Trial Discussion Thread #4 - 14.03.10, Day 6

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In fishing around Twitter the last few days, I saw on OP's feed that he was planning to move to Johannesburg. I see in your post here you mention he was with a real estate agent that day.

Does anyone know when this move was going to take place? Was he going to sell his house in Pretoria?

Pistorius has had his house on the market for about two years now. He has had it listed with many agents but they have found it difficult to show anyone as he was often overseas in 2012. As far as I know he has not sold it yet.

There was talk that he was going to move to Johannesburg and bought a house there in December 2012 and it was rumoured that he was going to ask Reeva to live with him there.

OP was invited to that party as it was the agency's birthday party. He left the party apparently reluctantly to meet up with Reeva and intended to meet up with some of the people who were there with him such as Justin Divaris later as Reeva often went home about 10pm according to Gina Myers. But do not ask me for any links. This is just information I have picked up after one year of following this case. It would be on one of the earlier threads as I was the one who posted it. You can try to find it if interested.

I have already given you a link to one of the estate agents he was dealing with but she was not the only one.
 
Hi, and thanks for letting me join your site!

I live in South Africa (Johannesburg) - just to answer a previous question, I would not say aircon is the norm at night, especially in a house that has been well built with big windows, which are often left open. We use a fan in our bedroom, but it is more to keep the occasional mosquito away than it is to cool the room down. So yes, some houses would not have had aircon and some might not even have had fans. In a private housing estate with excellent security and in an upstairs bedroom, yes, I can agree that people would feel comfortable leaving their sliding door open.

Also, one other comment - the private ambulance service in SA is generally very good and well equipped, with ambulances as well as paramedics who travel in cars to be first responders. Unless Oscar had actually established Reeva was dead, I am confused about why anyone at Netcare would tell him to bring her to the hospital in the car... unless there was huge panic, confusion and misunderstanding during the phone call. I see that some Netcare employees are on the witness list and it will be very interesting to hear what was said and why.

:Welcome1::welcome6:
 
:floorlaugh: :floorlaugh: The document regarding the witness statements of OP's friends was at his website but it's deleted - why, tell me why ? :D - and I couldn't find another copy :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh:

But this transcript of the bail hearing (February 22, 2013) includes some extracts of the statements.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1302/22/sp.03.html

It starts with the statement of Alexandros Pilakoutos (Alex)......

Justin Divaris + Samantha Greyvenstein are at the state's witness list and Sam has apparently recanted her testimony/statement regarding the relationship between OP + Reeva.....
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I've been reading articles in some of the South African newspapers covering today's trial. Lordy, it must have been even worse than what I had already read!

OP at one point was laying curled up in a fetal position on the bench inside the dock.

He had what appeared in a photo to be an opened white handkerchief draped over his head and partially covering his face.

He was bent over retching into the bucket with his thumbs in his ears.

He stuffed Kleenexes into his ears at one point.


Some of these antics sound like when my grandson was 5 years old! This grown man has obviously "lost it". Were I the judge, I would NOT allow another day of this behavior. He needs to get medicated or be removed from the courtroom.

There have certainly been plenty of cases here in the U.S. where the accused had to be removed from the courtroom for one reason or another. They were set up in a room with closed circuit TV that showed them the trial.

There is already a room for the overflow of members of the press. How difficult can it be to set up another viewing room? If there was no other solution, I'd clear the press from the overflow room and put OP in there until a separate TV hookup could be installed in another room. (As in the Jury Room which is not being used)

Perhaps this is what OP actually wants. And perhaps the Judge will keep him where he is and allow him to continue to make an azz out of himself.

This whole episode reminds me of a person whom I used to know who was a real "Drama Queen" type. Turns out when she would "get upset" she would have "seizures". And you should have seen these "seizures"! They were this woman's idea of what a seizure would look like. Let me tell you, they were unlike any seizure I had ever seen. And I had seen far too many of them.

It was almost funny, but still, it was pathetic.

What would happen to Oscar if he took a plea deal, I wonder? Because I think he's going down for sure on the weapons charges and most likely on whatever the equivalent of manslaughter/negligent homicide is in SA.
 
I've been reading articles in some of the South African newspapers covering today's trial. Lordy, it must have been even worse than what I had already read!

OP at one point was laying curled up in a fetal position on the bench inside the dock.

He had what appeared in a photo to be an opened white handkerchief draped over his head and partially covering his face.

He was bent over retching into the bucket with his thumbs in his ears.

He stuffed Kleenexes into his ears at one point.


Some of these antics sound like when my grandson was 5 years old! This grown man has obviously "lost it". Were I the judge, I would NOT allow another day of this behavior. He needs to get medicated or be removed from the courtroom.

There have certainly been plenty of cases here in the U.S. where the accused had to be removed from the courtroom for one reason or another. They were set up in a room with closed circuit TV that showed them the trial.

