Wrongful death trial begins. Trial coverage and discussion

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I absolutely agree that JS might have been angry with RZ because from what we've been told, Max's accident occurred while she was the only adult in the house with him.

But to me, in the scenario we're talking about, that type of (righteous) anger in a normal person would probably lead at the worst to an ugly relationship breakup. I personally couldn't continue in a relationship with someone if I thought his/her negligence resulted in the death of my 6-year-old. But I can't imagine that a normal person's anger would extend to being okay that the person subsequently died horrifically, or being okay with a slipshod death investigation with the goal of closing the case as a suicide.

I've always though JS initiated the cover up as soon as he learned of RZ's death and somehow got the SDSO to play along, but I've also always thought his motivation was to sweep everything under the rug as quickly as possible so as not to tarnish his image/the image of his company.

Of course, I could be 100 percent wrong.

BBM. By "coverup", are you saying that JS knew a crime was committed against Rebecca, that she was murdered by someone he knew (his brother, ex-wife, etc), and that he wanted to conceal the crime? Or simply that because he was in process of selling his company that he didn't want anything to ruin that business transaction including a murder against his gf?
 
IIRC, Mr. Greer stated on Tricia’s radio show that the handwriting expert will testify it is his belief the person who wrote those letters had to between the height of 5’ 10” - 6 feet tall.

And I agree, the S does stand out as being different.

Yep handwriting expert testifies on Thurs, as will kinesiologist who will testify it's impossible for Rebecca to get herself over the balcony all tied up and fling herself over without leaving any marks on balcony railing and there had to be someone else who lowered her down or slowed down process of fall because otherwise her head from the tremendous speedy fall would have decapitated her head.

Fingerprint expert and knife expert to testify tomorrow. Also the cop whose footprint was on balcony will also be on and family counselor who rode alongside Rebecca on way to children's hospital with Max in ambulance will also testify to say Rebecca was not suicidal either tomorrow or Wed.
 
About the book on witchcraft Greer said it was not allowed in evidence. It was said to be irrelevant.

Makes you wonder with all the relevant info 20/20 could have included, they chose the irrelevant witchcraft book.

On second thought, it doesn't make me wonder.
 
BBM. By "coverup", are you saying that JS knew a crime was committed against Rebecca, that she was murdered by someone he knew (his brother, ex-wife, etc), and that he wanted to conceal the crime? Or simply that because he was in process of selling his company that he didn't want anything to ruin that business transaction including a murder against his gf?

That's a really good question I'm not sure I have the answer to, bourne. I can't know what JS knew or what role he played in the events leading up to Rebecca's murder.

My anger is primarily directed at the "death investigators," because they're supposed to represent the blue line between victims and perpetrators, and in this case, they were so very obviously not doing their job. The SDSO was corrupted somehow in their investigation of this case, and I've always assumed it was at the prompting/direction of JS and his PR machine. My impression is that JS wanted the "messes" that had occurred at Spreckels cleaned up, STAT, I assume to preserve his image and that of Medicis (which, by the way, he's still the CEO of, according to Wikipedia).

Heck, small town cops who only see a murder every decade or so have more curiosity and concern for the victim than SDSO showed in this case.

Why didn't SDSO do a real investigation? Who was behind the decision not to?
 
That's a really good question I'm not sure I have the answer to, bourne. I can't know what JS knew or what role he played in the events leading up to Rebecca's murder.

My anger is primarily directed at the "death investigators," because they're supposed to represent the blue line between victims and perpetrators, and in this case, they were so very obviously not doing their job. The SDSO was corrupted somehow in their investigation of this case, and I've always assumed it was at the prompting/direction of JS and his PR machine. My impression is that JS wanted the "messes" that had occurred at Spreckels cleaned up, STAT, I assume to preserve his image and that of Medicis (which, by the way, he's still the CEO of, according to Wikipedia).

Heck, small town cops who only see a murder every decade or so have more curiosity and concern for the victim than SDSO showed in this case.

Why didn't SDSO do a real investigation? Who was behind the decision not to?

I recall in the past there was some discussion that SDSO may have "put the blinders on" in this investigation on their own, without anyone specifically asking them to do so. If you read comments in some of the news stories at the time, many locals, some community leaders, definitely felt that SDSO "blinkered" their investigation and hand picked evidence.

Comment at this article from a former member of the San Diego Crime Commission

https://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2011/sep/14/citylights2-rebecca-zahau/?page=2#

All we can do is support Keith Greer and the Zahau family in hopes they prevail in this civil trial and hope the SDSO can be pressured to reopen the investigation. It's not the perfect answer, but it's the best that can be done for now. The new evidence Greer introduced will make it pretty much impossible for SDSO to avoid it. The sheriff has always said he'll reopen the investigation if new evidence comes to light. Well, new evidence has been revealed, so there's no excuse not to reopen it. But for now, let's focus on winning the civil trial.
 
