UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 Jul 1986 #4

[Whitehall 1212]

Hi, Whitehall 1212. A general query: I would like to know whether scope exists within the prison/parole rules for an imprisoned criminal like JC - who appears to be nearing his end - to be granted privileges or supervised freedom in exchange for revealing his secrets? Presumably a Home Secretary could order such an approach.

I'm a very basic student of this case, having the same access to sources as, I guess, most of us here: the AS and Berry-Dee books; documentaries; blogs etc. I haven't read DV's book yet because of its aliens-are-here approach, but I've gone back into some newspaper archives and copied the more informative articles, from the Evening Standard particularly, durng the ensuing 2-3 year period after July 1986. You get closer e.g. to what Harry Riglin actually saw and said at the time. Beyond that, I don't know what else there is to usefully uncover. It seems we're near the end of discoverable information now. Some forum speculation now appears rooted in imagination more than fact and the discussion flies off at tangents accordingly. My question is, how can a case be sensibly progressed given the absence of fresh information, definitively solved in some way ideally, without the assistance of the perpetrator himself?

Hi @EddietheEagle,

Both Reggie Kray and Ronnie Biggs were released on compassionate grounds, so the Home Secretary does have the authority to make such decisions.

However, I can't see Priti Patel being compassionate and certainly not with an offender like JC, who even with a terminal illness may still present a risk to others. PP certainly isn't one to do 'bargains' with the likes of JC.

The 'I want to show you where the body is' game was played by Myra Hyndley and Ian Brady in the late 1980's. It was a hideous spectacle. MH and IB no doubt enjoying a day out on the moors! Nevertheless Pauline Reade's body was located but sadly not Keith Bennett's.

If JC did feel compelled to clear his conscience and indicate where SJL's body is, which is highly unlikely, then the police would take a view as to it's reliability, based on the investigation and what they know of JC.

I do hope that SJL is found, if only to return her to her family, which will heal a lot of pain.

The evidence required is that which directly links SJL with JC on 28th July 1986 or after. It will need to be forensic evidence from the body of SJL and/or the area of the deposition site.

The big question is 'what is the likelihood of forensic evidence being preserved from 1986'? It would depend very much on the site of deposition, but after nearly 40 years I think the forensic opportunities would be very limited.

Therefore, I don't hold out much hope that the evidence required will now be found and the dreadfully sad disappearance of SJL will go unsolved.

 

[Whitehall 1212]

The taxi driver confirmed that JC was "James Gallway"...

From memory you are combining two separate witness events:

1. A cabbie picking up a fare who matched JC's description and carrying champagne, who asked to be taken to Shorrolds Road.

2. A cabbie picking up a fare near to Stevenage Road, and who looked like James Galway, who mentioned a couple having an argument in the street.

I have seen both of these mentioned, although the source of the first one is questionable. I'll see if I can find it mentioned in the public domain.

 

[Pinkizzy]

Could you post the link to this please

Where is John Cannan now and why is he the prime suspect as Mr Kipper connected with the disappearance of Suzy Lamplugh?

OVER three decades after estate agent Suzy Lamplugh disappeared police dug up the garden of the house where prime suspect John Cannan’s mum once lived. Lamplugh, 25, was abducted in 1986 afte…

www.thesun.co.uk

 

[WestLondoner]

I'm not sure that's the same sighting.

Quite a poor Sun article - if you look at the "10 reasons why he is prime suspect" bit, all of them are spurious, irrelevant, unsubstantiated, a matter of opinion, or untrue.

JMO

 

[Pinkizzy]

I'm not sure that's the same sighting.

Quite a poor Sun article - if you look at the "10 reasons why he is prime suspect" bit, all of them are spurious, irrelevant, unsubstantiated, a matter of opinion, or untrue.

JMO

My focus was the taxi driver statement about JC

 

[Pinkizzy]

From memory you are combining two separate witness events:

1. A cabbie picking up a fare who matched JC's description and carrying champagne, who asked to be taken to Shorrolds Road.

