Recovered/Located NV - Ronnie (found deceased) & Beverly Barker (taken for med care), RV trip, Stagecoach, 27 Mar 2022

[Kecharaeq2]

Going way back to the Donner Party, where 42 members of the group died. Supposedly they were given incorrect advice about a shortcut and got stranded, then entrapped by heavy snow.

There’s also the difficulty of lack of street signs, which greatly increases the likelihood of getting lost. Back roads haven’t improved much since the Donner Party.

 

[Awsi Dooger]

People who travel in the Western United States cannot rely on electronic devices and GPS systems.

That's the best summary. I never use GPS in those states other than directions within a city. As soon as I became aware of this case yesterday I checked the map and it was obvious what happened...either Ronnie Barker decided to take the (apparent) short cut on 265 looping back to rejoin 95, or his GPS told him to do so. Far more likely, the latter is what happened. And once he turns off on the little 265 road pulling a huge rig like that, he's got to be aware that a sharp left turn at Silver Peak is required to rejoin 95. If he looks at a map or even a GPS screen he'll know that. But blindly following GPS in the West can lead to loads of trouble. I doubt a couple from Indiana would be familiar with the region and potential problems.

I checked the devoted Facebook page today. Many posters have done an excellent job posting the coordinates and the route. The mistake was caused by ridiculous signage in Silver Peak. Someone on that page included close ups of the specific signs at the critical juncture. Instead of huge normal traffic signs including "To 95" with a big leftward arrow, some genius brainstormed that Silver Peak merely needed a cutesy tower cluster of small narrow signs, like the ones for pedestrian traffic in an amusement park. Imagine an elderly couple from the midwest driving near dusk and approaching a cluster like that. They probably didn't see it at all or identify what it was. The dusty left turn was right there and the images included on Facebook revealed it was plenty wide and sweeping enough for a rig to negotiate. But without adequate signage the road itself appears considerably more substantial and normal if you continue straight ahead. That's obviously what they did. Their signal was either already lost or soon to be lost. Then a series of unfortunate choices upon ascending the mountain, with nowhere to turn around.

Fortunately I moved West long before GPS, first to go to college then settling in Las Vegas in 1984. It is no fun driving north or south in Nevada. That trek from Las Vegas to Reno takes forever and is a mental strain. You are always nervous about vehicular condition and amount of fuel. Then once GPS became available I was shocked at all the idiotic routes it was suggesting for me in those wide open states. Not a chance I'm doing that. But I was only aware because I had already made those trips several times. I remember how stubborn my dad was when he visited me in Las Vegas with his new prized Tom Tom GPS. This was maybe 2005 or 2006. We made trips together into Utah and Arizona and California. I told him to ignore the GPS. He refused to do so, until we ended up wandering and wasting on multiple occasions.

 

[zecats]

Looking at google maps, if you search for the route from Luning to Tonapah, then add in the location of the RV and the watch ping, you get something like this.
Google Maps

C - Nivloc Rd. Where the last ping was
D - 37.757753, -117.809568 - Where the RV was found
E - 37.75325, -117.82469 - Where the watch sent out the automatic message (presumably when Beverly was airlifted back into cell range)

All I can think is that it was getting late, so they looked at the map and, for whatever reason, decide to stop in Silver Peak, not realizing that it didn’t have services.
If you look at the map, it seems like it should be possible to get from Silver Peak to Dyer (where gas and an RV park are) by cutting straight through on Coyote Rd and reducing mileage off the trip… and you probably can do this, but it takes you out onto dirt roads and goat paths. It almost looks to me like they turned left too early, so rather than going around the mountain, they went up further into the hills. Then they got stuck in the mud with the RV (possibly while trying to turn around) and then became stuck again with the Kia. It’s a tragedy for friends and family, but you can kind of see how it could happen, especially in snowy or muddy conditions. When I first moved to Arizona, I was surprised by just how much snow we got. You generally don’t equate Arizona or Nevada with mud and snow.

As always, MOO

It's about altitude, not latitude. Heard that plenty of times in the desert Southwest.

