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  1. #1
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    Ransom wars: Episode V The IDI strikes back!

    Quote Originally Posted by SuperDave View Post
    Voynich, what are your current thoughts on the Cherokee analysis?

    [ame="http://www.forumsforjustice.org/forums/showthread.php?t=6404"]Analysis of the Linguistics and Handwriting in the Ramsey Ransom Note - Forums For Justice[/ame]

    Analysis of the Linguistics and Handwriting in the Ramsey Ransom Note Copyright 2007 by Cherokee

    He made a series of claims. In order to evaluate these claims, I make use of LLRN and BRN in order to see how well his claims hold up, and as an independent check to see the soundness of his conclusions. If I don’t offer a counter-claim, it is likely I agree. I agree that the note contains movie references to Speed, Dirty Harry, Ransom among others.

    Like the RN, I started out carefully formatting but then as I grew tired, I just started cut and pasting. Note, Cherokee owns the copyright to his statements, but I provided them as fair-use, in that I provided his statement, in context, and counterexamples, if I am aware of any. There might be some sloppiness on my part on the cut and pasting, I apologize in advance, but Cherokee’s analysis spans over 3 pages single spaced text.
    Unless otherwise stated, the material comes from Cherokee, LLRN, BRN, and RN.


    “When I first read a copy of the Ramsey ransom note, I immediately knew it was a fake. The content was overly dramatic and much too wordy to be a real ransom note from real kidnappers.”


    Please see BRN. 970 words $500k paid out. LLRN almost so.

    Also in line 2, the beginning phrase, “Listen carefully!” has been noted by others for its ironic use of the word “listen” even though the communication is written, not spoken.

    Attention

    I'm sorry this had to happen, but I am in bad need of money, & couldn't get it any other way” Weinberger ranson note, “attention” not “read carefully”


    “Further analysis of the note showed that even though the author strove to present a threatening tone, a strange concern for the recipient of the ransom note was present. There was almost a “motherly” quality to the instructions given in phrases such as “Make sure that you bring an adequate size attache,” “put the money in a brown paper bag,” and “I advise you to be rested,” among others.”


    from BRN

    "Loved one-please come home. We will pay all expenses
    and meet you anywhere at anytime. Your Family."

    “Contemplate, if you will, the position into which this puts
    you.”




    The money should be placed in a large cigar box, or if this is impossible, in a heavy cardboard box, securely closed and wrapped in white paper.

    As you can see, you don't want to catch us for to do so would be condemning your lovely and intelligent daughter to death.


    In addition, the parallel linguistic construction of the paragraph containing the sentences ending with “she dies” was almost poetic in nature, and certainly not believable.”

    “parallel linguistic construction” exist in other RN’s of “almost poetic in nature”

    this comes from BRN

    Contemplate,
    if you will, if you pay
    the ransom prior to seven days,
    Should you catch the messenger
    we send to pick up the ransom
    We will immediately know his fate.
    Should you catch all, of us
    we will never admit anything as to do
    If you ask the police t
    She is quite safe, if somewhat
    uncomfortable.
    Should you catch all, of us
    we will never admit anything as to do
    so would be suicide and again
    -she will die.





    As you can see, you don't want to catch We can see no way for you to secure the safe return o

    The salutation only addresses one parent, not both parents of the allegedly kidnapped child. The ransom note author uses the formal “Mr. Ramsey.” What is interesting is why the author felt a salutation was necessary. A ransom note only has to state the amount of money demanded and the time of a call and/or where to make the drop. Finding the note in their home, and their daughter missing, the Ramseys would assume the note was addressed to them.


    LLRN Dear Sir;
    As you no doubt know by this time your son has been kidnapped.


    BRN
    Sir,
    your daughter has been kidnapped by us and we now
    hold her for ransom. She is quite safe, if somewhat
    uncomfortable.


    Also in line 2, the beginning phrase, “Listen carefully!” has been noted by others for its ironic use of the word “listen” even though the communication is written, not spoken.