That's a really good question I'm not sure I have the answer to, bourne. I can't know what JS knew or what role he played in the events leading up to Rebecca's murder.

My anger is primarily directed at the "death investigators," because they're supposed to represent the blue line between victims and perpetrators, and in this case, they were so very obviously not doing their job. The SDSO was corrupted somehow in their investigation of this case, and I've always assumed it was at the prompting/direction of JS and his PR machine. My impression is that JS wanted the "messes" that had occurred at Spreckels cleaned up, STAT, I assume to preserve his image and that of Medicis (which, by the way, he's still the CEO of, according to Wikipedia).

Heck, small town cops who only see a murder every decade or so have more curiosity and concern for the victim than SDSO showed in this case.

Why didn't SDSO do a real investigation? Who was behind the decision not to?

Interesting. Generally when someone uses the word “coverup” they are insinuating the person covering up knew a crime occurred because that person was directly involved in the crime. It appeared that’s what you were saying but you say you don’t know and assume Jonah directed investigators to quickly clean up and close case. Why do you believe Jonah would have compelled investigators to do so? What would be his motive and objective if not to protect himself and his brother?
 
I recall in the past there was some discussion that SDSO may have "put the blinders on" in this investigation on their own, without anyone specifically asking them to do so. If you read comments in some of the news stories at the time, many locals, some community leaders, definitely felt that SDSO "blinkered" their investigation and hand picked evidence.

Comment at this article from a former member of the San Diego Crime Commission

https://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2011/sep/14/citylights2-rebecca-zahau/?page=2#

All we can do is support Keith Greer and the Zahau family in hopes they prevail in this civil trial and hope the SDSO can be pressured to reopen the investigation. It's not the perfect answer, but it's the best that can be done for now. The new evidence Greer introduced will make it pretty much impossible for SDSO to avoid it. The sheriff has always said he'll reopen the investigation if new evidence comes to light. Well, new evidence has been revealed, so there's no excuse not to reopen it. But for now, let's focus on winning the civil trial.

Wow, the SD Crime Commission comment sounds like something I could've written! I will try to take your advice and focus on winning the civil trial.
 
Interesting. Generally when someone uses the word “coverup” they are insinuating the person covering up knew a crime occurred because that person was directly involved in the crime. It appeared that’s what you were saying but you say you don’t know and assume Jonah directed investigators to quickly clean up and close case. Why do you believe Jonah would have compelled investigators to do so? What would be his motive and objective if not to protect himself and his brother?

I give up. Either I'm not thinking clearly or not expressing myself clearly to you.
 
I give up. Either I'm not thinking clearly or not expressing myself clearly to you.

All I ask was what’s the motive for Jonah “covering up”. How hard can that be? Only seeking to understand your perspective. We’re only giving our opinions here. It’s not ironclad evidence. Lol
 
It seems mighty convenient for the witchcraft book to be placed in the guest room where she was hung and that out of all the books, the officer was able to pick out this specific book with a few pages of a nude woman bound with red rope. If I'm not mistaken, the search was done on 8/15/2011 and not in the immediate days subsequent to Rebecca's death?

I wonder who directed the investigators to re-search that room and specifically seek out that book?

I recall in the beginnings of her death, there were kitty litter posters pointing out the witch book claiming Rebecca practiced witchcraft and used that book to tie herself up as a witch...That indicated to me the anti-Rebecca posters were intimately connected to the case, quite possibly Dina, Jonah and their immediate family members and friends since strangers like most of us posters on WS would not know about this witchcraft book.
I noticed a long time ago that posts disappeared from that particular website, (like magic!) which was (and is) interesting, but not very. However, I have since come to realize that more than a few posts are missing from this website, and that is interesting indeed. I don't have examples, but you will see it, too, if you read through some older threads. The flow is - changed.

IDK what this might mean, or if it even matters, and of course I can't prove a thing, so call it my opinion.
What could be the purpose of such an edit, do you think?
 
Hi Everyone,

There is a huge gap of time between when I first posted on this case and when I started following it again.

During that time it appears there were many posts made that might have violated our terms of service.

I'm not as worried about what was said in the past, however, if you do come across a post, no matter how old, and you feel it violates our rules or is otherwise inappropriate please do not hesitate to alert on the post so it can be removed.

It is from here on out I am concerned with.