 

[zecats]

Gps and electronic maps will helpfully show you how to get wherever you want to go, but don't include details like old fashioned paper maps used to, showing the type of road, ie unpaved, etc. I always drive with good old paper maps, even if I'm only going to use it once while visiting a new place.

JMO

RSBM

I so agree with you. I actually enjoy planning trips with road atlases and maps. Hubby does most of the driving and I do the navigating. Always with updated paper maps. I trust them much more, especially after reading all the "Death by GPS" articles.

One wonders if Bev and Ronnie depended solely on GPS, or if they did have paper maps with them.

 

[Limecat]

This is extremely sad news. Ron was a good friend and I'll miss him. I'm glad Bev made it. I hope we get answers soon. I haven't read all of this thread so I may be wrong, but this does seem like it may have been a situation where they simply got lost? Why on earth did the authorities wait so freaking long to search?

I’m so sorry for your loss. This is just so tragic.

 

[mickey2942]

Two things that never end well...

"Here, hold my beer" and "Look, let's take this shortcut".

Not making light of this situation. I know better myself, and I have definitely taught my kids too. Yet, I have gone "off road" for a "shortcut" myself. Fortunately, no bad outcomes. We always have a full tank of gas, a cooler, and we know the area. Never at night.

Sad for this outcome.

 

[Kecharaeq2]

RSBM

I so agree with you. I actually enjoy planning trips with road atlases and maps. Hubby does most of the driving and I do the navigating. Always with updated paper maps. I trust them much more, especially after reading all the "Death by GPS" articles.

One wonders if Bev and Ronnie depended solely on GPS, or if they did have paper maps with them.

They strike me as the type to be prepared so I would think that they did have paper maps but didn’t realize they’d need them until after they were already in trouble, then couldn’t get turned back around. I’m just sorry that it took so long to get to them and that the lack of cell service hampered locating them.

 

[mickey2942]

They strike me as the type to be prepared so I would think that they did have paper maps but didn’t realize they’d need them until after they were already in trouble, then couldn’t get turned back around. I’m just sorry that it took so long to get to them and that the lack of cell service hampered locating them.

I am too. My husband used to do SAR, he just wishes that folks who come out West for trips, understood that cell service is spotty, out here, once you leave major Interstates, and even on the Interstate, it is spotty.

And unlike back East, there isn't a gas station, with a McDonald's and gift store every 10 or 15 miles, like the I-95 from FL to NY. This time of year is especially tricky, it seems like "good weather", in lower elevations. But the combination of higher elevation, and latitude on the map, means huge climate difference from the Midwest, which doesn't deal with weather issues and elevation.

 

[Kecharaeq2]

I am too. My husband used to do SAR, he just wishes that folks who come out West for trips, understood that cell service is spotty, out here, once you leave major Interstates, and even on the Interstate, it is spotty.

And unlike back East, there isn't a gas station, with a McDonald's and gift store every 10 or 15 miles, like the I-95 from FL to NY. This time of year is especially tricky, it seems like "good weather", in lower elevations. But the combination of higher elevation, and latitude on the map, means huge climate difference from the Midwest, which doesn't deal with weather issues and elevation.

I hear ya, when I first moved to the White Mountains area of Arizona from San Diego, I had to change my carrier and it still dies once you get out of town, up towards the Indian reservation here.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

I’m so sorry for your loss. This is just so tragic.

Thanks, I appreciate it. Let's keep his family in our thoughts - don't worry about me. He was really a great guy and early in my career, he really helped me gain some perspective. I probably didn't appreciate it as much then but as I've gotten older, I certainly do. Ron and Bev were both prolific travelers and as such, I didn't get to meet up with him as much as I would've liked. I remember the last lunch I had with them and we talked the usual things - our love of tech (we are both fans of the old Commodore Amiga computer) and gadgets and events in our lives. At the time, he had just come off a major battle with cancer and had lost parts of his lungs but he still looked good given what he had just gone through. I think the last time I saw him was around Christmas or so a few years ago, and we ran into each other at a local Italian place - he was at a corporate dinner and I was with my wife. I jumped up, he saw me, and we had a great big hug. I overheard him at his table telling his coworkers about me and our relationship and how I was probably the best tech person he ever worked with. It meant a lot to me then and maybe even more now.