    You need fear no physical harm for him provided you live up carefully to the following instructions,


    First of all, the faction would not be “foreign” to the writer if they were truly foreign. Secondly, a true terrorist or rebel faction never describes their organization as “small.” They want to appear powerful and able to inflict harm at will. They will boast of their large numbers and ability to do damage. By using the adjective “small,” the author is obviously trying to minimize their threat. But why?



    William Hance 1978
    We are an organization composed of seven members
    (William acted alone in staged kidnapping of Gail Johnson)



    Once again, the writer is somewhat redundant in saying JonBenet is “safe and unharmed.” To be “safe” is to assume to be “unharmed” and vice versa.

    -agreed but has been noted before.
    Allow me to ensure you that he is at present well and safe
    LLRN


    The instruction to “bring an adequate size attache” is unnecessary and part of the author’s need to tell the story. They are visualizing the scenario as though it was playing out in a movie, from where they probably got most of their ideas for the ransom note. Concern about the “adequate size” of a container for ransom is NOT in the mindset of most kidnappers.

    3. The money should be placed in a large cigar box, or if this is impossible, in a heavy cardboard box, securely closed and wrapped in white paper.

    3) The bills should occupy no more than 400 cubic inches and thusly fit into a standard large suitcase of inside dimensions 31.5" longx18.75" highx6.25" deep. Purchase such a suitcase and lock the bills inside.


    The ransom note author is following the steps taught to all communications/journalism majors on how to write a story ... who, what, why, when, where, and how.

    It should be noted that Patsy Ramsey was a journalism major, and very proud of that accomplishment. She even used the initials of her bachelor’s degree in an acronym with her name. Patsy knew how to write and tell a good story. Her “talent” portion for beauty pageants was dramatic speech.

    Of course, Patsy is not the only journalism major in the world, just as she is not the only person who uses far right indentation in her letter closings and exclamation marks. But the fact is important because Patsy was one of four people in the house the night JonBenet died, and she had access to the ransom note pad and pen.

    As we have seen, the ransom note author’s main purpose was to establish the identity of who wrote the note, and therefore, who was ultimately responsible for the dead body in the home. Once that priority was taken care of, they turned to what and why, a kidnapping scenario somehow related to a foreign faction, and when, supposedly at the time of writing. With those details in order, the writer next concentrates on


    LLRN & BRN accomplish this, neither were journalism majors.

    The sentence reads, “I will call you between 8 and 10 am tomorrow to instruct you on delivery.”

    Once again, the writer is concerned with instructions, not action. The author’s true focus is subconsciously revealed because they know there has been no kidnapping, there will be no ransom and therefore, no real action will be taken or needed.

    . Should you however, disobey any of our instructions even slightly, his death will be the penalty. LLRN


    You will receive a future communication instruction you as to your future orders. :LLRN
    . Here are the requirements you must meet in this matter BRN

    The main thought of the sentence, “The delivery will be exhausting” is followed by a subordinate clause “so I advise you to be rested.” The author continues using the first person singular pronoun, but the most important factor in this sentence is the concern expressed for John’s welfare. No hardened criminal, vagrant or “foreign faction” would care if John was “rested” or not. The concern is a subconscious revelation of the author’s personality, which is nurturing, and therefore, according to probability, female.

    This is further confirmation of what we saw earlier in the paragraph. Linguistically, the ransom note author has now taken on a decidedly feminine voice in their overall tone and choice of words.


    However, should you carefully follow out out instructions to the letter, we can assure you that your son will be safely returned from LLRN sounds feminie

    She is quite safe, if somewhat
    uncomfortable. We offer no proof of our possession of her
    at this time. It will arrive by mail in a few days. Barbara is
    presently alive inside a small capsule buried in a remote
    piece of soil. She has enough food and water and air to
    last seven days. At the end of the seven days the life supporting
    batteries will be discharged and her air supply will be cut off.
    As you can see, you don't want to catch us for to do so would be condemning your lovely and intelligent daughter to death.
    When you have the money in readiness, call all the Miami
    area major newspapers and place the following ad in the "personal" section of the classified advertisemsnts:

    "Loved one-please come home. We will pay all expenses
    and meet you anywhere at anytime. Your Family."
    Within twelve hours after you deliver the money you will receive another call advising you of your daughter's whereabouts. A letter will be sent also to insure the findings of your daughter
    .

