The Sidebar - Harris Trial #2

[NCTeacher]

Technically I can't dispute the law, I never have. My opinion is my personal one and not to be considered state statute or federal law.

IMO, had RH not killed his son he wouldn't have been charged with exploitation of a minor *even if the law was aware of his sexting crime.* He would have been charged with something less but more appropriate in this specific circumstance.

He wouldn't be the type of guy the sex offender registry was designed for. He wouldn't be considered beyond rehabilitation or a threat to society or needing to be permanently banned from being within 10 miles of a public school.

The charge merely serves as a backup in the event he's found not guilty of murder. And I'm fine with that but only because I think he's a murderer. If he was being tried solely as a 'sexual predator' I would have a hard time finding him guilty. A pathetic, social reject randomly sexting anyone with two legs doesn't represent the type of predator we should fear roaming the streets. That person doesn't deserve the same punishment as a Jerry Sandusky.

I think RH deserves life in prison but not everyone who kills their child deserves the same level of punishment, even if they intended to kill their child. There was a woman who had grown twins residing in a nursing home. The twins had a progressive disease and were essentially 'locked in,' unable communicate and in terrible pain. She shot them both in the head out of mercy. She technically killed both of her sons but she's no Ross Harris. She was charged with a lesser crime and served zero jail time.

All murderers aren't the same and for those people, they aren't charged with murder 1. Same applies to 'predators or pedos.' It's no more "black and white" for a sex crime than it is for murder. There's plenty of discretion and a host of other charges that can be substituted for the offense.

Paige, I completely understand your position on this and to some extent agree with you. What I cannot understand is the insistence on this thread to not call Ross a "sexual predator" because of personal discomfort when the law itself would classify him as such. We are shifting into the world of connotations and feelings, and incidentally enough by those who come across as objective and attentive to legal definitions and protocols during trial. Now it appears folks want to circumvent the in legal precedence established with regard to sex crimes and minors---and judicial precedence is the very fabric of our judicial system. It doesn't matter what Wikipedia says "sexual predator" means, what matters is that jurisdictions across this country classify Ross Harris as a sexual predator.

 

[monkeypants]

This 14 yr old individual may be one from the March 2016 indictment but not a part of this case. JMHO I can't believe they were able to bring in to this one without the person testifying. And if it was from the other case, why didn't they testify in this case? Even if just as a witness to chats? Had nothing to do with this case.

IF this is the same 14yr old mentioned in Stoddards testimony, at trial, this would be Count 4...on or about the 23rd of January, 2014, did knowingly possess material, to wit: a digital image and photograph depting N.P. , a minor, engaged in sexually explicit conduct, to wit: lewd exhibition of said minor female's genitalia, contrary to the laws of said State, the good order, peace and dignity thereof. http://media.wix.com/ugd/943520_dea5702bbc3849178f39bc063c0bc78f.pdf

4:00 p.m. Detective reads a conversation Harris had on Whisper in January 2014. The girl he's chatting with claims to be 14 years old. Detective says Harris continues to sext with her despite that http://www.wsbtv.com/news/ross-harr...the-ross-harris-hot-car-death-trial/460110234

From this trial....

Another young girl was only 15 when she talked with Harris online.

"I posted a post that says I love older guys," she said. "At first I lied I told him I was 18."

She says Harris sent a picture of his privates to her and she sent one of her's back to him. That's when she says she told him she was only 15 years old.

"He told me he wanted me to make him a naughty old man or something like that," the witness said.

Defense attorney Maddox Kilgore questioned her behavior as a 15-year-old.

"In 21 minutes you sent a stranger a picture of your privates," Kilgore asked.

"Yes sir," she said. http://www.wsfa.com/story/33403835/testimony-resumes-in-justin-ross-harris-murder-trial

Testimony: Georgian charged in son's death chatted sexually with minor
By Mayra Cuevas and Darran Simon, CNN
Updated 9:33 PM ET, Mon October 17, 2016 .
Brunswick, Georgia (CNN)A 17-year-old-girl testified Monday that she and Justin Ross Harris, the Georgia man charged with murder in his son's death in a hot car, exchanged pictures of their private parts weeks before the boy died, and Harris wanted her to perform sexual acts on him upon learning she was underage.

"He told me he wanted me to make him a naughty old man, or something along those lines," the teenager, who was 15 when she said she messaged with Harris on May 29, 2014, said in a Brunswick, Georgia, courtroom.

