more than 10 secs and over Snapchat limits as JudgeJudi mentioned), how she concealed it while recording, +more. Snapchat required the user to hold the record button down while recording a video (although I just googled workarounds for this).
“State police say more audio from Libby German's cell phone was played for the victims' families, including a mention of a man they noticed behind them.
Police say the girls mostly talk about "stuff girls talk about" in the recording, but they also mention the man. The only audio that has been released to the public from the phone is that of a man's voice ordering German and her friend, Abby Williams, "down the hill."
Police: Delphi murder victims spoke of man behind them in audio played for family | wthr.com

 

[photographer4]

This brings up a good point. Why didn’t they release the “guys” portion of the audio when they released “down the hill”? I think they slipped up initially (when they said the audio clip was just four words) because they knew about that other word — guys. But why hold that portion of the audio back?

They may not want him to know what they have on him. Its possible that HE might recognize a snippet of conversation / some sounds etc and that might screw up the investigation. EG: if they release the full audio, and he hears something he recognizes (himself, the girls, a bird call... whatever)... he may realize what exactly police have and may then take steps to get rid of / hide / explain it away.

 

[Marzipan]

The other day we talked about whether or not Tobe Leazenby had ever said the POI (not his word) list was narrowed down, and I said I had never once heard that. I still maintain I have not heard it repeatedly, but did want to follow up with his exact words from the HLN Down the Hill TV show from Feb. 14-15.
I think the conversation was removed from here, probably because it was all vague and unsubstantiated.
I hope it's solid now to post it with the exact transcription from the show. He does say "In my own mind" but also says "we." If he is talking straight here, I think the original poster (one of the "Angel" names -- sorry, I can't remember which) was correct. It does appear there is some focus on a very small list of individuals. I'm not sure how I missed hearing this part.

From HLN Down the Hill tv show Feb 14 or 15.
Anchor: When we spoke to you in September, you said that you had a handful of names in your head that you couldn't get out of your head.
Tobe: Um hum
Anchor: You said five.
Tobe: Um hum
Anchor: Has that changed since then? Have you added any? Have you taken any away?
Tobe: I think in my own mind that possibly at this stage we have narrowed that list down. Um. You know maybe, three or four. It's not uh a huge change. But again I still fall back on, you know, no one, no one is incarcerated -- at this point so I can't totally say okay we are done with this individual and we go on to the next one. Eventually that is where we want to be is down to that one.

 

[photographer4]

The time limit on the video function is based on storage.
IMO based on the information we know I thought it was recorded on the video function based on the length (more than 10 secs and over Snapchat limits as JudgeJudi mentioned), how she concealed it while recording, +more. Snapchat required the user to hold the record button down while recording a video (although I just googled workarounds for this).
“State police say more audio from Libby German's cell phone was played for the victims' families, including a mention of a man they noticed behind them.
Police say the girls mostly talk about "stuff girls talk about" in the recording, but they also mention the man. The only audio that has been released to the public from the phone is that of a man's voice ordering German and her friend, Abby Williams, "down the hill."
Police: Delphi murder victims spoke of man behind them in audio played for family | wthr.com

I wonder why she was recording them talking about girl stuff in the first place? Did she just not realize she'd hit the record button maybe? Or was there something more to that?

 

[MistyWaters]

I wonder why she was recording them talking about girl stuff in the first place? Did she just not realize she'd hit the record button maybe? Or was there something more to that?

IIRC somebody closer to teenage girls than myself mentioned here that recording “girl talk” is common, to listen to again later, perhaps to re-enjoy the experience. I can’t vouch for that but it wouldn't really surprise me considering we all know how teens enjoy videoing friends and themselves, taking selfies etc.

 

[Falcon500]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed>


The only two child murders that I worked were committed by a stranger. The first involved a nine year old boy out looking for turtles and was accosted by a 19 year old pervert. Sexually related. He still has not been charged and it’s 45 years later. The second involved a tow truck driver picking up a 14 year old girl. Raped and shot and dumped over a bridge. That one is closed.

I don’t recall the parents of either victim being considered as suspects.

 

[Spartygirl]

JMO the killer wasn’t aware Libby had captured a glimpse of him on video and also was using it to record audio. If that were so he’d have no reason to suspect he was about to become the star performer. When DC mentioned “you made mistakes” I think that was one.

State Police: Libby German 'a hero' | wthr.com
“State Police called Liberty "Libby" German "a hero" for thinking to record the suspect while the crime was happening.

"This lady is a hero. There is no doubt. To have the presence of mind to activate the video on her cell phone," ISP Sgt. Tony Slocum said...”

I agree Libby was a Hero and her quick thinking to capture audio and video was a smart move.
I was thrilled to see this info when it first came out, thinking their killer would soon be caught.
Yet, even with this info, here we are, 4 yrs later, and BG still not caught.

 

[tiktaalik]

Looking at the photo/gif:
ISP: Delphi Homicide Investigation

I see a limp, or a stumble on the right leg, judging by the slow first step in the gif, followed quickly by a fast supporting step with the left leg. Previous injury, or under the influence?

I also see very bunched jeans at the ankles. I haven't seen any data yet on his height based on this gif, other than "average," but I think the pants is important, as they don't seem to be sagging or too big width-wise. That would mean the pants are too long for him, and I think that'd make him pretty short. There's a chance of course those jeans were made as a long cut, but an inference nonetheless.

Some folks are arguing about whether there's a dog in his coat, bit if this were the case, I'd think police would've found dog hair at the scene. I've carried a chihuahua in my coat before, and the coat definitely indicated a bundle, whereas his just sags down to the weight of his hands in his pockets.
I think he must be wearing some kind of "pageboy" cap, and the navy blue jacket seems like the texture of a windbreaker?
What'd I'd give for there to be a logo or SOMETHING to go on on his clothes.

 

[Beachlife926]

IIRC somebody closer to teenage girls than myself mentioned here that recording “girl talk” is common, to listen to again later, perhaps to re-enjoy the experience. I can’t vouch for that but it wouldn't really surprise me considering we all know how teens enjoy videoing friends and themselves, taking selfies etc.

Great info
Also, I thought I remember Anna Williams said it was something they often did. While looking for the interview to confirm I came across another one by her. I don’t see it on the media thread, and think it might’ve been brought up but wanted to share. I’m only halfway done but so far she’s been great - she’s strong, smart, beautiful, a good speaker and is giving her opinion on a lot of theories.
If you didn’t see it but interested then on YT search “The Delphi Murders: Anna Williams interview” its from 9/30/2020 so fairly recent.

 

[chaz]

County Sheriff answers double homicide questions from readers
February 17, 2021
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County Sheriff answers double homicide questions from readers | Carroll County Comet