I guess the only solace we can take from this - and it does sound cliche, I know - is that Ron really loved exploring the world and he died following his passion, with the love of his life by his side. Speaking for myself, the wife and I have talked about retiring with an RV and I'm going to take some practical lessons from this incident if we go down that road.

 

[Kecharaeq2]

Thanks, I appreciate it. Let's keep his family in our thoughts - don't worry about me. He was really a great guy and early in my career, he really helped me gain some perspective. I probably didn't appreciate it as much then but as I've gotten older, I certainly do. Ron and Bev were both prolific travelers and as such, I didn't get to meet up with him as much as I would've liked. I remember the last lunch I had with them and we talked the usual things - our love of tech (we are both fans of the old Commodore Amiga computer) and gadgets and events in our lives. At the time, he had just come off a major battle with cancer and had lost parts of his lungs but he still looked good given what he had just gone through. I think the last time I saw him was around Christmas or so a few years ago, and we ran into each other at a local Italian place - he was at a corporate dinner and I was with my wife. I jumped up, he saw me, and we had a great big hug. I overheard him at his table telling his coworkers about me and our relationship and how I was probably the best tech person he ever worked with. It meant a lot to me then and maybe even more now.

I guess the only solace we can take from this - and it does sound cliche, I know - is that Ron really loved exploring the world and he died following his passion, with the love of his life by his side. Speaking for myself, the wife and I have talked about retiring with an RV and I'm going to take some practical lessons from this incident if we go down that road.

I don’t think it’s cliche at all. How many people out there can say a friend or family member truly died doing what they loved or following their dreams? I think that’s all too rare, personally. It is still a very overwhelming situation for you and all who loved him best, but there is solace in knowing he was living his dream and that his wife was able to be by his side, though it was hardest on her.

 

[Lilibet]

We were full-time RVers from 2003-2011. Our fifth wheel was our home. Even though we got a Garmin GPS early on, as navigator I always used paper maps. In parts of the country even those aren’t adequate because they don’t tell you how steep the highway or road is and what the clearance is under overpasses and bridges. This is why we got Mountain Directories for Truckers for both the west and the east coasts. While they don’t cover every possible road an RV might travel, they are quite helpful. But I’m sure every RVer who has travelled secondary roads (not Interstates) can tell stories about getting lost or making a wrong turn, and most of us lived to tell the tale and learned from the experience. Sadly, this road was a tragedy for the Barkers, for whatever reason they ended up on it. My heart goes out to Beverly and their family and friends, and I hope she recovers physically, if not emotionally from this ordeal.

https://www.amazon.com/Mountain-Directory-Truckers-Motorhome-Drivers/dp/0964680564

And @IndyColtsFan, my deepest sympathy for your loss. Ron and Bev sound like people we’d all enjoy knowing.

If you and your wife decide to retire with an RV, I wish you “Happy Trails.” There are lots of folks out there you can learn from and enjoy meeting. One tip, never, ever ask a non-RVer if you can drive a particular road or if your RV will fit in their driveway. They have no clue! Don’t ask me how I know.

 

[killarney rose]

According to this article they were found along with the Kia.

yes, per the article, that’s where they were found with the Soul.

 

[IceIce9]

This is an amazing story, including information from Bev.
Indianapolis man missing in Nevada dies; wife taken to hospital | wthr.com

UPDATE 9:22 EDT 4/6/22
If anyone would like to see my full interview it will be on at 10:00pm Indiana time / 7pm Nevada time. Just open Facebook and go to the WTHR-TV homepage and out Facebook live segment will begin. I’m not use to being on that side of the lens.

UPDATE 8:02pm EDT 4/6/22
I don't even know how to tell everyone the story... I will try to tell the best I can.