2. A cabbie picking up a fare near to Stevenage Road, and who looked like James Galway, who mentioned a couple having an argument in the street.

I have seen both of these mentioned, although the source of the first one is questionable. I'll see if I can find it mentioned in the public domain.

The taxi driver did not take JC to Shorrolds Rd as I would have remembered it. He picked him up that's all and forgot the rest of the journey

 

[Whitehall 1212]

Where is John Cannan now and why is he the prime suspect as Mr Kipper connected with the disappearance of Suzy Lamplugh?

OVER three decades after estate agent Suzy Lamplugh disappeared police dug up the garden of the house where prime suspect John Cannan’s mum once lived. Lamplugh, 25, was abducted in 1986 afte…

www.thesun.co.uk

The taxi driver pick-up referred to in this article is not the same as the 'James Galway' pickup!

There are many inconsistencies in this article. It's important to find the root source of information not just rehashes throughout the press, which after all are out for profit, not truth.

 

[Whitehall 1212]

The taxi driver did not take JC to Shorrolds Rd as I would have remembered it. He picked him up that's all and forgot the rest of the journey

That's why I said 'from memory' because I have not seen that information alluded to with any hint of veracity, i.e. I don't recall it being said directly by any investigating officer in a documentary or by a serious investigative journalist.

In fact it is so low on my radar, which for me implies I have not seen any credible source for it.

 

[Whitehall 1212]

Where is John Cannan now and why is he the prime suspect as Mr Kipper connected with the disappearance of Suzy Lamplugh?

OVER three decades after estate agent Suzy Lamplugh disappeared police dug up the garden of the house where prime suspect John Cannan’s mum once lived. Lamplugh, 25, was abducted in 1986 afte…

www.thesun.co.uk

Just because it's MSM doesn't provide any guarantee of truth or accuracy.

This is a dire and sensationalist article, which doesn't contribute anything positive to proper understanding of the case.

 

[WestLondoner]

But is this the taxi driver who picked up a fare around the corner from 123SR? Or another? And if the latter, is this one of those preposterous "sightings" from 14 years later?

If so - I am starting to worry about my memory. Fourteen years ago is 2008. I can't remember any shop window I looked into in 2008, nor who else was looking in it, nor who I saw getting in a cab, nor can I remember anyone I saw in a London park in 2008. I can't remember any car I saw while out running, and it goes without saying that I can't remember the day, date or time of any of these things I don't remember.

Yet we have all these witnesses who can. Amazing.

Come to think of it, though, I do remember seeing someone who looked a lot like Mr Kipper in 1986. I saw him on Top of the Pops, and I am personally confident it was Mr Kipper. I wonder if I should report this?

 

[EddietheEagle]

Purely speculative this. JC was apparently a member of the Sutton Coldfield Hardcourts Club and therefore, a tennis player, albeit of unknown standard (Birmingham Mail, 24/04/1989). According to DL, SL was a good player. Moreover, by some accounts, SL had arranged to play tennis at some point after work on the 28th July. A short viewing or meeting at 6 pm would have made little difference at that time of year as daylight hours would still allow enough time to play even on courts without lights.

Despite various mentions of a tennis appointment on 28th July, I haven't seen any reference anywhere as to where SL had intended to play and with whom. Mr Kipper perhaps?

 

[WestLondoner]

Purely speculative this. JC was apparently a member of the Sutton Coldfield Hardcourts Club and therefore, a tennis player, albeit of unknown standard (Birmingham Mail, 24/04/1989). According to DL, SL was a good player. Moreover, by some accounts, SL had arranged to play tennis at some point after work on the 28th July. A short viewing or meeting at 6 pm would have made little difference at that time of year as daylight hours would still allowed enough time to play even on courts without lights.

Despite various mentions of a tennis appointment on 28th July, I haven't seen any reference anywhere as to where SL had intended to play and with whom. Mr Kipper perhaps?

The source of the after-work tennis appointment was DL in a radio interview on Wednesday 30 July. She had heard this from SJL when she came round to her parents' house on the Sunday.