The witness said she first lied when she told Harris that she was 18. Harris, who said he was 33, first sent her a picture of his private parts and she responded with a picture of her private parts on Whisper, an app that encourages people to tell secrets, she testified. But later in the conversation, she said she told Harris she was 15.

The girl answered yes and became emotional when Cobb County Assistant District Attorney Chuck Boring asked whether there were "some things in that chat about what he wants to do to you as a 15-year-old girl."

During cross-examination on Monday, Kilgore pointed out that only 21 minutes had passed from the time the 17-year-old started communicating with Harris to the time she sent him a picture of her private parts. http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/17/us/georgia-hot-car-toddler-death-trial/

Ok that's the whole point!!! A child has no ability to understand the consequences of their actions. It's why they can't vote or drink or sign a contract. It's a child!!!!!!!! He didn't cut off all communications...he asked for pictures and iirc a school uniform picture from one of them.

 

[NCTeacher]

Ok that's the whole point!!! A child has no ability to understand the consequences of their actions. It's why they can't vote or drink or sign a contract. It's a child!!!!!!!! He didn't cut off all communications...he asked for pictures and iirc a school uniform picture from one of them.

Seriously. I can't believe you even have to say this.

 

[monkeypants]

On another note because we aren't going to agree. Have you guys watched The Killing Season? So so good. I want to know everything. Just picked up Lost Girls. You guys too?

No I was wondering if it was good. It's on A&E right? Will watch on demand and catch up.

 

[Hope4More]

On another note because we aren't going to agree. Have you guys watched The Killing Season? So so good. I want to know everything. Just picked up Lost Girls. You guys too?

I don't get A& E so can't, but have been reading the threads here about the series.

Which is where I learned the FBi has only 8 (or was it 9?) profilers, total. Was amazed there are so few.

 

[RANCH]

The problem is everyone is thinking of a pedophile as a man asking a little kid in the park to help find his puppy. A pedophile is defined as an adult that is sexually attracted to a child. A 14 year old is a child. A 35 year old man is an adult. There are categories of pedophiles...they don't all carry rainbow lollipops. They can be attracted to children AND adults.

BBM

I don't think that a pedophile is a man asking a little kid in a park to help find his puppy. I posted a link above that defines what a pedophile is and I don't feel that RH fits that criteria.

JMO

 

[momoftwocrazies]

Hope, find them! Maybe YouTube? A&e.com? I'm already hooked.

 

[Paige SC]

No matter what is "normal" (and I have a 15 year old daughter so I'm aware of what kids do these days as well) it's not okay and completely different for a grown man on his thirties to do this with a child under 18 period.

The dismissive tone of what he did with minors is really really strange on this thread.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It's not dismissive. It's merely pointing out he's not a child predator except for purposes secondary to obtaining a conviction in some capacity.

Those hell bent on labeling him a predator or pedophile actually take away from the victims of actual child predators and make a mockery out of their suffering. They make no distinction between a 15 year old willingly sexting a grown man and a 10 year old repeatedly raped by their pastor or priest.


The baby killer is not a child predator but I hope he's convicted of the charge associated with it.

 

[momoftwocrazies]

Hope, find them! Maybe YouTube? A&e.com? I'm already hooked.

http://www.aetv.com/shows/the-killing-season/season-1/episode-1

Full episode.

 

[monkeypants]

Seriously. I can't believe you even have to say this.

I know....

*sigh*

 

[monkeypants]

I don't get A& E so can't, but have been reading the threads here about the series.

Which is where I learned the FBi has only 8 (or was it 9?) profilers, total. Was amazed there are so few.

You should check the A&E website...you may be able to watch them there. A lot of channels do that now.

And it's 8 world wide

 

[momoftwocrazies]

I know....

*sigh*

Not going to get anywhere with this topic. I'm dropping it because tomorrow is verdict day, IMO.

 

[monkeypants]

Not going to get anywhere with this topic. I'm dropping it because tomorrow is verdict day, IMO.

I'm with you momma....

 

[arkansasmimi]

Understood but the definition is clear. A person that is sexually attracted to children. A 35 year old man and a 14 year old child. Enough said.

BBM, Respectfully, as bad as it is, just trying to keep things as factual as possible. RH is 35 yrs old at present and was 33 in 2014.

from another article on the at the time 15, who turned 16 shortly after from other MSM..

