Found Deceased MO - Carol Schulte, 72, experienced hiker, van in pkg lot, near Al Foster Trailhead, Wildwood, St. Louis, 23 May 2022

[BeckyF]

This article from Channel 5 states “The official cause and manner of death would be determined by the Jefferson County Medical Examiner's Office.” The article seems to be saying that it wasn’t thought to be a drowning but I don’t know if that could have been accurately assessed that quickly. (?) The article also says that her body didn’t show any obvious signs of injuries. I feel like her family and friends have been through a nightmare this past week. I‘m not sure what to hope for for them at this point.

Body of woman who went missing in Wildwood found in Meramec River

Carol Schulte's family confirmed her body was recovered from the Meramec River Monday night.

www.ksdk.com

This is an updated article.

Body of woman who went missing in Wildwood found in Meramec River

Carol Schulte's family confirmed her body was recovered from the Meramec River Monday night.

www.ksdk.com

Note this statement: Later, investigators ruled out a drowning incident, a spokesperson with the Missouri State Highway Patrol said.

 

[BeckyF]

It's an interesting point about the workers on the trail @FrogChair.

It doesn't seem that any workers were around when Carol parked up or surely thay would have told her the path was closed due to maintenance? Or possibly they hadn't started work that early in the morning?

Also, has it ever been said who found Carol's minivan? Was it the trail workers or the police?

AFAIK nothing has been said regarding who found the vehicle, who towed it, etc.

 

[FrogChair]

She didn't drown & there are no obvious injuries?

I guess we will have to wait for cause & manner of death. Not sure how the two possibilities mentioned can be determined by anyone other than the medical examiner.

ME will determine whether manner of death is natural death, accidental death, homicide, suicide, or undermined.

Thank you for the info. I was curious to learn how an ME determines that someone drowned. Found this portion of a peer-reviewed paper. After reading this, it seems very clear that it is not something that could have been determined today at the scene of recovery.

Diagnostic of Drowning in Forensic Medicine​

https://www.intechopen.com/chapters/19161

 

[wary]

This is an updated article.

Body of woman who went missing in Wildwood found in Meramec River

Carol Schulte's family confirmed her body was recovered from the Meramec River Monday night.

www.ksdk.com

Note this statement: Later, investigators ruled out a drowning incident, a spokesperson with the Missouri State Highway Patrol said.

I wonder if that statement is really accurate.

Does it leave room for anything but foul play?

Unless I’m missing some possibilities? How could a natural, accidental, or suicidal death have someone ending up in the river, dead, but not having drowned?

 

[sarajordan2993]

I never post on any threads, im a silent reader but I can’t help but wonder…. It was stated that her body had “no visible injuries.” The Meramec is loaded with debris, especially when flooded, and the flow of the river, from Al Foster Trail to the area where the body was found, has many turns in the flow of water. How did her body not get caught up in debris, let alone not be “injured?”

 

[FrogChair]

I wonder if that statement is really accurate.

Does it leave room for anything but foul play?

Unless I’m missing some possibilities? How could a natural, accidental, or suicidal death have someone ending up in the river, dead, but not having drowned?

I wonder, too. Developing stories very frequently contain inaccuracies. I‘ll try to withhold suspicions about foul play until I know that a qualified LE or medical person really said it wasn’t a drowning.

 

[FrogChair]

I never post on any threads, im a silent reader but I can’t help but wonder…. It was stated that her body had “no visible injuries.” The Meramec is loaded with debris, especially when flooded, and the flow of the river, from Al Foster Trail to the area where the body was found, has many turns in the flow of water. How did her body not get caught up in debris, let alone not be “injured?”

I thought about that, too. Perhaps they’re making a cursory distinction between ante- and post-mortem abrasions? (Can that distinction even be made in the field? I don’t know.) Perhaps they meant “no obvious injuries that could have caused death”.
You are totally right about the debris, twists and turns and so on.

 

[FrogChair]

AFAIK nothing has been said regarding who found the vehicle, who towed it, etc.

Here’s a tweet by a local news person showing Carol’s van being towed. I can’t remember where I saw a discussion about where it was being taken so I’ll wait to comment on that until I can verify my memory and see if the source seems credible.

 

[BeckyF]

I never post on any threads, im a silent reader but I can’t help but wonder…. It was stated that her body had “no visible injuries.” The Meramec is loaded with debris, especially when flooded, and the flow of the river, from Al Foster Trail to the area where the body was found, has many turns in the flow of water. How did her body not get caught up in debris, let alone not be “injured?”

