GUILTY UK - Lindsay Birbeck, 47, teaching asst, found deceased, Accrington, 12 Aug 2019 *teen arrested* #5

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I think it is relevant that the jury has 9 women, which has been played on by both sides: women, you know how it feels to be scared walking alone / women, you know how easy it is to break a nail. I can imagine that that aspect of it, especially with the ZB evidence, would easily create an emotive response towards seeing him as a predator. But with solely circumstantial evidence, and a limited, bizarre, but consistent defence, who knows?!

Edit to add: thanks for the poll, Alyce
 
Legally Bland said:
I went for guilty of murder, but judging by the mixed views on here I'm not sure what the jury will do.
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Same here LB.

And I can choose that option here, because on balance I think he must have done it. But if I was responsible for a young lad's future and wasnt 100% certain, I'm not sure how I'd feel.
 
CSBR said:
I think it is relevant that the jury has 9 women, which has been played on by both sides: women, you know how it feels to be scared walking alone / women, you know how easy it is to break a nail. I can imagine that that aspect of it, especially with the ZB evidence, would easily create an emotive response towards seeing him as a predator. But with solely circumstantial evidence, and a limited, bizarre, but consistent defence, who knows?!
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Agree but also, and apologies male sleuthers as no offence intended, but a lot of woman do have a v strong maternal instinct and this is a young lad, who doesnt appear to have been dealt the best hand. I can see that emotion being tricky to suppress too.
 
HongKongPhooey said:
Agree but also, and apologies male sleuthers as no offence intended, but a lot of woman do have a v strong maternal instinct and this is a young lad, who doesnt appear to have been dealt the best hand. I can see that emotion being tricky to suppress too.
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I did half wonder about that too, actually, with him being described as being fairly small too. I think the fact that he did such a good job of handling the body, no matter what you think about how she came to be killed, is a bit off-putting... And a lot of people do have a lot of prejudicial negative feelings about his community. But I completely agree that basically everything you can chalk up as a victory for one side has a counterpoint on the other.

So much of it will come down to the impressions people have made within the courtroom, which won't come across in the reporting. It's hard to imagine how her family are feeling right now. One assumes they are confident that the defendant is guilty and would be entirely comfortable with that verdict - it must be even more difficult if you aren't sure.
 
Guilty IMO. I think the autism angle is overblown. He was very capable in his hiding and disposing of the body. He functioned well enough that his parents allowed him to wander at all times of the day and night, so doesn't seem like he required supervision at all. From what I hear he is capable of earning money collecting scrap metal. I don't see him as easily led.
 
accylocal said:
Just to add what i have put above. Less than 2 years ago there was a sexual assault behind where i live which is the forest leading to the cemetery , where the path is that leads to the caravan site and the industrial site where the defendant was seen on cctv and also where the defendant will have collected the bag and bin he was seen with going to the coppice. Now, after looking at this the last couple of days could this be the defendant? (See link and pictures). The defendant especially on the pictures from the cctv looks older than he actually is and we have also realised through the trial he is alot stronger than he looks. The pictures for me look very similar and he is described as with a parting in his hair what he has and also seems the correct height. The only thing which seems wrong is she described him as blonde. Did she just get the hair colour wrong? However, since his name came out around Accrington , pictures starting circulating and i am sure i saw a picture of him with blonde hair. Did he dye it after being worried about being caught? It just makes me wonder if it was him and this could of been part of his mind and why he may of done what he has done to Lindsay? Could this be him and he could of been sexually motivated?

I really dont know but the picture especially from an evofit looks like him, the location makes sense and other than the hair which i have explained it could be him. Obviously its speculation but it just came to me the other day. The man was never caught.

This is the link for the story... Police issue Evofit after dog walker sexually assaulted in Accrington
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Hi accylocal. I live in Accrington too and regularly go to Altham (Whinney Hill) Recycling Centre. I feel almost certain that the attacker and Lindsay's killer are one and the same
 
Evening all long time no speak.

IMO guilty as charged (murder) no doubt about it.

