NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - #13

[Raging Ranter]

I think too that her remains will be found not so far from the accident sight. Its very easy to lose your bearings in a forest, especially in the dark of night. I've walked into a forest in daylight, following a trail. I left the trail and walked several feet away. When I turned around to head back, I paused....no matter which direction I looked, everything appeared to look the same. I panicked. It took me a bit of time to find my way back to the trail. I intially headed in the wrong direction but luckily heard and saw other trail walkers. My point is...alone, dark, in a forest, no trail to follow, Maura could have headed in one direction thinking she was near the road when in fact she was heading deep into the forest range. To lose your bearings only takes a few moments and a few steps.

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Exactly. Add in confusion from alcohol, and it isn't a stretch to think she got lost, became hypothermic, and died. The weather wasn't particularly cold that day, but it did take a turn for the worse that night, and got much colder. Had she run off and become injured or exhausted in the woods, wearing light clothing and running shoes, she would not have lasted the night. Even mild hypothermia can cause confusion, which makes a bad situation worse. Add in alcohol, and you've got a very dangerous scenario, even if she were only a few hundred yards from the road. Her demise could have happened within hours. \

Of course, I could be entirely wrong. I simply think that is the most likely scenario. There is the possibility that she never entered the woods. If so, the only reasonable alternative explanation for her disappearing so quickly before the police got there is that she was picked up by someone. A stranger. Or someone she knew. My problem with that theory is that she refused help from the bus driver. Despite being a large individual, B.A. was driving a school bus, which I would think would have made him appear somewhat less threatening compared to a random stranger in a regular car. If she refused his help, why then jump into the car of the first stranger that comes along? That makes little sense. But then, not much Maura did that day makes any sense. I suppose that's why some people insist that she was being followed by someone she knew in a second car. But where were they when the accident happened? And who? There's no sign of such a person to this day.

Every possible scenario (and they are all possible) keeps bringing me back to the "she's in the woods within a mile of the car" explanation. It's the most plausible to me.

 

[Raging Ranter]

No. I think only the box of wine - and the fact that she took all the rest with her - on foot - is what gives rise to the thought there was a tandem car. If she's leaving on foot to hide from the cops it does seem a little odd that she'd carry so much heavy liquid with her.

But after all this time and evidence, I still think what I believed early on. She left the vehicle on foot, went into the woods somewhere and froze to death and has not yet been found. The most compelling evidence for that, to me, is that her cell phone never re-entered a zone where it could receive service. This was back in the day where people didn't really know to ditch a cell phone so you won't be tracked - yet her cell phone last worked at around 5 that afternoon, then she drove into an area without cell service, and then her phone never again was within range of cell service. It's somewhere in the local area where she got out of the wrecked car.

That's something I never considered before. And yes, it does add more weight to the idea that she never got far from the accident scene. But I wouldn't say cellphone tracking wasn't widely known back then. By 2004, many high profile cases had been solved where cellphone tower "hits" played a role in the investigation. A predator who'd done any thinking would know to take her cellphone and turn it off immediately. But I agree it is one more thing pointing in the direction of her remaining in the area and perishing close by.

 

[Raging Ranter]

That's the first time I've heard her father told her to do that. In the People article written several years ago, (I think that's where I read it) they mentioned the rag in the tailpipe, and postulated that it was placed there a short time ago while she was stopped for gas. The article also stated the car wouldn't be drivable long with that rag in there - it would soon be inoperable.

Do you have a source for her father telling her to do that? I've spent some time researching clogs in tailpipes, and it used to be done with a potato as a joke - suddenly, the car would stall and the person driving would have a bummer of a day. I didn't think ANYONE would think it was a positive thing to tell their daughter to do.

Agreed, and pretty much everyone has seen Beverly Hills Cop, where Eddie Murphy prevented the LA cops from tailing him by stuffing bananas in their tailpipe. I believe the scene in that movie is where the gag of stuffing potatoes in tailpipes originated, or at least what made it a well-known - if not widely practiced - practical joke. Her Dad's explanation made no sense, since a rag would have prevented it from running at all. I believe her dad may have said that to divert talk away from a possible suicide attempt. Some investigators did believe she was suicidal, and that the rag was a clumsy attempt to commit suicide via CO poisoning, and I think, for whatever reason, he was really trying to dissuade that line of thinking among LE.

 

[Raging Ranter]

I've had a chance to give this some thought and have come to believe that she is not around the crash site. After living in the woods for many years, I can tell you that when animals, or people walk through the snow they leave tracks/footprints and or other evidence of being there.

