NV - 59 Dead, over 500 injured in Mandalay Bay shooting in Las Vegas, 1 Oct 2017 #8

Status
Not open for further replies.
Yes, so if he gambled to ease his troubles what exactly gave him solace - the gambling or was it the winning? I think it was the winning, the prestige, the distinction, the recognition "worlds greatest video poker player", etc.

So if his success at winning diminished, much like drug withdrawal, would that cause his troubles to surface?

Rumour only but I've noticed speculation that odds on video poker have been decreased over time. I also recall speculation that SP sold one of his houses (in 2016?) in order to finance his weapons. If so, that would indicate that he had run out of excess cash and was also at a point where he was selling assets to fund his gambling.
He would have received the solace from concentrating that part of his mind.. the maths. part.. channeling all his attention into beating this dice.. It merely rested him.. from something unknown..
I believe he was comfortably off when he died.. no debts..
There is no evidence he was losing badly on the tables. (saw reputable source report yesterday, thats what am citing, I posted it here in relation to another matter)

He was in good stead with the casino.. the article was claiming there was no evidence or reason for him to have had a grievance against the hotel.
But, his previous career as building manager in his own apartments.. people speculated he would not hire someone because he was afraid to pay wages.. but maybe it was from a similar mental need.. to control..
the game was always to seek control.. of the odds, of his environment, of everything he touched.. he liked to wear gloves to 'protect his hands'- from what?
Perhaps impulse control was a lifelong problem for him and he had learnt behaviours in an effort to control them?
Did he ever loosen up, chill out, laugh...?
 
He would have received the solace from concentrating that part of his mind.. the maths. part.. channeling all his attention into beating this dice.. It merely rested him.. from something unknown..
I believe he was comfortably off when he died.. no debts..
There is no evidence he was losing badly on the tables. (saw reputable source report yesterday, thats what am citing, I posted it here in relation to another matter)

He was in good stead with the casino.. the article was claiming there was no evidence or reason for him to have had a grievance against the hotel.
But, his previous career as building manager in his own apartments.. people speculated he would not hire someone because he was afraid to pay wages.. but maybe it was from a similar mental need.. to control..
the game was always to seek control.. of the odds, of his environment, of everything he touched.. he liked to wear gloves to 'protect his hands'- from what?
Perhaps impulse control was a lifelong problem for him and he had learnt behaviours in an effort to control them?
Did he ever loosen up, chill out, laugh...?

I agree, plunking money into a machine expecting it to spit it all back or more might indeed have given him a sense of control, as shallow as it seems.

It appeared SP's gambling habits were to frequent various casinos as at one time, according to his brother Eric, he had top star status at several of them. But the CEO of Wynn Resorts stated SP was not a winner at his hotel in a news report that I linked earlier today. A gradual downhill slide?

I don't think someone who has gambled intensively for 20 years would necessarily go into debt before noticing that on the long term, their losses were exceeding their winnings. If he was considered a cheap tipper and given his accounting background it's easy to imagine he also complied statistics of every cent that passed through his hands while gambling. Those records would indicate an upward or downward trend. If the hard drive of the laptop was destroyed, I'd further speculate it contained all his life's gambling records and he did it a rage to destroy the visible evidence of what he perceived to be evidence of his failure.

I don't think SPs actions were indicative of a vendetta against any one hotel. MB and it's location overlooking the festival was merely an opportunity for him to execute mass killings in his drive to be "biggest" once again.

JMO

ETA: not to be cynical but "in good stead with the casino.." means to me that he was losing more than he was winning. Casinos would go broke if the odds were in favour of people winning.
 
Travel to Mexico:
"Campos, who has had trouble sleeping since the shooting, left Las Vegas for Mexico on Oct. 6 to spend time with family members there and returned the evening of Oct. 8, Flansburg said. Campos returned to an MGM property when he came back and was still being housed by the company as of Thursday afternoon."


MGM paying for hotel stay for Las Vegas shooting witness Jesus Campos

http://redirect.viglink.com/?format...www.reviewjournal.com/crime/...-jesus-campos/
 
Travel to Mexico:
"Campos, who has had trouble sleeping since the shooting, left Las Vegas for Mexico on Oct. 6 to spend time with family members there and returned the evening of Oct. 8, Flansburg said. Campos returned to an MGM property when he came back and was still being housed by the company as of Thursday afternoon."


