VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #7

[Macpad]

If that's the case in any way, you'd think that LINKING Hannah and the assaults, at least, would actually HELP, no?

I mean, if that's the case, that means ONE perp and not two or even three separate ones involved in events that all apparently transpired in a matter of hours.

Frankly it'd seem like if they thought at all that either or both were related to Hannah that they'd say it immediately (as in saying more than just looking into if they could be related) to alleviate some concern.

Heck, even if they aren't sure either way, wouldn't they also possibly gain more saying they believe they are but are still investigating? :waitasec: You'd think if anything that'd make another perp/perps let down their guard thinking LE was off track and focused on the POI from Hannah's case and not them.

But ignoring that last scenario, if pressure were to be involved, certainly it would be better PR to have 1 not 2-3 perps on the loose from one night's notable incidents, wouldn't it?

That makes me think they know they aren't related or they'd wrap it up with a neat tidy bow and at least decrease the concern about multiple perps from just the incidents that one night.

Didn't respond to the BEATING reference I posted I noticed. Hmmmmmmm

 

[Jmm124567]

Perhaps that could be a justifiable factor earlier, but at this point I suspect it would be doing more harm than good.

I mean, his name is now ALL over in the press and everyone who knows him has surely heard it from some source or another - including his place of apparent employment and his place of apparent volunteer work.

How would continuing to not go forward now do anything other than make LE think he looks even more suspicious? :waitasec:

And how would it not almost certainly make his employers, co-workers, future patients he interacts with, and the school employees, families, and children of the football team at least be concerned about if they should be concerned if he could be involved, possibly endangering those positions?

There are certainly people who would fully (or mostly - or heck, even at least to some degree) find him leaving - along with the other 2 who were there at the time - between his car being seized at midnight and LE returning at 8 am. Leaving to consult with an attorney or in fear or whatever seems like it could be understandable for some length of time.

But not coming forward after that - after getting an attorney or something - and now especially with his name being all out there seems like it's got to be doing FAR more harm than good for his situation if he's truly uninvolved, regardless of any hesitations he might possibly have.

After all, if he were to have those concerns about LE and 'the system,' whether that could be believing they were jumping to conclusions / treating him unfairly / etc., if he were to be arrested and charged in connection with it, then you'd think those same concerns could be held about a jury.

And then you'd think that he and presumed legal counsel of some sort would realize that doing anything that might appear suspicious, like not coming forward to LE at least after being named a POI (even if some time may be understood to seek counsel or something) would probably be something that would best be avoided.

I guess I just don't see how even if he had fears along those lines (and regardless of where on the spectrum of understandable/justifiable/whatever or not on which anyone falls) that continuing to not speak with them would be beneficial and not more damaging and/or not further raising suspicions at this point.

But maybe I'm missing something?

Yeah I agree.

 

[Jmm124567]

I skipped thread #6 because it's taking me too long to catch up, I'll try to backtrack.

I would like to see a more recent picture of POI because he looks like a baby faced 20 something year old in the pics I saw. He certainly doesn't look scary, quite the opposite in fact. I don't see a resemblance to the sketches from a past crime. The cab driver has the same hairline, though the nose seems wrong. As to the cab driver's name, I know someone named Jesse and to me it should be pronounced Jess, however, this guy I know pronounces it Jessie. Maybe cab driver just spelled it the way it sounds. Is it possible that he's POI's father? He looks older to me.

I read somewhere that JM was a taxi driver and used his burnt orange car.

 

[Macpad]

Yeah I agree.

Boy I feel like we should all slap ourselves on the back - right boys. Bahahahahaahah

 

[Just K]

Chief Longo is from Baltimore PD. I'm sure he's seen it all and then some. But his jurisdiction is divided by the campus. He has to get UVA to update him on what happens "on grounds." They are not always so forthcoming.

 

[zapped]

From the UVA PD Crime Reports: Pay close attention to September 14th. It says that the female student was sexually assaulted in the early morning hours of September 13th. That is the same night that Hannah disappeared.
http://www.virginia.edu/uvapolice/safety.html

Classic case of escalation?

What I mean by that is that some serial killers work their way up to the kill, getting progressively more violent with each victim.

 

[msteach]

Chief Longo is from Baltimore PD. I'm sure he's seen it all and then some. But his jurisdiction is divided by the campus. He has to get UVA to update him on what happens "on grounds." They are not always so forthcoming.

Very true...and precisely the reason that there is now a federal task force looking into the way that sexual assaults on college campuses are (or, more accurately, are NOT) being reported and handled. They work hard to keep them out of the news, as that scares away parents and tuition dollars. The statistic that I have most oft heard quoted related to this is that 1 in 5 young women will be sexually assaulted during her college years and of those women, only 12% will report that assault to the authorities.

This is a nationwide problem. If you Google sexual assault reporting college campus you will find articles that come up from every state in the union and they all say the same thing -- campuses keep these things quiet so as not to look bad and scary and so that they don't scare parents and prospective students.