There is already a room for the overflow of members of the press. How difficult can it be to set up another viewing room? If there was no other solution, I'd clear the press from the overflow room and put OP in there until a separate TV hookup could be installed in another room. (As in the Jury Room which is not being used)

Perhaps this is what OP actually wants. And perhaps the Judge will keep him where he is and allow him to continue to make an azz out of himself.

This whole episode reminds me of a person whom I used to know who was a real "Drama Queen" type. Turns out when she would "get upset" she would have "seizures". And you should have seen these "seizures"! They were this woman's idea of what a seizure would look like. Let me tell you, they were unlike any seizure I had ever seen. And I had seen far too many of them.

It was almost funny, but still, it was pathetic.

What would happen to Oscar if he took a plea deal, I wonder? Because I think he's going down for sure on the weapons charges and most likely on whatever the equivalent of manslaughter/negligent homicide is in SA.

If this was a jury trial, these theatrics would not be allowed. But SA doesn't have jury trials.

Since this is more like a bench trial where the Judge will decide his fate, his attempts to manipulate the Court are viewed as less potentially influential to a verdict.

I have a feeling that My Lady is not swayed by such ridiculous shenanigans.
 
So much for decorum. I've never known a person who could retch at will, so I give him the benefit of the doubt and presume it was an involuntary reaction. The rest of it was within his control, and drama queen is an apt descriptor, IMO. I certainly hope he won't be allowed to manipulate the proceedings throughout.
 
My theory is speculation, which people hear seem to hate, yet you love a new theory...!

And this one is sexual. I think the phone is the focus of all this and OP went upstairs after the killing to hide it. It's importance is underscored by the fact that although she is bleeding and he's chasing her (demanding it back), she's not giving it up.

She found something devastating there. Something that would destroy him. And since he is a narcissist, anything destroying him ends the world-- he's already a fading athlete and a crippled one at that. He is willing to throw over a friend just to not be the guy who shoots a gun into the restaurant floor. So we know it has to be worse than this.

Although she was hurt, she even makes sure she had it when she takes refuge in the bathroom. Why does she need it? To prove that her allegations she plans to make are true. She has threatened to expose him (as a pedophile? as a cross-dresser? as a gay man? As someone into bondage or horseplay or kinky in some other way.

When she discovers his, shall we say, irregularity, she mocks him. He is already taking performance enhancing herbs or whatever, so he has some insecurity in this area. And now she KNOWS that he needs the photos of shoes or the view of the anus of a donkey (we can't possibly know what his fetish might be).

He loses his cool and needs to prove to her that he is every bit 100% a man even if he does like *advertiser censored*. He begins to rough her up and she says no means no. So he rapes her, but in a twist of fate, he cannot get it up and she laughs. So he twists her arm, grabs an object and begins raping her with the object, pushing her against the bed, smacking her leg, and causing the bruising on the inside of her groin as he forces it into her vagina and her anus, causing the bruising in that area.

She is screaming which everyone heard as a fight since he is also yelling...she fights him off and runs to escape, grabbing her proof and hiding in the bathroom as his temper escalates. She plans to call for help but is holding the door closed.

She sees the gun and where it is aimed, otherwise, why would she cover her head with her right arm? She knew he was pointing a gun at her head.

He shot her in the hip down towards her groin to destroy the evidence of his sexual assault.

I don't think he planned this very far ahead, but it only takes a moment to form an intention to kill. He couldn't allow her to destroy the only thing he had left, his reputation as the South African golden boy.

In his mind, he was defending himself...and he still is.

Yesterday's continuous retching/crying was for the purpose of distracting the court's attention from the unspeakable crimes committed against Reeva. My theory of a sexual discovery, or perhaps a demand for a form of sex that was unacceptable to her, is backed up by the insistance that the open broadcast of the autopsy be squelched due to a respect for the dignity of the deceased suggests evidence of sexual depravity leaving its evidence on the body.

The court is not talking about protecting children from hearing about three bullet holes, one close to the vag, folks. They are wanting to protect the sensibilities of the family having to listen to medical notations such as torn vaginal canal, torn anus, semen in mouth, etc.

In my belief, the various bruises are indicative of a woman fending off a rape with an object, especially the strange bruise in the web of her fingers. Perhaps the handle of the cricket bat? A trophy?
 
I've seen other people - both adults and children - who throw up when they are super upset or nervous. I've seen small children having a temper tantrum, crying and making themselves gag.

This is a grown man stuffing Kleenex into his ears? Curling up in a ball in the middle of a courtroom? Thumbs in his ears while puking into a bucket in the middle of a courtroom?

IMO Oscar Pistorius has a bolt loose, bigtime. And yes, this makes me even more sure he is guilty.
 
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