MGM paying for hotel stay for Las Vegas shooting witness Jesus Campos

http://redirect.viglink.com/?format...www.reviewjournal.com/crime/...-jesus-campos/

Good. I hope they can keep him safe.
 
The father was not actually a psychopath.. The NYT published his psychiatrist's report a few days or weeks ago.. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/13/us/stephen-paddock-father-vegas.html?_r=0
For years after Mr. Paddock was arrested, his sons were told he was dead. Later they learned the truth and some visited him, his son Eric Paddock said, but none seemed to form a close relationship.


The authorities have not said what they know about the convict’s relationship with Stephen Paddock.

Here's the psych evaluation https://www.nytimes.com/interactive...nix-Criminal-15713-Governments-Exhibit-1.html
It concluded he had 'no mental disease or defect in this relatively bright individual'
he described him as having a 'sociopathic personality'

Thats a lot different.
Likewise I think we're too hasty to diagnose SP as a psychopath..
Sure , it could be descrcibed as the the action of a psychopath, but it could also have been the action of a terrorist, a competing syndicate, almost any manner of things.
Are we not limiting discussion by pegging his mental state without adequate information.
All we know is that he occasionally took some valium..
there might be a lot more to him than meets the eye..



https://www.google.com/amp/www.medi...path-not-much-one-might-kill-you-270694?amp=1

Sociopathy, while severely the less understood of the two disorders, can be congenital or acquired. Psychopathy, meanwhile, is generally considered a confluence of genetic and chemical imbalances. Psychopaths lack the proper neurological frameworks to develop a sense of ethics and morality. Sociopaths interact with their social worlds in a meaningful way, but their moral compasses needed a massive tune-up yesterday.

ETA: I only posted this here because I found it interesting, as I wasn't aware of this particular distinction. I agree we should never be hasty to label anyone a psychopath or sociopath. With that said, I can't imagine how someone could singlehandedly orchestrate such a heartless attack on so many innocent people and NOT be a psychopath.
 
He would have received the solace from concentrating that part of his mind.. the maths. part.. channeling all his attention into beating this dice.. It merely rested him.. from something unknown..
I believe he was comfortably off when he died.. no debts..
There is no evidence he was losing badly on the tables. (saw reputable source report yesterday, thats what am citing, I posted it here in relation to another matter)

He was in good stead with the casino.. the article was claiming there was no evidence or reason for him to have had a grievance against the hotel.
But, his previous career as building manager in his own apartments.. people speculated he would not hire someone because he was afraid to pay wages.. but maybe it was from a similar mental need.. to control..
the game was always to seek control.. of the odds, of his environment, of everything he touched.. he liked to wear gloves to 'protect his hands'- from what?
Perhaps impulse control was a lifelong problem for him and he had learnt behaviours in an effort to control them?
Did he ever loosen up, chill out, laugh...?

IMO I believe the glove-wearing was just another manisfestation of his OCD, just as some weirdos wash their hands
50 times a day or after touching someone or something. Similar to germaphobe but more intense.
 
Regarding LE response, searching for the source/s of gunfire, JC getting shot at on the 32nd floor, something to contemplate....

The question could be asked, so why didn't LE race up to the 32nd floor and snuff out the shooter to prevent or mitigate the attack?

Once the shooting of the crowd began almost immediately, EVEN IF they were aware a security guard had been shot through the door, what would be the priority of LE? To check out a matter of an internal shooter or to determine where the gunman/s was located who was shooting at the crowd?

I don't think LE could automatically assume the internal shooter on the 32nd floor was the sniper/s who was shooting at the crowd. If a group was involved, unknown at the time, an internal shooter could've merely been a decoy to attract the attention of LE away from the sniper/s with intent of shooting down the responding officers to the 32nd floor. By SP blatantly shooting at JC through the door, in a situation of multiple gunman it does give the appearance of an act intended to misdirect LE response.