As those of us on Websleuths know, while it seems like we follow a lot of cases, only a small percentage of them even hit the local news. Of the many, many disappearances that happen each week across the country, to quote Kym Pasqualini, Director of the National Center for Missing Adults, "the media tends to focus on "damsels in distress"—typically, affluent young white women and teenagers".

Just like anything else these days...college enrollment is about the dollars. In this case, tuition dollars. No different than the NFL trying to hide their dirty laundry. They don't care about the women -- they care about their bottom line.

 

[zapped]

Not sure how to quote smething from previous closed threads, not even sure if I can so forgive me if this against the T.O.S.

Colette said, "They said no one who lived in the apartment complex who knew Jesse would go on tv...."

I find this interesting, did they decline to go on T.V out of respect for JLM or out of fear?

Song22 said "I do find it suspect that he portrays himself as a strong Christian according to someone else here on WS who knows him, and yet he was out drinking on the mall at 1 AM. That's not a typical Born-Again activity. It tells me there's a disconnect in identity, kind of like the Cooper Harris case. JMO"

I wanted to point out that JLM supposedly has a longtime girlfriend. Does anyone else find it odd and disrespectful to his girlfriend/relationship that he's taking an obviously intoxicated young woman out to a bar for a drink at 1am?

I'll bet the girlfriend isnt too happy right now and I hope that LE takes some time to speak to her about all of this. What she has to say about JLM might be very telling indeed.

 

[HFfan1]

I asked this before but unsure if I got an answer. Does anyone who attended UVA know if they teach awareness to incoming freshman? Do they have a volunteer escort service women can call at night? What about the blue emergency lights/phones?

I went to a school where rape had happened a few times over the years and our school was incredibly proactive in informing it's students. It was also a huge party school. I was never allowed to walk alone- my MALE friends made sure of it every single time, no matter the inconvenience to them.

 

[msteach]

Not sure how to quote smething from previous closed threads, not even sure if I can so forgive me if this against the T.O.S.

Colette said, "They said no one who lived in the apartment complex who knew Jesse would go on tv...."

I find this interesting, did they decline to go on T.V out of respect for JLM or out of fear?

Song22 said "I do find it suspect that he portrays himself as a strong Christian according to someone else here on WS who knows him, and yet he was out drinking on the mall at 1 AM. That's not a typical Born-Again activity. It tells me there's a disconnect in identity, kind of like the Cooper Harris case. JMO"

I wanted to point out that JLM supposedly has a longtime girlfriend. Does anyone else find it odd and disrespectful to his girlfriend/relationship that he's taking an obviously intoxicated young woman out to a bar for a drink at 1am?

I'll bet the girlfriend isnt too happy right now and I hope that LE takes some time to speak to her about all of this. What she has to say might be very telling indeed.

IIRC, in the Daily Mail article, his grandma -- between singing his praises for eating his greens and sharing that she has known him his whole life (which I suspect most grandmas do of their grandkids) -- mentioned that he used to have a girlfriend, but they aren't together anymore. Grandma wasn't sure what happened there, though.

 

[possumheart]

I asked this before but unsure if I got an answer. Does anyone who attended UVA know if they teach awareness to incoming freshman? Do they have a volunteer escort service women can call at night? What about the blue emergency lights/phones?

I went to a school where rape had happened a few times over the years and our school was incredibly proactive in informing it's students. It was also a huge party school. I was never allowed to walk alone- my MALE friends made sure of it every single time, no matter the inconvenienc to them.

In this link there is mention of blue light phones etc under the May 19 entry.

http://www.virginia.edu/uvapolice/safety.html

 

[TravelingBug]

Didn't respond to the BEATING reference I posted I noticed. Hmmmmmmm

I actually did

You wrote the above before I had even seen that post, and as I respond to posts in order, I was commenting on something else.

I wrote a lengthy reply - as I'm actually in agreement with you, although I don't think you realize that - but it got eaten by the 'database error' thing.

I was intending to rewrite it now that the 'database error' message stopped appearing, but based on your comment above, I'll not rewrite it.

In the post that apparently came across to you as something else, I was actually commenting on what the article said and what I thought was odd and/or interesting, not saying I was discounting anything as it apparently seemed to you.

So I'm sorry.

I think our lines of communication are crossed and I'm not being clear enough or something. Again, I was commenting on what it had said and not giving a position. I'm not on a different page about it from you.

My post eaten by the 'database error' was equal in frustration to your own about how assaults and rapes (such as the especially horrific one that night) are - or rather usually are not - addressed by the media.

And I'm saying that with a considerable amount of personal firsthand knowledge, along with what I see here on WS, as well as what I see daily working with LE and the media.

 

[bakerlady]

Maybe he is not coming forward because he already told the police everything he knows. They think there is more to it but what if there isn't.