People that live in these climates are very good at tracking, so if she wandered in to the woods around the crash site it would have been evident. Not to mention by this time at least her backpack and other belongings would have been found.

I too spent many years living in rural areas, and spent my youth in the woods hunting deer, rabbit and grouse. I also spent time in the woods near my home looking for lost pets (dogs and cats, which tend to disappear in rural areas, usually because some *advertiser censored**hole shot them). And I disagree completely. While it can be easy to discern where someone ran off the road and into the woods, that requires snow that soft and fairly fresh. Old snow, hard pack, and game trails can sometimes be traversed without leaving a mark. If she ran a ways down the road and then found a well used deer trail, she could have jogged down that trail and her own tracks would have been almost impossible to detect. In any rural setting, a lot of local yokels will tend to brag of their tracking ability, but the reality of rural life is that very few if any practice tracking anymore. There's seldom a need to develop that skill. Even hunters generally don't bother with "tracking" anymore. Unless they wound an animal, and then it's just a matter of following the blood trail. Years later, they will brag over a few beers of their tracking prowess, and that time they tracked a deer three miles through the woods.

 

[Caffeine]

Agreed, and pretty much everyone has seen Beverly Hills Cop, where Eddie Murphy prevented the LA cops from tailing him by stuffing bananas in their tailpipe. I believe the scene in that movie is where the gag of stuffing potatoes in tailpipes originated, or at least what made it a well-known - if not widely practiced - practical joke. Her Dad's explanation made no sense, since a rag would have prevented it from running at all. I believe her dad may have said that to divert talk away from a possible suicide attempt. Some investigators did believe she was suicidal, and that the rag was a clumsy attempt to commit suicide via CO poisoning, and I think, for whatever reason, he was really trying to dissuade that line of thinking among LE.

I think it ultimately depends on the size of the rag. Would a 6 inch by 6 inch rag effectively block an exhaust? I dunno. It's not as solid as a potato etc so I'm not entirely sure. I wouldn't be surprised if the back pressure of the exhaust worked it loose.

Generally a muffler tip is a few inches long and maybe a an inch or two in diameter. A rag will breathe to some extent depending on the thickness, but ultimately I guess it comes down to size of the rag.

However, if it ended up being pushed beyond the tip into the actual muffler, inside is obviously a lot larger and would be less restrictive so in that case I don't think the car would be effected...Unless we're talking a towel sized piece of fabric.

 

[Skigirl]

Exactly. Add in confusion from alcohol, and it isn't a stretch to think she got lost, became hypothermic, and died. The weather wasn't particularly cold that day, but it did take a turn for the worse that night, and got much colder. Had she run off and become injured or exhausted in the woods, wearing light clothing and running shoes, she would not have lasted the night. Even mild hypothermia can cause confusion, which makes a bad situation worse. Add in alcohol, and you've got a very dangerous scenario, even if she were only a few hundred yards from the road. Her demise could have happened within hours. \

Of course, I could be entirely wrong. I simply think that is the most likely scenario. There is the possibility that she never entered the woods. If so, the only reasonable alternative explanation for her disappearing so quickly before the police got there is that she was picked up by someone. A stranger. Or someone she knew. My problem with that theory is that she refused help from the bus driver. Despite being a large individual, B.A. was driving a school bus, which I would think would have made him appear somewhat less threatening compared to a random stranger in a regular car. If she refused his help, why then jump into the car of the first stranger that comes along? That makes little sense. But then, not much Maura did that day makes any sense. I suppose that's why some people insist that she was being followed by someone she knew in a second car. But where were they when the accident happened? And who? There's no sign of such a person to this day.

Every possible scenario (and they are all possible) keeps bringing me back to the "she's in the woods within a mile of the car" explanation. It's the most plausible to me.

There are only reasons I can think of that could explain her not getting into a school bus but then accepting a ride from someone else: 1) she might have been afraid that a school bus driver in a small town would be friendly with police and would insist on calling them, 2) Have you ever seen a picture of that bus driver? He may have been a nice guy/don't judge a book by its cover, etc., but I would have found him intimidating. She may have turned him down, and then after shivering in the cold for a bit, thought, "oh gee, I really should have taken that ride..." and then accepted the next offer.

I just can't really get behind the idea of a tandem driver. Why would they have been driving in tandem? Why not just take one car? And a car accident really cannot have been part of some grand plan for her to disappear, so why wouldn't her tandem driver friend and her have gone back for the car after she sobered up since the police wouldn't have been able to prove a DUI at that point. It just seems too far-fetched and doesn't do any better a job of explaining the fact that she's missing than any of the simpler explanations.