Going by the scanner, LE tracked the source of the sniper shooting into the crowd independently and only at that point did LE learn it was one and the same shooter who shot at JC in the hallway.

JMO when erasing everything that was later learned, that early response by LE seems logical to me.

Agree. If it was an active shooter they would have tried to stop him right then. No gun fire heard, treat it as a barricade situation.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
https://www.google.com/amp/www.medi...path-not-much-one-might-kill-you-270694?amp=1

Sociopathy, while severely the less understood of the two disorders, can be congenital or acquired. Psychopathy, meanwhile, is generally considered a confluence of genetic and chemical imbalances. Psychopaths lack the proper neurological frameworks to develop a sense of ethics and morality. Sociopaths interact with their social worlds in a meaningful way, but their moral compasses needed a massive tune-up yesterday.

ETA: I only posted this here because I found it interesting, as I wasn't aware of this particular distinction. I agree we should never be hasty to label anyone a psychopath or sociopath. With that said, I can't imagine how someone could singlehandedly orchestrate such a heartless attack on so many innocent people and NOT be a psychopath.

He was not diagnosed a sociopath.. He was described as per the report. Its a question of understanding what psychiatrist meant by his words 'a sociopathic personality'
in 1960.
[FONT=&quot]Antisocial personality disorder is defined by a pattern of socially irresponsible, exploitative, and guiltless behaviour.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]1[/FONT][FONT=&quot] Symptoms include failure to conform to law, failure to sustain consistent employment, manipulation of others for personal gain, deception of others, and failure to develop stable interpersonal relationships.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]2[/FONT][FONT=&quot] Lifetime prevalence for ASPD is reported to range from 2% to 4% in men and from 0.5% to 1% in women.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]3[/FONT][FONT=&quot],[/FONT][FONT=&quot]4[/FONT][FONT=&quot] Prevalence peaks in people age 24 to 44 years and drops off in people 45 to 64 years.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]5[/FONT][FONT=&quot] The male-to-female ratio is estimated at between 2:1 and 6:1, depending on assessment method and sample characteristics.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]6[/FONT][FONT=&quot] The prevalence of ASPD varies with the setting but can reach 80% in correctional settings.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]7[/FONT][FONT=&quot],[/FONT][FONT=&quot]8 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4500180/

This is what is interesting
ASPD is a predictor of poor treatment response. ASPD begins early in life, usually by age 8 years. Diagnosed as conduct disorder in childhood, the diagnosis converts to ASPD at age 18 if antisocial behaviours have persisted. While chronic and lifelong for most people with ASPD, the disorder tends to improve with advancing age. Earlier onset is associated with a poorer prognosis. Other moderating factors include marriage, employment, early incarceration (or adjudication during childhood), and degree of socialization.

Both Black et al28,30 and Robins19 found that a sizable percentage of people with ASPD improve or remit with advancing age. This finding is consistent with crime statistics, which show that

The definition of ASPD has evolved, complicating the interpretation of findings in early studies.
Our psychiatrist possibly worked from these paradigms
[h=2]Early Studies: The Gluecks and Robins[/h]Research conducted in the 1940s and 1950s by Robins19 at Washington University in St Louis, and by the Gluecks (see Glueck and Glueck25) at Harvard, independently showed the continuity between adult and childhood behavioural problems. The work of these researchers later influenced the diagnostic criteria for ASPD in DSM-III.26
[/FONT]
 
https://www.google.com/amp/www.medi...path-not-much-one-might-kill-you-270694?amp=1

Sociopathy, while severely the less understood of the two disorders, can be congenital or acquired. Psychopathy, meanwhile, is generally considered a confluence of genetic and chemical imbalances. Psychopaths lack the proper neurological frameworks to develop a sense of ethics and morality. Sociopaths interact with their social worlds in a meaningful way, but their moral compasses needed a massive tune-up yesterday.

ETA: I only posted this here because I found it interesting, as I wasn't aware of this particular distinction. I agree we should never be hasty to label anyone a psychopath or sociopath. With that said, I can't imagine how someone could singlehandedly orchestrate such a heartless attack on so many innocent people and NOT be a psychopath.