About 6:15pm we received a group video call from Jennifer. Like you all, we were waiting anxiously to hear how Bev is doing and get some details about what happened. Jennifer appeared on the phone and waited for everyone to appear.... she was sitting in the driver's seat of a car so we assumed she was headed to the hotel after visiting with Bev. There was a gasp of astonishment when Jennifer simply panned the phone over and there was Beverly sitting in the passenger seat of the rental car. You guys cannot imagine the rush of emotion that shot thru us all.... we anticipated Jennifer was going to tell us what happened, but instead we were given the story directly from Beverly.

 

[IceIce9]

More from link above:


They stayed with their vehicle and Ronnie would tap out SOS signals on the horn every 10 minutes. Ronnie taught Bev the pattern and she would do the same throughout the 9 day ordeal. It was cold at night. Bev said the temps dropped to roughly 27. She never mentioned hunger as an issue, but thirst was their enemy. I'm unsure of when things got to the point that Bev had to begin taking care of my uncle as the dehydration began to pull the life from him. Bev mentioned finding the strength to a long way to get snow that remained along a ridge. She used her walker for balance and she had bags that she would fill with snow before returning to uncle Ronnie. She mentioned using N95 masks that they had in the car to hold the snow. My uncle Ronnie was dying, and there was nothing they could do but honk that horn and try to melt snow for drink.

 

[IceIce9]

Unbelievably, sadly, Ronnie passed away on April 4, just one day before they were found.

Indianapolis man missing in Nevada dies; wife taken to hospital | wthr.com

We thank them all for their coverage of this harrowing story, and we ask that they continue to follow us as we try to get things changed so that no family has to struggle for the help we were seeking. Ronnie Barker passed away on Monday 4/4. Beverly was rescued roughly 21 hours later. Had proper steps been taken from the moment they were reported as missing, my Uncle would be alive today. Your inability to deal with this situation cost my uncle his life. I hope that haunts you for the rest of yours

 

[Awsi Dooger]

Here is the critical juncture I mentioned in a prior post. I saw this on Facebook but rather than use their links I took Google Maps to the same spot. It enables several views that will allow greater perspective.

This is headed on 265 going south. They would already have gone through the bulk of Silver Peak, with the depressing sights of abandoned buildings and cars. That may have been weighing on their mind, especially if they were tired and either sensed trouble or already lost cell phone and GPS signals. They needed to turn left right here. If they had done so, everything would be fine. Note the wide available space for a sweeping turn. You can see the tire tracks of vehicles that did make the turn. But more importantly note the lack of any prominent road signs, or any indication whatsoever of an important junction. By all visible norms the major route continues straight ahead:

Google Maps

And here is a closeup of the stupid road sign, the one I said looks like something out of a tourist attraction, for pedestrians to stare at and take pictures alongside. This is what the Barkers were supposed to decipher while barreling town the highway in their RV. The route needed was arrow left toward Tonopah or Goldfield. Instead they apparently continued straight ahead, which would be right according to the sign, toward Lida or Dyer.

Google Maps

Here's another ridiculous aspect that makes the turnoff even more problematic, if you are not familiar with the area. The left turn from 265 was not a typical 90 degree turn that would have been obvious on approach. The turn is back left at a severe angle. Easily missed, especially given the inept signage. This angle below is taken from the opposite side of the first view I posted. In other words, the Barkers were driving toward this camera angle. The road they were supposed to take is the one veering off to the right. Note the tower of signs in the middle. They were supposed to slow severely and make a sweeping left turn onto a seemingly obscure dirt road. It was not much different than a U Turn:

Google Maps

 

[zecats]

Unbelievably, sadly, Ronnie passed away on April 4, just one day before they were found.

Indianapolis man missing in Nevada dies; wife taken to hospital | wthr.com

We thank them all for their coverage of this harrowing story, and we ask that they continue to follow us as we try to get things changed so that no family has to struggle for the help we were seeking. Ronnie Barker passed away on Monday 4/4. Beverly was rescued roughly 21 hours later. Had proper steps been taken from the moment they were reported as missing, my Uncle would be alive today. Your inability to deal with this situation cost my uncle his life. I hope that haunts you for the rest of yours

From your link, a tribute to Ron Barker: So sad that he died only the day before the rescue.

