MN - George Floyd, unarmed man killed in police custody, Minneapolis, 25 May 2020

[Jackielee09]

Although it's hard to see, his hands were not in his pockets. His gloved hand was on his thigh.

I stand corrected.

 

[Gardenista]

Glad he has finally been charged. I hope he gets a decent sentence

Muhammad Noor only got 12.5 years, so don't hold your breath.

 

[Cubby]

Finally an arrest! Time will tell what else the investigation uncovers....

I hope the family also files a wrongful death lawsuit.

 

[kaen]

I am reading the 3rd degree definition from above. I have some questions.

From the post above:
a) Whoever, without intent to effect the death of any person, causes the death of another by perpetrating an act eminently dangerous to others and evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life, is guilty of murder in the third degree and may be sentenced to imprisonment for not more than 25 years.
https://www.revisor.mn.gov

Questions:

1.He has his knee on the neck. The man is asking for relief. The crowd is calling for relief. The man goes slack. The killer doesn't adjust, change position, get off Mr. Floyd, or turn Mr. Floyd over to give him the opportunity to breathe. Any reasonable person could see the man was in distress and not conscious. He rendered no aid. How is that not intent to kill?

2. What were they waiting for by keeping Mr. Floyd on the ground, under that knee for 7+ minutes? He was defenseless. Yes, he was a tall man but there were 4 cops. No cop asked for further back-up as far as I can tell. Show of force? Showing off for the rookies?

3. What is the training on that hold? How long can you jam your knee into the neck of a person before you cause their death? (I am not talking about embolisms or tears but more length of time.)

4. As Mr. Floyd is pleading for him to stop, the killer does not. As the pleas get more desperate, Mr. Floyd can not try to escape as there are three on him. How is it reasonable to think that continued lack of capacity for his lungs to breathe combined with cutting of his blood flood with the knee would not cause permanent damage or death?

I wonder why they are pursuing 3rd degree rather than a higher charge (I know that they can increase the charges).

 

[Betty P]

Seems like BS to me wrt intent, but probably the best call to make sure of a conviction.

Third-Degree Murder
Third-degree murder falls between manslaughter and third-degree murder charges. This murder is not based on having the intent to kill. Third-degree murder is often charged as a depraved heart or mind crime. This charge can arise when a person fires a gun in a crowd without intending to kill anyone, for example. Murder is charged when a person is killed and the defendant has an indifference to the sanctity of human life. This charge may also result if a person sells bad drugs. The maximum penalty for murder is up to 25 years in prison. If the death resulted because of a Schedule I or II drug sale, a fine of up to $40,000 may result.
https://www.hg.org/legal-articles/murder-charges-in-minnesota-43141

(a) Whoever, without intent to effect the death of any person, causes the death of another by perpetrating an act eminently dangerous to others and evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life, is guilty of murder in the third degree and may be sentenced to imprisonment for not more than 25 years.
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/609.185

Perhaps, but they shouldn't bargain any lower. He should be convicted of this and other charges and sentenced accordingly. He's a dangerous, depraved psycho, JMO. He should never serve as a LEO again.

 

[Gardenista]

I am reading the 3rd degree definition from above. I have some questions.

From the post above:
a) Whoever, without intent to effect the death of any person, causes the death of another by perpetrating an act eminently dangerous to others and evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life, is guilty of murder in the third degree and may be sentenced to imprisonment for not more than 25 years.
https://www.revisor.mn.gov

Questions:

1.He has his knee on the neck. The man is asking for relief. The crowd is calling for relief. The man goes slack. The killer doesn't adjust, change position, get off Mr. Floyd, or turn Mr. Floyd over to give him the opportunity to breathe. Any reasonable person could see the man was in distress and not conscious. He rendered no aid. How is that not intent to kill?

2. What were they waiting for by keeping Mr. Floyd on the ground, under that knee for 7+ minutes? He was defenseless. Yes, he was a tall man but there were 4 cops. No cop asked for further back-up as far as I can tell. Show of force? Showing off for the rookies?

3. What is the training on that hold? How long can you jam your knee into the neck of a person before you cause their death? (I am not talking about embolisms or tears but more length of time.)

4. As Mr. Floyd is pleading for him to stop, the killer does not. As the pleas get more desperate, Mr. Floyd can not try to escape as there are three on him. How is it reasonable to think that continued lack of capacity for his lungs to breathe combined with cutting of his blood flood with the knee would not cause permanent damage or death?

I wonder why they are pursuing 3rd degree rather than a higher charge (I know that they can increase the charges).

BBM
They probably feel they they couldn't get a conviction on anything higher. Imagine if they charge higher and he gets away with it, because they can't make a case for it.

 

[Dawookie]

Muhammad Noor only got 12.5 years, so don't hold your breath.

For the same charges Chauvin is facing. The maximum sentence that can be handed down is 25 years which I imagine they'll push for considering the difference between the two cases.

 

[Betty P]

Muhammad Noor only got 12.5 years, so don't hold your breath.