    Most importantly, in this last paragraph, the writer sets the stage for the reason JonBenet will be found dead. They threaten that JonBenet she will be “executed” if there is any “deviation” from their instructions. They warn, among other things, that the Ramseys are not to call or contact anyone.

    With this, the purpose of the ransom note is revealed. The ransom note author KNOWS the Ramseys will completely ignore their repeated warnings and contact not only the police, but also an address book full of friends. How does the writer know this? Because they are not a foreign faction, or even a criminal, but a member of the Ramsey family who knows JonBenet is already dead. For this Ramsey, ignoring the very warnings they have penned is part of the plan. It provides the reason for JonBenet’s death and why her body is found in the Ramsey’s basement where it was presumably taken after the kidnappers detect (with their omnipotence) the Ramsey’s non-compliance of their demands.



    Any deviation from this outline will result in your death.
    Should you however, disobey any of our instructions even slightly, his death will be the penalty.

    They warn, among other things, that the Ramseys are not to call or contact anyone.

    Don't tell anyone or go to the Police about this, because I am watching you closely. I am scared stiff, & will kill the baby, at your first wrong move. Peter Weinberger

    Should you catch all, of us we will never admit anything as to do
    so would be suicide and again-she will die.

    1) Although we will always anticipate the involvement of the police in this situation, be assured that if your communication with them or their actual presence is detected, we will break off negotiations with you immediately. We have tied into several
    of the possible means of communications that you have with the police and feel that you will be unable to contact them without our
    knowledge.




    The threatening tone of this paragraph continues with the sentence in lines 31 through 33. The sentence reads, “You will also be denied her remains for a proper burial.” This statement opens a window into the ransom note author’s mind, as they try to top the execution threat with another punishment.

    Why is this necessary? Wouldn’t JonBenet’s DEATH be considered the ultimate punishment in the mind of the writer? The answer is because JonBenet’s death has already happened. It is a fact of reality and the only thing left is for her body to be found, thus the focus is on JonBenet’s BODY not her death.

    The ransom note author is now having trouble suppressing their emotions about JonBenet’s death, and the accompanying images of her lifeless body. These images are starting to become a part of the ransom note as the writer struggles to maintain focus and concentration.

    The use of the adjective “proper” in relation to the noun “burial” is interesting as it shows how important a “proper burial” is to the writer.


    "As you can see, you don't want to catch us for to do so would be condemning your *lovely and intelligent daughter* to death."


    The author is concerned with the care of JonBenet’s body just as they were concerned with John being rested. There is a nurturing, and feminine, component in the midst of the sentence’s threatening tone.

    Before modern times and the advent of funeral homes, women were responsible for the care and proper preparation of a body for burial. They bathed the corpse and dressed it in the deceased’s favorite or best clothing. JonBenet’s body was treated in similar fashion. When it was found, it had been wiped clean and wrapped carefully in a blanket.

    The parallel with the ransom note with JonBenet’s body cannot be dismissed. In both the staging of the ransom note and of JonBenet’s body, there are elements of the macabre and horrific, but underneath the harsh words and images there is a paradoxical thread of nurture and concern. This thread is part of the writer’s true identity that lies just below the false self-imposed mask.


    . Barbara is
    presently alive inside a small capsule buried in a remote
    piece of soil.
    The box is waterproof and very strong-fiberglass reinforced
    plywood-she has little chance of escaping. The box is in an unusual and lonely place. She has no chance of being accidently stumbled upon.

    Contemplate, if you will, the position into which this puts
    you. . If you ask the police to advise you in this matter please be aware that
    their very presence will scare us off. We can see no way for you to secure the safe return of your daughter other than to obey instructions explicitly.
    Within twelve hours after you deliver the money you will receive another call advising you of your daughter's whereabouts. A letter will be sent also to insure the findings of your daughter.

    The next section of the ransom note is a lengthy and overly dramatic warning about what will happen to JonBenet if the Ramseys speak to anyone about their “situation,” “tamper with” the ransom money, or wear any “electronic devices” during the money drop. The writer also claims they are familiar with “law enforcement countermeasures and tactics,” gives percentages on the Ramseys chances of getting JonBenet back or of “killing” her, and states the Ramseys are “under constant scrutiny as well as the authorities.”

