President Obama commutes sentence of Chelsea Manning

[flourish]

youre absolutely right and I apologize.
I shouldn't have said it. If I could delete it i would.

That's the most refreshing post I've read in months. [emoji111]

 

[Rott Mom]

9

Me too Tulessa...What has happened to this world? She is a traitor...My husband served 32 years in the Navy and I cannot understand why this act of treason is excusable! So true what the Good Book says...that there will come a time when wrong is thought of as being right and right is considered wrong...We are there! I could say a lot more about the past 8 years and what it has done to our country, but I guess I'll just be quiet and move on....

ETA: Guess I didn't sit on my hands...Mods delete if necessary...Just wanted another viewpoint expressed.

God Bless You & Your Husband...this just sickens me. This is way too wrong. I'm totally with you, mods please delete if you feel you have the need to. As I understand it - he/she gets released this May. WOW! What a joke. God Save America!

 

[La Louve]

Manning's sentence was commuted. She wasn't pardoned. There's a big difference.

Personally, I'm happy with this outcome.

 

[human]

So sad. The innocent children and civilians killed. Chelsea could not stomach it.

 

[teedie2]

This thread sounds "political" to me.

 

[Elley Mae]

She was a whistleblower . She served way more of a sentence than others.

Whistle blower or Traitor?

bbm not true. Link below.

She was sentence to 35 yrs, he/she did not serve more then others.

bbm Two different things/meanings.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_imprisoned_spies

................................



In 2010, Chelsea (formerly Bradley) Manning, the United States Army Private First Class accused of the largest leak of state secrets in U.S. history, was charged under Article 134 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice, which incorporates parts of the Espionage Act 18 U.S.C. § 793(e). At the time, critics worried that the broad language of the Act could make news organizations, and anyone who reported, printed or disseminated information from WikiLeaks, subject to prosecution, although former prosecutors pushed back, citing Supreme Court precedent expanding First Amendment protections.[103] On July 30, 2013, following a judge-only trial by court-martial lasting eight weeks, Army judge Colonel Denise Lind convicted Manning on six counts of violating the Espionage Act, among other infractions.[98]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Espionage_Act_of_1917

bbm

This was not a pardon.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pardon

A pardon is a government decision to allow a person who has been convicted of a crime to be free and absolved of that conviction, as if never convicted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commutation_(law)

Commutation is a substitution of the penalty for a crime with the penalty for another, whilst still remaining guilty of the original crime.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

Ack, she didn't do anything any of the rest of them didn't do, and took her instructions from predecessors like Colin Powell. There was never any "there" there. If Bush/Cheney/Powell/Rice/Sessions aren't getting into trouble for their dirty deeds with their emails, there are certainly no grounds for Clinton to be punished for using the wrong server. Clinton was swift boated. Snowden, on the other hand...a much murkier case. As for Chelsea Manning, she was much more of a whistleblower than she ever was a traitor.

https://www.google.com/amp/nypost.c...r-maid-to-print-out-classified-materials/amp/

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[Elley Mae]

JMO I don't see her life being better out of prison, I can't imagine who or what company would hire a person that can not be trusted.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

JMO I don't see her life being better out of prison, I can't imagine who or what company would hire a person that can not be trusted.

Maybe she'll run for Congress.

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[Elley Mae]

Maybe she'll run for Congress.

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LOL didn't thing of that, she would fit right in. jmo

 

[Elley Mae]

"So let's be clear: this disclosure is not just an attack on America's foreign policy interests. It is an attack on the international community -- the alliances and partnerships, the conversations and negotiations, that safeguard global security and advance economic prosperity.

Secretary Clinton Delivers Remarks to the Press on the Release of Confidential Documents
Posted by DipNote Bloggers
November 29, 2010


https://blogs.state.gov/stories/201...-remarks-press-release-confidential-documents



Too funny it's no longer there, but the blog (above is there.

We're sorry, that page can't be found.

https://www.state.gov/secretary/rm/2010/11/152078.htm

 

[Sherlockknows]

How can anyone complained about this after Scooter Libby got off. Laws have nothing to do with this, this is all politics. Bigger trouble down the road with American troops in Poland and Norway.


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[Elley Mae]

How can anyone complained about this after Scooter Libby got off. Laws have nothing to do with this, this is all politics. Bigger trouble down the road with American troops in Poland and Norway.


