Madeleine McCann general discussion thread #28

[Captain_Khan]

The dog does not behave differently from the beginning.. Only when it leaves the car and comes back.

I disagree. It bounds out of shot of the camera almost as soon as it reaches the side of the car where the scent is later found, and, perhaps tellingly, Grime lets it do it rather than calling it back right away. He can see the dog at this point, but we cannot due to the camera angle.

Thanks. I messaged Oriah to get her opinion I gave her a link to the dogs. Hopefully she can help us clarify it.
I always thought cadaver dogs alerted to dead bodies and not living people.

Would this handler also be able to give their opinion on Grime's handling technique? That could be very interesting. Thanks in advance.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I disagree. It bounds out of shot of the camera almost as soon as it reaches the side of the car where the scent is later found, and, perhaps tellingly, Grime lets it do it rather than calling it back right away. He can see the dog at this point, but we cannot due to the camera angle.



Would this handler also be able to give their opinion on Grime's handling technique? That could be very interesting. Thanks in advance.

That is not what I see. I see it sniff the car and then leave and move on.. Then it seems that he is called back. I hope that if Oriah can see this she can help us understand.

Since neither of us is dog handlers and can not really know just surmise.

 

[~n/t~]

Is anyone else having trouble with the board? It slow to refresh

 

[Captain_Khan]

That is not what I see. I see it sniff the car and then leave and move on.. Then it seems that he is called back. I hope that if Oriah can see this she can help us understand.

Since neither of us is dog handlers and can not really know just surmise.

But he also calls the dog back to the previous cars that it has 'moved on' from - repeatedly, and on almost every one. I agree that he spends longer on the McCann's car - but as I said before, that is AFTER the dog has displayed the body language that shows it has caught the scent.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

But he also calls the dog back to the previous cars that it has 'moved on' from - repeatedly, and on almost every one. I agree that he spends longer on the McCann's car - but as I said before, that is AFTER the dog has displayed the body language that shows it has caught the scent.

We will just have to agree to disagree.. I see it differently. IT is seems different to me.

 

[haden]

The basic difference between the dogs alerting to blood and alerting to cadaver is;
Keela (Human Blood) has been trained to freeze and pinpoint the area with her nose on the spot, where as Eddie (Cadaver detection) will stand & bark.

Martin Grimes' statement explains how they are trained to work.

What is the difference if they both alert on dried blood.

Their trainer said in his interview that they do.

The point of cadaver dog is to find the body. And Eddie did find some bodies in past.

But he also made a mistake in a very big case, Jersey child abuse case, where he pointed out at something which was wrongly identified as a child skull, and proved to be a coconut shell.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-abuse-probe-branded-20million-shambles.html

 

[~n/t~]

I disagree. It bounds out of shot of the camera almost as soon as it reaches the side of the car where the scent is later found, and, perhaps tellingly, Grime lets it do it rather than calling it back right away. He can see the dog at this point, but we cannot due to the camera angle.



Would this handler also be able to give their opinion on Grime's handling technique? That could be very interesting. Thanks in advance.

I'm pretty sure she can

 

[Donjeta]

Anyone got any idea why a dog handler would intentionally cue his dogs to alert on a key ring, the back of a sofa and the trunk of a car that was rented long after the disappearance?

Those are not sites that I would choose if I wanted to frame someone.

 

[Little Jedi]

Yes I did. There were fliers all over the car.

No there wasn't !!!!

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id161.html#aug3

 

[SapphireSteel]

Anyone got any idea why a dog handler would intentionally cue his dogs to alert on a key ring, the back of a sofa and the trunk of a car that was rented long after the disappearance?

Those are not sites that I would choose if I wanted to frame someone.

That's it in a nutshell.

Has someone tried to frame them?

If so, that "someone" is clearly the South Yorkshire police. PC Grime, Eddie and Keela were all members of that organisation.

So, how and why did the Brit police decide to frame them? That's a crime in and of itself. What was their motive for framing two British holiday makers who lost their daughter in a different country?

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

No there wasn't !!!!

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id161.html#aug3

UM yes there were. Look again.

All over the back windows..

 

[~n/t~]

Anyone got any idea why a dog handler would intentionally cue his dogs to alert on a key ring, the back of a sofa and the trunk of a car that was rented long after the disappearance?

Those are not sites that I would choose if I wanted to frame someone.

Exactly. The claims being made that grimes intentionally cued the dogs to the McCanns is ridiculous. I asked a similar question earlier. What motive would he have to frame the McCanns. Nonsense.

 

[SapphireSteel]

What is the difference if they both alert on dried blood.

Their trainer said in his interview that they do.

The point of cadaver dog is to find the body. And Eddie did find some bodies in past.

But he also made a mistake in a very big case, Jersey child abuse case, where he pointed out at something which was wrongly identified as a child skull, and proved to be a coconut shell.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-abuse-probe-branded-20million-shambles.html

Not the coconut shell again.

There were human remains found in that soil. Human remains can and do dissipate into the soil around them, as do other organic items like coconut shell. The shell was suspected to have human collagen on it.

The dogs got it right.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Not the coconut shell again.

There were human remains found in that soil. Human remains can and do dissipate into the soil around them, as do other organic items like coconut shell. The shell was suspected to have human collagen on it.

The dogs got it right.

I have not seen any back up on this and it sounds fishy to me. Of course all soil may have some decomp depending on where it is..

 

[Little Jedi]

Sniffer Dogs search the McCanns Hired Car - YouTube

And if you ask me there are things in it that make me uneasy about it.

The handler gets closer to the car, stands there longer..

It bothers me.

That is only a 5 min edited excerpt from the complete 2 hour 45 min video.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

That is only a 5 min edited excerpt from the complete 2 hour 45 min video.

It is the important part if you ask me.

 

[Inana]

What is there for sure is the dogs route, and this is very soon after Madeleine was found missing.. the dogs went straight out of the front door and all 4 dogs went to the car park.

IMO the car park should have been investigated thoroughly.. who parked there, who lived there, who was seen there. Maybe someone has seen something from their balcony but hasn't paid attention since the media attention never focused on the car park.

I've wondered at times if she wasn't simply taken into one of the apartments across the street adjacent to the car park. There is a quote from Silence of the Lambs "we begin by coveting what we see everyday." Casually watched from across the street all week.


Just my own opinion

 

[SapphireSteel]

The dog indicates. The handler notes the indication. The dog runs off looking for the next indicator.

Grime appeared to be "cueing" but what he actually was doing was making Eddie concentrate on alert 1 before haring off to look for alert 2.

They have a fairly short attention span as anyone would know who's tossed a dog a ball. Five times out of ten the dog looks away from the ball because something else has caught it's attention, a squealing kid or a chirping bird, and you have to say their name again to remind them there's a ball dangling right in front of them at which time they get all exited again like they'd never seen it before.

That's the way the man/dog relationship works. We have to guide them.

 

[Little Jedi]

To me it looks like the dog left the car and was moving on and the handler called him back. The odds the something DNA found in the belongings of the MCcanns is pretty good. I just don't like this.

Eddie alerts to *CADAVER* odour !!!

 

[gord]

Not the coconut shell again.

There were human remains found in that soil. Human remains can and do dissipate into the soil around them, as do other organic items like coconut shell. The shell was suspected to have human collagen on it.

The dogs got it right.

Human remains ? Are you sure ? Was this recent remains . I never heard anything about human remains. Have you got any link to the that ?

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