 

[ghost story]

I've been on the side of those who think Maura is relatively near the accident scene and likely died of exposure. I'm not entirely sure of how much effort has been put into finding her body near the accident site, but I would think that would be where I would be directing my efforts if I was the family. I know it's been years since Maura disappeared but with metal detectors and a grid search I think there might be some chance of success finding her. It might take several summers, and time from volunteers, but I'd direct my energies there.

 

[Marisa714]

It's no wonder there are so many rabbit trails in this case, Maura was behaving very strangely and had lots or secrets. Details I find most bizarre:

The phone call with her sister Kathleen that left her in tears, her supervisor found her staring into space / zoned out, mumbling something about "my sister".

Stealing credit cards.

Cheating on her BF.

Drinking and drinking and drinking.

Crashing cars.

Seemingly paranoid behavior.

Sneaking around, hiding things from even those closest to her.

Dorm full of packed boxes.

Why did this otherwise intelligent high achiever begin to display such disorganized, erratic behavior, and poor decision making?

Eating disorder.

Her "friends" refusing to talk.
****************************************

She decided to leave town to clear her head, but her budding alcoholism naturally muddied the situation even further, leading to another car crash. She panicked and fled. I did wonder if she may have learned she was pregnant (that will cause foggy thinking and cluttered headspace) but birth control pills were packed with her belongings. I think Maura's own secretive behaviors led to a downward spiral and have caused her case to remain unsolved, simply because there are too many possibilities. She seemed suicidal. She was not in a good place for a lot of reasons. Had she opened up more about what she was up to, perhaps her family would have answers.

Given -7 degree temps and heavy snow that night, combined with alcohol, I believe she succumbed to hypothermia. Maybe she hitched a ride. Either way, she is no longer alive. IMO

BBM, it's been a long time since I've posted about this case, Maura's case is the one that bothers me the most. I wonder if her "zoning out" could have possibly been a seizure (absence seizure), if she were having multiple seizures a day it could affect her judgement, especially if she were on anti epileptic drugs which can seriously alter behavior, depending on which medication you're prescribed.

IIRC no one has been able to prove that she was drinking the day she crashed her car. IIRC she had open bottles, partially emptied, however that may have been from some other day. Also, sometimes absence seizures aren't the easiest to diagnose and can take a long time to diagnose because they don't look like a seizure that everyone is familiar with.

Bear in mind this is just a theory. I wonder if she could have had a seizure while driving (assuming she knew about them) and didn't want help because a) she was not supposed to be driving due to previous seizures or b) she had a minor or more severe seizure and her judgement was seriously altered. Sometimes you can become very scared and behave abnormally. For some people, alcohol can be a trigger for their seizures. Again, just a theory and I'm not sure if this has been explored or not. I know there's so much more to take into account and this probably isn't what happened, but I wanted to share my thoughts anyway.

 

[Skigirl]

BBM, it's been a long time since I've posted about this case, Maura's case is the one that bothers me the most. I wonder if her "zoning out" could have possibly been a seizure (absence seizure), if she were having multiple seizures a day it could affect her judgement, especially if she were on anti epileptic drugs which can seriously alter behavior, depending on which medication you're prescribed.

IIRC no one has been able to prove that she was drinking the day she crashed her car. IIRC she had open bottles, partially emptied, however that may have been from some other day. Also, sometimes absence seizures aren't the easiest to diagnose and can take a long time to diagnose because they don't look like a seizure that everyone is familiar with.

Bear in mind this is just a theory. I wonder if she could have had a seizure while driving (assuming she knew about them) and didn't want help because a) she was not supposed to be driving due to previous seizures or b) she had a minor or more severe seizure and her judgement was seriously altered. Sometimes you can become very scared and behave abnormally. For some people, alcohol can be a trigger for their seizures. Again, just a theory and I'm not sure if this has been explored or not. I know there's so much more to take into account and this probably isn't what happened, but I wanted to share my thoughts anyway.

BBM. Which crash are you talking about? The one in which she crashed her father's car and was let go by police without a sobriety test, or the crash that led to her disappearance? IIRC, in the case of the latter, there was wine spilled and splattered around the vehicle and a cup with wine residual inside the vehicle, so it seems pretty likely she'd been drinking.