The fact that Websleuths is going against Law Enforcement's finding of suicide is a big thing for us. Websleuths management and members are not naive enough to think law enforcement is correct all the time. Not at all but in this case, law enforcement agencies are adamant that Rebecca killed herself.

When Keith Greer filed the lawsuit on behalf of Rebecca's family, he included Max's mom Dina claiming Dina was involved in Rebecca's death. It was only when Greer received the hospital footage proving that Dina was at the hospital with her son Max that she was dropped from the lawsuit. Greer publicly apologized to Dina, and that left Adam.

Before we get to Adam, Dina did not kill Rebecca. There is nothing to suggest she had anything to do with any part of Rebecca's death. I know some of you feel that Rebecca blurting out "Dina will kill me" somehow speaks to Dina's guilt. It does not. She did not have a really good relationship with Dina. She was watching her son, and under her watch, Max had a deadly accident.

For Rebecca to blurt this out is normal IMO and indicates nothing about Dina personally.

If we are sitting here discussing things like Dina's involvement by suggesting she and Adam cooked this up there is nothing to suggest this whatsoever. Nothing.

Dina not only lost her only child but she had to suffer being publically accused of murder. She has been through enough.

One of our rules at Websleuths is you can't accuse people of murder that are not currently under suspicion. The last thing I want is for Websleuths to be one of the places on the Internet that still piles on Dina. There is nothing there. Could she have worked with Jonah and convinced Adam to kill Rebecca? There is no evidence to even hint at this. How do you prove a negative? We have no idea who she talked with and what was said, but nothing has come out to slightly hint that this is a probable scenario. The talks could have happened, but that is just throwing this idea out there with nothing to back it up.

Let's talk about Jonah. Again, nothing to suggest he asked his brother to do anything. Could he have set Adam up to this? No evidence suggests this, but it is possible. Like with Dina what do we have as evidence to even suggest this is even slightly a possibility?

My friends, I have a conundrum here. I can certainly see why people might think Jonah might be involved in the killing through his brother. Then again, law enforcement, the agencies Websleuths looks to for guidance in cases, flat out say this is not a murder.

What should Websleuths allow as far as the discussions?

How about a compromise of sorts. Since this case is already turning our rules upside down let's agree that out of the two, Dina or Jonah, it would be Jonah, who would be the one to discuss the murder with Adam IF THAT IS WHAT HE DID.

Let's leave Dina out of this OK? Logically, she is not only the least likely to be involved in any way she has, as I said before, been through enough. We do not need to discuss anything about her other than if you find something solid that connects her to Rebecca's death.

Jonah, again, nothing to suggest he did anything wrong but he is the closest to his brother plus is he lying about the phone call where he left the message to Rebecca to protect his brother? Keith Greer thinks so.


Jonah said Max was not doing well at all when he called and left the message. Greer says that is not true. At the time there were signs of Max possibly doing a bit better. Who is telling the truth? It could be that Max was looking better, but Jonah very well might have left a negative message for Rebecca anyway.

As long as you do not claim as a fact that Jonah is involved in the killing of Rebecca, we will allow limited discussion. As long as you speculate and offer your opinion on what possibly might have happened and as long as you keep your opinions in the realm of reality OK.

I reserve the right to change my mind on this decision.

My apologies for the long post. As I said, this is new ground we are covering.

Thank you for your patience.
Tricia
 
Thanks for your post setting parameters, Tricia. If it makes you feel any better about Websleuths being in disagreement with the San Diego Sheriff who is “adamant that Rebecca killed herself”, it helps to remember that they were also adamant that the McStay family was seen on video walking into Mexico. Not even close. They were dead. But it took several years for their remains to be accidentally found in another county. In the meantime, the investigation in San Diego county left a lot to be desired. So, although I’m normally very supportive of LE’s efforts, as WS is, there are a number of other cases that have had questionable investigations in San Diego. I don’t think WS is out of line questioning this one. Hang in there. :)
 
I still remember watching the live coverage of the "investigation" that first day.
I looked at my husband and told him that I wouldn't believe any conclusion these cops came to.
Once they let Rebecca lay out there fully exposed and filmed by news helicopters?
It was over for me. They lost all respect, credibility or hope for an honest investigation.
Looking forward to this continuing tomorrow.
 
All I ask was what’s the motive for Jonah “covering up”. How hard can that be? Only seeking to understand your perspective. We’re only giving our opinions here. It’s not ironclad evidence. Lol

Medicis stock prices.

Follow the money.
 
does anyone here have any pictures of the bedroom please, in particular the wicker chair which was overturned? ( cynic has amazing pictures by the way...with the copy detail - super helpful)
 
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