And that took a very long time. They covered up and refused to reveal so much information about that crime. It wasn't just a problem with Noor or the police union, the cover up was facilitated by the mayor and others higher up the chain of command. It was very disrespectful to the victim, her family and to the citizens who these people are supposed to serve.

 

[Gardenista]

For the same charges Chauvin is facing. The maximum sentence that can be handed down is 25 years which I imagine they'll push for considering the difference between the two cases.

No difference to me.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Not necessarily true.

https://mn.gov/commerce/industries/insurance/businesses/property-ins.jsp

From the link:

"There are three types of property insurance plans:

• Basic form, which includes losses resulting from a fire, lightning, windstorm, hail and explosion, plus the cost of removing property to protect it from further damage.
• Broad form, which includes basic plus extended coverage for other types of perils, such as a roof collapse (e.g. caused by snow or ice), riot and civil commotion, etc.
• Special form, which includes basic and broad, and covers all direct physical losses except conditions specifically excluded as listed in the policy."

Thank you.

So when purchasing insurance the business owners must buy coverage that specifically list riots?

Is it similar to homeowners who must buy extra flood insurance in order to be covered?

Tia.

 

[EstrellaEspectral]

I can't help but sit and wonder if these charges would have come today if it weren't for all the buildings burning last night. These charges should have come days ago and they should be more severe. Although I feel for all of those that were hurt or lost their businesses, I am glad their point was made. Black Lives Matter.

 

[Betty P]

For the same charges Chauvin is facing. The maximum sentence that can be handed down is 25 years which I imagine they'll push for considering the difference between the two cases.

It's just shocking that apparently nothing has changed in that city government or it's police department since Justine was brutally murdered. No lessons learned, no reform, no attempt to make LE treat citizens with more respect.

Maybe they need a judge or someone to step in and clean the place up.

 

[Dawookie]

No difference to me.

But the difference in the circumstances will matter to the judge. With Noor it could be argued that it happened in the spur of the moment with a huge lapse in judgement, where as with Chauvin, it's obvious it wasn't. He went way across the line by continuing to keep his knee on his neck.

 

[Sillybilly]

As per TOS, victim blaming has to stop.

IMO, there is nothing to indicate that Mr. Floyd even knew the bill he presented was counterfeit.

 

[Jackielee09]

I can't help but sit and wonder if these charges would have come today if it weren't for all the buildings burning last night. These charges should have come days ago and they should be more severe. Although I feel for all of those that were hurt or lost their businesses, I am glad their point was made. Black Lives Matter.

It wouldn’t have happened if no video.

 

[MsBetsy]

Here is the quote from the other poster: "Minority owned businesses who burned down or were looted last night are coming out in support today of the actions".

Again, it sounds like propaganda to me.

Still, it's hard to believe that only one minority business owner is supportive of the protesters. We don't know how many business owners were looted or had property damage. As I said, they can be both supportive of protesters and upset about the looters.

The majority of the citizens are outraged after witnessing an unarmed man being suffocated to death, no matter what their race.

So the point I was trying to make is it's understandable that people would consider the cost of damages being less important than the taking of a human life. I wasn't putting a number on how many business owners came out in support of the victim, how many are demanding change, or how many were affected. In any large city I would expect many people to respond, including business owners.

Imo

 

[kaen]

From Minneapolis Cop Derek Chauvin Arrested, Charged With Murder, Manslaughter In George Floyd Killing:

Freeman said Friday that his team moved quickly to gather evidence about the case and make a charging decision.

“By far the fastest we’ve ever charged a police officer,” he said. “Normally these cases can taken nine months to a year.”



Let's be real here. If it can take 9 months to a year to charge a cop, that is part of the problem right there. It is astounding that the DA's office has not made changes to that timeline in cop related killings or incidents. Create a timeline template, set goals, and assign resources. You can't say that this is an issue you care about (as the DA said yesterday) and not make a massive change.

Families of those killed by cops must be out of their minds by the time things get moving.

In this case, with a 7+ minute video and the Cup Foods video, I don't understand how he could see this as potentially taking months.

Rush to charge without backup would be unethical but, there is fairly clear evidence of the exact event.

In fairness, the DA's office clarified his horrifying statement yesterday about evidence leading to no criminal charges. But this man needs to get with the issues in the community and jump into the massive issue his community has with the police and their actions right quick.

 

[Gardenista]

But the difference in the circumstances will matter to the judge. With Noor it could be argued that it happened in the spur of the moment with a huge lapse in judgement, where as with Chauvin, it's obvious it wasn't. He went way across the line by continuing to keep his knee on his neck.

We'll have to agree to disagree.

 

[kaen]

No difference to me.

A major difference really is the video of the killing. I agree many that the Noor case was handled awfully.

In my post above the DA talks about the time it takes to charge and I believe that is a factor in justice as time dulls the public outrage, dulls witnesses and allows for omissions that are abominations.

 

[Gardenista]

A major difference really is the video of the killing. I agree many that the Noor case was handled awfully.

Yes, that is a difference, but I don't think having video makes it any worse.