It's hard to know what to make of this. On the one hand Wednesday was close enough to Sunday that it would have been fresh in her mind, and accurately recalled. On the other hand, much of what DL knew about and said of SJL was wildly / recklessly / deliberately inaccurate.

Nobody ever identified themselves as SJL's intended tennis adversary. This doesn't mean it wasn't arranged, of course. It could be someone who had nothing to do with her disappearance and didn't want to get involved by coming forward.

 

[Pinkizzy]

That's why I said 'from memory' because I have not seen that information alluded to with any hint of veracity, i.e. I don't recall it being said directly by any investigating officer in a documentary or by a serious investigative journalist.

In fact it is so low on my radar, which for me implies I have not seen any credible source for it.

Your post should be deleted if you cant prove your claim with a source from MSM. Them's the rules

 

[Whitehall 1212]

It could be someone who had nothing to do with her disappearance and didn't want to get involved by coming forward.

and you don't suppose the police explored this? Just because it's not in MSM and in the public domain don't assume it wasn't a line of enquiry.

The information you have is a tiny percentage of that known to the investigation.

 

[Whitehall 1212]

Your post should be deleted if you cant prove your claim with a source from MSM

'Them rules' also include highlighting supposed rule transgressions on the thread!

I haven't stated fact outside my area of specialism though! Additionally, my auto signature clearly states the basis of my posts.

I'm not sure you really understand!

 

[Pinkizzy]

I haven't stated fact outside my area of specialism though! Additionally, my auto signature clearly states the basis of my posts.

I'm not sure you understand!

I understand, thanks. You didn't provide an msm link to your statement. And you added the bit about Shorrolds Rd which is sus

 

[Whitehall 1212]

I understand, thanks. You didn't provide an msm link to your statement. And you added the bit about Shorrolds Rd which is sus

Go back and read my post again. I made it abundantly clear that I wasn't stating fact.

My concern is for those that believe the Sun or other MSM publish fact!

 

[Crusader21]

Come to think of it, though, I do remember seeing someone who looked a lot like Mr Kipper in 1986. I saw him on Top of the Pops, and I am personally confident it was Mr Kipper. I wonder if I should report this?

Fish, lead singer with Marillion perhaps?!

 

[Pinkizzy]

Go back and read my post again. I made it abundantly clear that I wasn't stating fact.

My concern is for those that believe the Sun or other MSM publish fact!

I'd include a link to a broadsheet if I could find one. And I would include a link to an article in a peer reviewed journal but you wouldnt understand the meaning of that

 

[Konstantin]

But is this the taxi driver who picked up a fare around the corner from 123SR? Or another? And if the latter, is this one of those preposterous "sightings" from 14 years later?

If so - I am starting to worry about my memory. Fourteen years ago is 2008. I can't remember any shop window I looked into in 2008, nor who else was looking in it, nor who I saw getting in a cab, nor can I remember anyone I saw in a London park in 2008. I can't remember any car I saw while out running, and it goes without saying that I can't remember the day, date or time of any of these things I don't remember.

Yet we have all these witnesses who can. Amazing.

Come to think of it, though, I do remember seeing someone who looked a lot like Mr Kipper in 1986. I saw him on Top of the Pops, and I am personally confident it was Mr Kipper. I wonder if I should report this?

I don't think these witnesses were exactly people who just then in 2000 recalled something, but rather people who may have reported stuff closer to the time but due to the mass of information being put to the investigative team, notes were taken but they were not formally interviewed at the time.

if so that does change things a lot. But worth clarifying what this actually means.

Just because it's MSM doesn't provide any guarantee of truth or accuracy.

This is a dire and sensationalist article, which doesn't contribute anything positive to proper understanding of the case.

Well it's the Sun, which while technically mainstream media is a tabloid, and has the fact checking and veracity of a primary school "what I did over the summer break" essay. For what it's worth, it is not considered a reliable source for Wikipedia (neither is the Daily Mail).