The witness said she first lied when she told Harris that she was 18. Harris, who said he was 33, first sent her a picture of his private parts and she responded with a picture of her private parts on Whisper, an app that encourages people to tell secrets, she testified. But later in the conversation, she said she told Harris she was 15. http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/17/us/georgia-hot-car-toddler-death-trial/

 

[monkeypants]

BBM, Respectfully, as bad as it is, just trying to keep things as factual as possible. RH is 35 yrs old at present and was 33 in 2014.

from another article on the at the time 15, who turned 16 shortly after from other MSM..

The witness said she first lied when she told Harris that she was 18. Harris, who said he was 33, first sent her a picture of his private parts and she responded with a picture of her private parts on Whisper, an app that encourages people to tell secrets, she testified. But later in the conversation, she said she told Harris she was 15. http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/17/us/georgia-hot-car-toddler-death-trial/

Ok last time then I'm off here for the night,

When he found out the age he didn't delete and cease communications, instead continued to teach fellatio and request pictures...

*drops mike*

 

[Hope4More]

Paige, I completely understand your position on this and to some extent agree with you. What I cannot understand is the insistence on this thread to not call Ross a "sexual predator" because of personal discomfort when the law itself would classify him as such. We are shifting into the world of connotations and feelings, and incidentally enough by those who come across as objective and attentive to legal definitions and protocols during trial. Now it appears folks want to circumvent the in legal precedence established with regard to sex crimes and minors---and judicial precedence is the very fabric of our judicial system. It doesn't matter what Wikipedia says "sexual predator" means, what matters is that jurisdictions across this country classify Ross Harris as a sexual predator.

I don't think anyone is trying to " circumvent" anything about the minors charges, or to say they don't apply to RH, or to say he doesn't deserve to face the consequences .


Wikipedia isn't a legal resource, and I didn't quote from it as a legal resource. I did quote the part that noted the opinions of some that the definition of sexual predator has been diluted by the liberal application of the term to an overly broad set of sexual offenses against minors.

I agree with that opinion. I also agree with the opinion of many, that GA's new law permitting one to be charged and convicted for felony murder even if one had no intent to harm, is intended as an egregious endrun by the State.

 

[arkansasmimi]

Quote Originally Posted by arkansasmimi View Post
BBM, Respectfully, as bad as it is, just trying to keep things as factual as possible. RH is 35 yrs old at present and was 33 in 2014.

from another article on the at the time 15, who turned 16 shortly after from other MSM..

The witness said she first lied when she told Harris that she was 18. Harris, who said he was 33, first sent her a picture of his private parts and she responded with a picture of her private parts on Whisper, an app that encourages people to tell secrets, she testified. But later in the conversation, she said she told Harris she was 15. http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/17/us/geo...r-death-trial/

Ok last time then I'm off here for the night,

When he found out the age he didn't delete and cease communications, instead continued to teach fellatio and request pictures...

*drops mike*

Understand. Was just stating the correct age. Not condoning it.

Also its against the law because it was done on the internet. Asking is one charge and when it was followed through is another charge, IIRC.

If they had had actual sex it would have been legal (at age 16, age of consent)

 

[arkansasmimi]

Paige, I completely understand your position on this and to some extent agree with you. What I cannot understand is the insistence on this thread to not call Ross a "sexual predator" because of personal discomfort when the law itself would classify him as such. We are shifting into the world of connotations and feelings, and incidentally enough by those who come across as objective and attentive to legal definitions and protocols during trial. Now it appears folks want to circumvent the in legal precedence established with regard to sex crimes and minors---and judicial precedence is the very fabric of our judicial system. It doesn't matter what Wikipedia says "sexual predator" means, what matters is that jurisdictions across this country classify Ross Harris as a sexual predator.

IIRC, when an objection was made of Stoddard calling RH a pedofile (in a hearing) and it referenced in trial, Kilgore objected and the Judge sustained it... JMHO

 

[Hope4More]

It's not dismissive. It's merely pointing out he's not a child predator except for purposes secondary to obtaining a conviction in some capacity.

Those hell bent on labeling him a predator or pedophile actually take away from the victims of actual child predators and make a mockery out of their suffering. They make no distinction between a 15 year old willingly sexting a grown man and a 10 year old repeatedly raped by their pastor or priest.


The baby killer is not a child predator but I hope he's convicted of the charge associated with it.

I'm still pinching myself to see if I'm dreaming we think the same way about this, that making such a wide range of offenses equal under the law trivializes the harm done by the truly egregious .

 

[Hope4More]

http://www.aetv.com/shows/the-killing-season/season-1/episode-1

Full episode.

Thank you!