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Not quit the same. jmo

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scooter_Libby


After the sentencing, Bush stated on camera that he would "not intervene until Libby's legal team has exhausted all of its avenues of appeal ... It wouldn't be appropriate for me to discuss the case until after the legal remedies have run its course."[115] Ultimately, less than a month later, on July 2, 2007, Bush chose Otis's 'third option' — "neither prison nor pardon" — in commuting Libby's prison sentence.[19][20]

After Libby was denied bail during his appeal process on July 2, 2007, Bush commuted Libby's 30-month federal prison sentence, calling it "excessive", but he did not change the other parts of the sentence and their conditions.[20] That presidential commutation left in place the felony conviction, the $250,000 fine, and the terms of probation.[19][20] Some have criticized the move, as presidential commutations are rarely issued, but when granted they have generally occurred after the convicted person has already served a substantial portion of his or her sentence: "We can't find any cases, certainly in the last half-century, where the president commuted a sentence before it had even started to be served," said former Justice Department pardon attorney Margaret Colgate Love.[100] Others, notably Cheney himself who argued that Libby was unfairly charged by a politically motivated prosecution, believed that the commutation fell short, as Libby would likely never practice law again.[116]

At the time, Bush explained his "Grant of Executive Clemency" to Libby, in part, as follows:

Mr. Libby was sentenced to thirty months of prison, two years of probation, and a $250,000 fine. In making the sentencing decision, the district court rejected the advice of the probation office, which recommended a lesser sentence and the consideration of factors that could have led to a sentence of home confinement or probation.
I respect the jury's verdict. But I have concluded that the prison sentence given to Mr. Libby is excessive. Therefore, I am commuting the portion of Mr. Libby's sentence that required him to spend thirty months in prison.
My decision to commute his prison sentence leaves in place a harsh punishment for Mr. Libby. The reputation he gained through his years of public service and professional work in the legal community is forever damaged. His wife and young children have also suffered immensely. He will remain on probation. The significant fines imposed by the judge will remain in effect. The consequences of his felony conviction on his former life as a lawyer, public servant, and private citizen will be long-lasting.[19]

Commutation? Clemency? Pardon? Sorting Out Legalese in Libby Case

http://abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/story?id=3339765&page=1

 

[Elley Mae]

The Plame affair (also known as the CIA leak scandal and Plamegate) was a political scandal that revolved around journalist Robert Novak's public identification of Valerie Plame as a covert Central Intelligence Agency officer in 2003.[1][2][3]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plame_affair

In 2003, he identified Valerie Plame as a CIA "operative" in his column.[46] In doing so, he indirectly disclosed the organizational name of the company she used as cover, Brewster Jennings & Associates, the other operatives who worked for Brewster Jennings, and the informants who met with them.Although it is illegal for anyone, government official or otherwise, to knowingly distribute classified information (under US Code, Title 18, Section 793, Paragraph e),[47] Novak was never charged with this crime because there was no evidence that Novak knew that Ms. Plame was a covert agent. Novak reported the information was provided to him by two "senior administration officials". These were eventually revealed to be Richard Armitage, who e-mailed him using the pseudonym "Wildford", with Novak assuming Karl Rove's comments as confirmation.[48] During 2005, there were questions in the press regarding the apparent absence of focus on Novak by the special prosecutor Fitzgerald and the grand jury, specifically questions suggesting he may have already testified about his sources despite insisting publicly that he would not do so.

bbm


After Novak's death, David Frum commented that the whole episode had been ironic given that Richard Armitage, Joe Wilson, Valerie Plame, and Novak all had exactly the same opinions against a potential war in Iraq.[32]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Novak


Just trying to keep the facts straight.

 

[drjones]

So sad. The innocent children and civilians killed. Chelsea could not stomach it.

if she had just released the information she found that was directly related to what she felt were illegal acts then i would be more sympathetic, but she didnt, and i believe she has admitted that her methodology was flawed and she has apologized for what she did. well, crimes have penalties... has she paid enough of a penalty? maybe, im really not sure. but i would rather obama had left it to the parole board, basically all he did was guarantee she got her first chance at parole (same outcome, except now it is politically charged).

 

[drjones]

someone mentioned snowden would be next - no chance. completely different situation. if snowden gets any relief from obama i will eat my hat, well i dont have any hats so i will buy a hat and then eat it.

 

[wfgodot]

Good thread, all. I knew this one might be mightily contentious, but props for handling it well.

 

[rob]

I have always wondered, since he came out as transgender the day after he was found guilty, if released, would he stay trans or go back to his original gender? Kind of Corporal Clinger type. I guess time will tell. I feel like he/she will be looking for book, movie, talk show type of activity to make a living now.
MOO

 

[K_Z]

Manning is a despicable, narcissistic, arrogant traitor.

Clemency is a slap in the face to every single person who has ever served in uniform.

A disrespectful parting shot by an outgoing tin pot demagogue who despises the military.

It's astonishing to me that anyone could "support" Manning.

If Manning had a conscience,or any scrap of integrity, there were literally hundreds of legitimate ways to be an effective "whistleblower" within the hierarchy of the military. What Manning did was treason, pure and simple.

The charges were just. The trial was just. The sentence was just. Clemency for Manning is the epitome of injustice.

 

[wfgodot]

NYT:

Obama Pardons James Cartwright, General Who Lied to F.B.I. in Leak Case