Ronnie Barker loved his family and loved his country. He served our nation proud over his 26-year career in the United States Air Force. Ronnie was a believer in our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. He was proud of his faith and was always willing to give to others. He was funny, witty, and was the spark of energy that everyone gravitated toward. People just loved and wanted to be around Ron Barker.

Our family grieves over this news, and we question the roadblocks that seemed to stifle the search from the moment we were made aware of their disappearance. It's our hope that Ronnie Barker's legacy will be changing policy that will allow for a more expeditious approach to locating missing persons of all ages for both non-residents and residents of the state of Nevada. We call upon the citizens of Nevada to stand up and demand that changes be made at ALL levels of Public Safety to avoid the hurdles that our family faced as we attempted to bring resources into the search of our loved ones.

Fly high MSgt Ronnie E. Barker, you served us all well.

Ronnie Ercel Barker 11/21/1949 - 4/4/2022"

 

[buyerninety]

Zecats said;
"Posters on the FB page stated several times how GPS had
led them off of 95 by heading towards Silver Peak. But
once there, the turn was left on a road which headed back
to 95 south of Tonopah. I really don't understand why
they"[R & B Barker]"apparently turned right and headed
up into a mountainous area."

OldCop said;
"Did they mistakenly turn right instead of left when they
got to Silver Peak?"

Mentioned previous in this WS thread & on Facebook,
the poorly signposted intersection (as at 7th April 2022)
may have played a part in this fatal matter. Here's that
intersection of State Route 265 (NV265) and Alkali Rd;

https://goo.gl/maps/7Fm9XPe2EuAAwRQv5

Some nice, publically minded person(s) in Silver Peak
have placed a signpost (visible by zooming to center of
picture). It should be noted to The Nevada Department
of Transportation (NDOT) that an approprite highway
sign, with arrow, stating something like 'To 95' (with
appropriate U.S. Route 95 symbol) needs to be emplaced
by NDOT either before the SR 265 (NV265) & Alkali Rd
intersection (or before any of the other smaller roads in
Silver Peak that give access east to Silverpeak Rd, and
hence to US 95 eventually, the appropriate sign location
as may best be determined by an NDOT engineer).
Probably best if a voting resident of Nevada reported this
signage matter;
Contact Us | Nevada Department of Transportation

 

[SuziQ]

Here is the critical juncture I mentioned in a prior post. I saw this on Facebook but rather than use their links I took Google Maps to the same spot. It enables several views that will allow greater perspective.

This is headed on 265 going south. They would already have gone through the bulk of Silver Peak, with the depressing sights of abandoned buildings and cars. That may have been weighing on their mind, especially if they were tired and either sensed trouble or already lost cell phone and GPS signals. They needed to turn left right here. If they had done so, everything would be fine. Note the wide available space for a sweeping turn. You can see the tire tracks of vehicles that did make the turn. But more importantly note the lack of any prominent road signs, or any indication whatsoever of an important junction. By all visible norms the major route continues straight ahead:

Google Maps

And here is a closeup of the stupid road sign, the one I said looks like something out of a tourist attraction, for pedestrians to stare at and take pictures alongside. This is what the Barkers were supposed to decipher while barreling town the highway in their RV. The route needed was arrow left toward Tonopah or Goldfield. Instead they apparently continued straight ahead, which would be right according to the sign, toward Lida or Dyer.

Google Maps

Here's another ridiculous aspect that makes the turnoff even more problematic, if you are not familiar with the area. The left turn from 265 was not a typical 90 degree turn that would have been obvious on approach. The turn is back left at a severe angle. Easily missed, especially given the inept signage. This angle below is taken from the opposite side of the first view I posted. In other words, the Barkers were driving toward this camera angle. The road they were supposed to take is the one veering off to the right. Note the tower of signs in the middle. They were supposed to slow severely and make a sweeping left turn onto a seemingly obscure dirt road. It was not much different than a U Turn:

Google Maps

Oh man. That is ridiculous that it isn't marked. I would have done the same as these poor people.