I think it is a misstatement. How would they even know that? Per the linked article, her body was still in the river at 6:40 PM. (Unless that is inaccurate).

 

[FrogChair]

Wow. This is terrible news! Her body either traveled the river a very long way from where her car was found or she was put into the river closer to where she was found. Or [insert theory here]?

Of course, the river has been described as dangerously high right now.

RIP, Carol
Condolences to her family & friends

Yes, does anyone know what an “average” distance is for a victim to be carried by a river? This seems like a long distance in light of the twists, the inlets/sloughs and all the debris in the river, but is this actually pretty typical in a river that’s running high? I would think “normal distance” would be a very complicated calculation to make. Part of me thinks it‘s amazing she was found at all. A young man named Jon Franklin disappeared on a float trip on the Meramec on May 31, 2013 and he still has not been found. Here’s a link to the FB page for him. Someone (I guess his mom) posts messages there for him all the time. Bring Jon Franklin Home
Edit: I think it’s his dad who makes the posts.

 

[sarajordan2993]

I think it is a misstatement. How would they even know that? Per the linked article, her body was still in the river at 6:40 PM. (Unless that is inaccurate).

You do have a point. However, if she fell off the bank and into the river. she would’ve surely had some sort of bruising. However, I’m just speculating, definitely not an expert.

 

[sarajordan2993]

I thought about that, too. Perhaps they’re making a cursory distinction between ante- and post-mortem abrasions? (Can that distinction even be made in the field? I don’t know.) Perhaps they meant “no obvious injuries that could have caused death”.
You are totally right about the debris, twists and turns and so on.

For sure. That’s a long way to travel; especially since the river has been flooded. Typically the flow slows somewhat when it’s flooded as well. Exactly one week later she was found, would it even be possible for her to float that far in 1 weeks time?

 

[wary]

I wonder, too. Developing stories very frequently contain inaccuracies. I‘ll try to withhold suspicions about foul play until I know that a qualified LE or medical person really said it wasn’t a drowning.

You’re right. If you’ve followed the Ulvalde story, for a recent example—it was a chaos of contradictions, that haven’t even been sorted out yet.

And I’d prefer to wait for the coroner’s report—rather than an at-the-scene evaluation.

 

[WiseOwl]

What extremely sad news, my thoughts are with Carol and her family today.

It will be interesting to hear the coroner's report, at this moment it is difficult to determine exactly what happened to Carol. All we know for sure is that she ended up in the river.

Let's hope her family don't have to wait too long for some answers.

 

[Cruiser933]

Missing Ballwin woman’s body found in Meramec River

First responders with the Rock Community Fire Protection District pulled a body from the Meramec River just outside of Arnold city limits on Monday afternoon.

fox2now.com

There is a potentially interesting twist. Local media is now reporting that two bodies were found in the river in Arnold. No word yet on who the second body is or if there is any connection.

 

[JerseyWasHome2]

Missing Ballwin woman’s body found in Meramec River

First responders with the Rock Community Fire Protection District pulled a body from the Meramec River just outside of Arnold city limits on Monday afternoon.

fox2now.com

There is a potentially interesting twist. Local media is now reporting that two bodies were found in the river in Arnold. No word yet on who the second body is or if there is any connection.

My gosh, that is even further away (from her parked car) than the first reported location. Any farther and she would have been in the Mississippi River.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

If she didn't drown, ie no water in her lungs, then she must have died before she went into the river.
But how ?

 

[JerseyWasHome2]

If she didn't drown, ie no water in her lungs, then she must have died before she went into the river.
But how ?

Guessing that an overdose is a possibility. If someone sat at the edge of a rising river and took too many pills, they could get swept away. I wonder if they are able to tell immediately roughly how long a body has been in a body of water.

 

[meanmaryjean]

If she didn't drown, ie no water in her lungs, then she must have died before she went into the river.
But how ?

Catastrophic medical event (massive stroke, lethal arrhythmia) would be my guess

 

[Betty P]

My gosh, that is even further away (from her parked car) than the first reported location. Any farther and she would have been in the Mississippi River.

I'm also familiar with this area, both where she was hiking and later found. It is a long distance on a very winding part of the river. From looking on the internet, it looks like Jefferson County, MO uses the St. Louis County Medical Examiner, so that's good news. Better to have a medical doctor determining COD than not. RIP to the family, they seem like very nice, caring people.

And yes, swimming in the Meramec at Castlewood SP is extremely hazardous.