 

[Marisa714]

BBM. Which crash are you talking about? The one in which she crashed her father's car and was let go by police without a sobriety test, or the crash that led to her disappearance? IIRC, in the case of the latter, there was wine spilled and splattered around the vehicle and a cup with wine residual inside the vehicle, so it seems pretty likely she'd been drinking.

I was referring to the crash that led to her disappearance. While I do remember reading there was wine spilled and splattered around her vehicle but I don't recall reading about a wine glass with residual wine in the cup. Do you happen to have a link to this information?
TIA

 

[Skigirl]

I was referring to the crash that led to her disappearance. While I do remember reading there was wine spilled and splattered around her vehicle but I don't recall reading about a wine glass with residual wine in the cup. Do you happen to have a link to this information?
TIA

Here you go: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7_atAFvowRhT2hNLUd2UVlUc1U/view

It was a coke bottle with "red liquid" with a strong alcoholic odor.

 

[Caffeine]

Here you go: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7_atAFvowRhT2hNLUd2UVlUc1U/view

It was a coke bottle with "red liquid" with a strong alcoholic odor.

The wine may have not even been opened, rather just damaged in the accident and leaking. I've always thought the soda bottle with the alcohol odor was likely spiked with Vodka or something else. I can't imagine wine as a mixer for most, especially a college student.

 

[Skigirl]

The wine may have not even been opened, rather just damaged in the accident and leaking. I've always thought the soda bottle with the alcohol odor was likely spiked with Vodka or something else. I can't imagine wine as a mixer for most, especially a college student.

The beverage in the coke bottle was red, same color as the wine found around the car. Seems that the simplest explanation is that she bought a box of wine and decanted some of it into the coke bottle. Of course, maybe it was something else, but it seems clear to me that she was drinking.

 

[DakotaMayi]

13 years today, Maura. :frown:

 

[DakotaMayi]

So it's been 13 years and a few days now and while the 13 year mark passed, it is so so nice to see that Maura is still at the front of everyone's minds. (I am apart of a lot of missing groups on social media) and the amount of posts/balloon releases/ events held for Maura was nice to see. I hope she knows so many people care.

 

[Caffeine]

Hopefully this will be the year.

I think in order to make progress here we really need an outside agency to take a look at this. It's pretty clear the state of NH and any other participating bureaus have exhausted all leads and hit a dead end....avenues they felt were not worth exploring need to be examined, people need to be interviewed again; basically we need to start at square one again.

A good start would be to try and definitively exclude the idea she died nearby in the woods. While the notion is certainly plausible, I think that needs to be ruled out as best as possible before this case can move anywhere.

It's a daunting task but we have to narrow down the outcomes here if possible.

 

[armywife210]

The beverage in the coke bottle was red, same color as the wine found around the car. Seems that the simplest explanation is that she bought a box of wine and decanted some of it into the coke bottle. Of course, maybe it was something else, but it seems clear to me that she was drinking.

It seems just as simple and likely to me that the bottle had red coolant in it. Winter coolant smells like alcohol. Having problems with a car overheating might cause me to have some extra coolant in my car. It could be that the coolant wasn't actually hers, but when discussing her car troubles with a friend, maybe she dispensed some into a coke bottle for Maura in case of emergencies. It's just another angle that makes sense, at least to me.


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[DakotaMayi]

Hopefully this will be the year.

I think in order to make progress here we really need an outside agency to take a look at this. It's pretty clear the state of NH and any other participating bureaus have exhausted all leads and hit a dead end....avenues they felt were not worth exploring need to be examined, people need to be interviewed again; basically we need to start at square one again.

A good start would be to try and definitively exclude the idea she died nearby in the woods. While the notion is certainly plausible, I think that needs to be ruled out as best as possible before this case can move anywhere.

It's a daunting task but we have to narrow down the outcomes here if possible.

:goodpost:

BBM... Yes, once (if) that avenue can be excluded the case can go wide open into a lot of different directions.

Does anyone here know if Fred has any outside agencies on this or has previously?

 

[Caffeine]

:goodpost:

BBM... Yes, once (if) that avenue can be excluded the case can go wide open into a lot of different directions.

Does anyone here know if Fred has any outside agencies on this or has previously?

As far as searches, I believe the state organized the original search via ground and air. Years later, a team of NH private investigators did a pro Bono search, once maybe twice.

So it appears the area has been well searched, but we truly don't know exactly how well or exactly how far they went.

After this many years have passed you start to lose hope that they missed something, but you never know.

 

[DakotaMayi]

Going to work on a flyer for Maura at Missing Pieces Network. Get her picture circling again. This just has to be the year