 

[Macpad]

I actually did

You wrote the above before I had even seen that post, and as I respond to posts in order, I was commenting on something else.

I wrote a lengthy reply - as I'm actually in agreement with you, although I don't think you realize that - but it got eaten by the 'database error' thing.

I was intending to rewrite it now that the 'database error' message stopped appearing, but based on your comment above, I'll not rewrite it.

In the post that apparently came across to you as something else, I was actually commenting on what the article said and what I thought was odd and/or interesting, not saying I was discounting anything as it apparently seemed to you.

So I'm sorry.

I think our lines of communication are crossed and I'm not being clear enough or something. Again, I was commenting on what it had said and not giving a position. I'm not on a different page about it from you.

My post eaten by the 'database error' was equal in frustration to your own about how assaults and rapes (such as the especially horrific one that night) are - or rather usually are not - addressed by the media.

And I'm saying that with a considerable amount of personal firsthand knowledge, along with what I see here on WS, as well as what I see daily working with LE and the media.

"Longo declined to discuss two other young women who were attacked during the week. One day after Graham disappeared, a UVA student was raped near campus, and the following day, a young woman from Charlottesville was found unconscious, badly beaten and likely raped nearby. Asked why the public had not been informed, Longo held up the routine police reports delivered to news organizations daily."

http://wvtf.org/post/charlottesville...ss-graham-case

 

[momrids6]

On Fox, in about 11 minutes, they will be discussing Hannah

 

[TravelingBug]

"Longo declined to discuss two other young women who were attacked during the week. One day after Graham disappeared, a UVA student was raped near campus, and the following day, a young woman from Charlottesville was found unconscious, badly beaten and likely raped nearby. Asked why the public had not been informed, Longo held up the routine police reports delivered to news organizations daily."

http://wvtf.org/post/charlottesville-police-making-progress-graham-case

I hope that as a result of this case - and people finding out that police reports get disseminated after incidents (since it seems like many in the public have no idea of that) - it'll begin to help cause the media to cover more incidents than they often do!

It amazes me most people don't know those go out, or that with a huge percentage of the agencies, especially in larger areas, allow anyone to subscribe to incident reports from LE (in their own community or in others).

I wish LE did more in those areas to reiterate that information, and I wish public pressure would cause media to cover more of it as well!

The same is typically true with armed robberies, suicides that impact the public, and a few other 'categories' of note as well. :scared:

I understand some (but not all!) of the reason they often don't get much - if any - attention in public, but it doesn't change my feelings about it.

 

[Mountain Misst]

Has anyone noticed if Hannah had been a student at Piedmont Virginia Community College at any stage?

 

[msteach]

A follow up re: sexual assault reporting issues at UVA. http://wendymurphylaw.com/the-harsh-truth-about-campus-sexual-assault/

Some telling quotes from this excellent article: "Harvard Law School, Princeton and the University of Virginia have largely escaped public scorn even though upper-tiered schools are among the worst offenders, probably because they have the largest concentrations of the most entitled males and have the most to lose in terms of money and reputation when rape happens."

"Elite schools are often too eager to indulge entitled male athletes, legacy students and other money-based concerns that benefit offenders and incentivize schools to side with perpetrators when rape happens. Schools also discourage reporting by dismissing or devaluing victims’ reports as a way of artificially keeping incidence rates low. (If they don’t fully believe her – then it didn’t happen.)

Women students at elite schools are understandably reluctant to take on legal battles against schools that have the power to affect their graduate school plans and future careers, so they accept the maltreatment rather than serve as the sacrificial lamb whose case might provoke meaningful change."

And, finally... "Among elite schools, the University of Virginia may well be the worst of the worst. "

This is a very eye opening and enlightening article and well worth anyone's time to read.

This is in response to the underlying thread of comments re: the number of sexual assaults last weekend at UVA. I'm not trying to indicate in any way that JM is part of this elite -- just that it's very common on campuses like UVA to look the other way as things like this occur and that young women are discouraged from reporting.

 

[bakerlady]

"Longo declined to discuss two other young women who were attacked during the week. One day after Graham disappeared, a UVA student was raped near campus, and the following day, a young woman from Charlottesville was found unconscious, badly beaten and likely raped nearby. Asked why the public had not been informed, Longo held up the routine police reports delivered to news organizations daily."

http://wvtf.org/post/charlottesville...ss-graham-case

In retrospect I kind of find that offensive that he did not make an attempt to answer the reporters questions about those 2 assaults. Yes it was not about Hannah but it was 2 other women, someones daughters, and the public deserves to know about those crimes as much as missing Hannah.

Has anyone been arrested for those crimes yet?

 

[SuzDuJour]

I'm hoping against hope that she is found alive, but if she isn't, I pray she is found in time for a clear cause of death, so that alcohol or drugs doesn't muddy the waters if she was possibly strangled. I'd hate for a defense to be "she overdosed" if there was a more malicious COD.