I'm replying to my original post to add a direct link - the link originally posted appears to be broken.

http://www.medicaldaily.com/whats-d...psychopath-not-much-one-might-kill-you-270694
 
Not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but audio of JC calling in to report shots fired has just been released.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/las-vegas-shooting-audio-security-officer-jesus-campos/story?id=50758967

Edited to add: It would've been nice if we had also learned what time the call was made..

Interesting. Thanks for the link. You can clearly hear him saying shots were fired and the specific room number. You can hear the gunfire in the background. Odd that MGM gave the tape to ABC News, but refused to say what time JC called in the report.

Considering you can hear gunfire in the background, the call probably was probably just after JC was shot at and hid in the doorway down the hall, just as JC claimed.
 
http://www.independent.co.uk/life-s...searches-history-motive-victims-a8021971.html

i'm having a problem with this part
[FONT=&quot]Investigators suspect gunman removed the hard drive from the laptop after opened fire from his high-rise suite at the Mandalay Bay hotel-casino into a crowd at a country music concert, killing 58 people and wounded hundreds of others, an official told the Associated Press. [/FONT]

I read this before and I dont understand what it means or how they could have deduced he removed hard drive aFTER he had started shooting.??
 
I think its a pretty major problem, worldwide and I agree its an addiction that takes absolutely everything away.
With Paddock, though I am seeing it more like an OCD manifestation..
Something he did in order to calm some aspect of his brain.. like a distraction type therapy.
Did he take pleasure in it or was he merely driven by some need to focus an aspect of his mind in an effort to forestall more unpleasant thoughts or memories..
Did he drive it or did the gambling drive him?
He was in excellent status with MB hotel and he had even been gambling on the weekend of the massacre..
I'm thinking now that he was a troubled man.. the gambling eased it for a time, perhaps.
But there is no indication he ever gambled in a frenzied way, as one does when in an addiction.
he gambled, he won, he lost- no big deal, either way.
He paid all his debts- casino debts, before he killed so many people..
His final action was not a gamble at all.
so many paradoxes... too many..

He was a control-freak. He liked to control and manipulate people and things in his environment, JMO. It gave him that sense of superiority that he craved. With his tricks and algorithms, he convinced himself that he could control the gambling games he played, calculating his risk to the last decimal. He had little or no concern about how his activities affected others - they were just tools to him to get what he wanted - money, sex, food, etc. Perhaps came from his environment growing up - that overpowering desire to control everything and everyone around him.

At some level, when controlling his environment no longer gave him the satisfaction it once did, his guard was down and he began to fantasize about the ultimate control - taking the lives of others. Taking someone's life is the ultimate act of control, of bending another to your will, of exercising the ultimate power move. He killed all those people because he enjoyed it. He enjoyed planning and executing the plan. He hoped to get away with it so he could do it again. When he knew police would capture him, he took his own life - his last act of controlling his life, his environment.

There are many killers who have the same need for power and control. It's a common motivator for rapists and killers.
 
He was a control-freak. He liked to control and manipulate people and things in his environment, JMO. It gave him that sense of superiority that he craved. With his tricks and algorithms, he convinced himself that he could control the gambling games he played, calculating his risk to the last decimal. He had little or no concern about how his activities affected others - they were just tools to him to get what he wanted - money, sex, food, etc. Perhaps came from his environment growing up - that overpowering desire to control everything and everyone around him.

At some level, when controlling his environment no longer gave him the satisfaction it once did, his guard was down and he began to fantasize about the ultimate control - taking the lives of others. Taking someone's life is the ultimate act of control, of bending another to your will, of exercising the ultimate power move. He killed all those people because he enjoyed it. He enjoyed planning and executing the plan. He hoped to get away with it so he could do it again. When he knew police would capture him, he took his own life - his last act of controlling his life, his environment.

There are many killers who have the same need for power and control. It's a common motivator for rapists and killers.
Wow betty, just WOW.
You have absolutely nailed it!
That was the game, wasn't it?
The only game, the ultimate game!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
81
Guests online
3,776
Total visitors
3,857

Forum statistics

Threads
592,548
Messages
17,970,793
Members
228,806
Latest member
Linnymac68$
Back
Top