His story is a fairytale, there was no mystery man just a young testosterone filled disturbed young man who has, if local
Rumours are to be believed as Accylad and myself have mentioned previously, attacked women previously to albeit a lesser degree but never caught. Who knows what he’s got upto previously that’s led Up to this, his family seemed to hand him in rather quickly as opposed to him going missing within the traveller community.

all just my opinion for what it’s worth.

could easily see him getting off on the murder but not manslaughter Just because of the circumstances and poor prosecution. Definitely did it though IMO
 
I don't see how a verdict of manslaughter can be found. Neither the prosecution or defense has pushed or proposed that scenario. This coupled with the fact that the defendant has shown no remorse or sorrow that LB has died and seemingly cared not a jot that LB's family, friends and the whole town of Accrington were very worried and scared for her safety. Rather he sought to prolong everyone's agony and even desecrated her body like she was a lump of meat. ie. absolutely no empathy. Now you might say that the lack of empathy is down to his autism, but this has not been proven. There is only his school reports as far as I understand, and no current psychological evaluation of him has been put forward. He has been deemed fit to stand trial and therefore fit to understand what is happening. His statement is rather cold and very calculated and solely designed to cast doubt by using his autism as an excuse. IMO he is a very dangerous young man.
 
Just caught up on what I 'missed'

Seemingly not much at all as it was all just a rehash of the original trial.

I did laugh at one part...where the 'lawyer' basically said that the defendant's story is so unbelievable that it has to be true. ‍♂️

Does anyone know why Manslaughter was added?
As in this case it seems quite clear - either he killed her ('non accidental' murder) or he didn't (disposing of body offence)?
 
Wednesday, August 12th:
*Re-Trial Continues (Day 8)-VERDICT WATCH! (@ 10:30am UK) – UK – Lindsay Birbeck (47) (from Huncoat; last seen ~ 2:30pm on Aug. 12, 2019 & walking towards Accrington on Burnley Road @ 4:06pm on CCTV; found Aug. 24, 2019 in the area of Accrington Cemetery on Burnley Road) - *16/now 17 year old arrested (8/27/19) on suspicion of murder & charged (8/31/19) & arraigned (8/3/20) with murder & (added on 8/3/20) with manslaughter. Plead not guilty. Remanded to custody.
Re-Trial began on 8/3/20 (should last 2 wks). Jurors: 9 women & 3 men.
Previous trial info & other court info from 6/1/20 thru 7/21/20 & retrial from 8/3/20 (Day 1) thru 8/10/20 (Day 6) reference post #529 here:
Found Deceased - UK - Lindsay Birbeck, 47, Accrington, 12 Aug 2019 *Arrest* #4
8/11/20 Day 7: The defendant appeared via video link from HMP Wetherby & was wearing a white shirt & blue waistcoat. He was accompanied by an intermediary. Barrister Mark Fenhalls QC gave his summation of the defense case to the jury. Mr Fenhalls said: “You can be sure that he buried her in that cemetery. He has pleaded guilty & that’s what he admitted to police last summer. “I suggest all the DNA & scientific evidence all points to his guilt on that count. “None of it points to the fact that he is the killer.” Mr Fenhalls took the jury through the post-mortem examination evidence presented by Home Office pathologist Dr. Naomi Carter. No evidence of sexual assault, bruising or defensive wounds. Her Honour Mrs. Justice Yip summarized the facts of the case. The jurors have been sent away until 10.30am tomorrow morning, 8/12. They will be sent out to consider their verdicts shortly afterwards.
 
Found some real interesting info on FB last night. There's a local resident who says they have seen drone footage (taken at the time of the search for LB) of the accused with another male moving something heavy in a trolley, behind the Whitakers Arms which was wrapped in plastic. I'm trying to get more info out of this person.
 
ShamelessObserver said:
Found some real interesting info on FB last night. There's a local resident who says they have seen drone footage (taken at the time of the search for LB) of the accused with another male moving something heavy in a trolley, behind the Whitakers Arms which was wrapped in plastic. I'm trying to get more info out of this person.
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I’ve seen the footage, it has been handed to the police apparently and nothing has been done. It’s 2 males and none are the defendant
 
Kaykedi said:
Hi accylocal. I live in Accrington too and regularly go to Altham (Whinney Hill) Recycling Centre. I feel almost certain that the attacker and Lindsay's killer are one and the same
Click to expand...

It makes total sense. I think this is where he started having a fascination with following women and taking advantage. The picture fits, the location fits. The description regarding the tracksuit also fits.

Worrying.
 
sunflower22 said:
I’ve seen the footage, it has been handed to the police apparently and nothing has been done. It’s 2 males and none are the defendant
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I have this footage too. The trolley appears light and empty.
My initial thought was that it was taken there to move LB but was too light and flimsy, then came the bin idea?

Seems a strange place to take a trolley..
 
Anyone care to estimate how long the Jury will be out

I am going for Friday at the earliest with Judge allowing a majority verdict



eta ( I am usually wrong with my estimates :D )
 
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