    The author takes great pains to stress what will happen to JonBenet if the Ramsey do not cooperate with their instructions. They also stress their omniscience in being able to monitor the Ramseys and “the authorities” which includes bank workers and law enforcement. Because the ransom note writer is working backward from an end results, the excessive threats and claims of omnipotent surveillance are necessary to explain events that have already happened in the Ramsey home.


    . Should you however, disobey any of our instructions even slightly, his death will be the penalty.
    1. For obvious reasons make absolutely no attempt to communicate with either police authorities or any private agency. Should you already have communicated with the police, allow them to continue their investigations, but do not mention this letter.
    As a final word of warning - this is a strictly commercial proposition, and we are prepared to put our threat into execution should we have reasonable to believe that you committed an infraction of the above instructions

    Contemplate, if you will, the position into which this puts
    you. If you pay the ransom prior to seven days,
    we will tell you of her whereabouts. Should you catch the
    messenger we send to pick up the ransom, we will simply
    not say anything to anyone and ergo Barbara will
    suffocate. The messenger knows only one of us and he will report to us via radio from the pickup site. We will immediately know his fate.

    Should you catch all, of us we will never admit anything as to do
    so would be suicide and again-she will die. As you can see, you don't want to catch us for to do so would be condemning your lovely and intelligent daughter to death. The police may allow you to have a free hand prior to the return of your daughter
    should you be so callous as to contact them. If you ask the police to advise you in this matter please be aware that
    their very presence will scare us off. We can see no way for you to secure the safe return of your daughter other than to obey instructions explicitly.


    With this, the purpose of the ransom note is revealed. The ransom note author KNOWS the Ramseys will completely ignore their repeated warnings and contact not only the police, but also an address book full of friends. How does the writer know this?


    Should you already have communicated with the police, allow them to continue their investigations, but do not mention this letter.

    1) Although we will always anticipate the involvement of the police in this situation, be assured that if your communication with them or their actual presence is detected, we will break off negotiations with you immediately. We have tied into several
    of the possible means of communications that you have with the police and feel that you will be unable to contact them without our
    knowledge.

    The most important element of this section relates to the ransom note writer’s use of the personal pronoun “you” and their linguistic attempt to connect with the reader. This type of writing is indicative of a female author. Female writers favor personal words such as “you,” “her” and “she,” and relationship words such as “for,” “with,” “in,” and “not.” Mr. Shlomo Argamon, a linguist and computer scientist at the Illinois Institute of Technology in Chicago, states, “Women have a more interactive style. They want to create a relationship between the writer and the reader. Men, on the other hand, use more numbers, adjectives and determiners - words such as “the,” “this” and “that.”


    Allow me to ensure you that he is at present well and safe. You need fear no physical harm for him provided you live up carefully to the following instructions, and to such others as you will receive by future communications. Should you however, disobey any of our instructions even slightly, his death will be the penalty. You will receive a future communication instruction you as to your future orders.
    As a final word of warning However, should you carefully follow out out instructions to the letter
    Contemplate, if you will, the position into which this puts
    you. If you pay the ransom prior to seven days,
    we will tell you of her whereabouts. Should you catch
    When you have the money in readiness, call all the Miami


    In line 51, the author continues with their thought, and placement, of percentages with, “Follow our instructions and you stand a 100% chance of getting her back.” Once again, direct emphasis is put on the Ramseys following the writer’s instructions to ensure JonBenet’s survival. The repeated instructions and warnings are necessary in the author’s mind even though their redundancy (and ridiculous language) is so evident to us. They want there to be no mistake that JonBenet WILL BE DEAD if the Ramsey don’t comply with their demands.

    She has enough food and water and air to
    last seven days. At the end of the seven days the life supporting
    batteries will be discharged and her air supply will be cut off.

    As a final word of warning - this is a strictly commercial proposition, and we are prepared to put our threat into execution should we have reasonable to believe that you committed an infraction of the above instructionse


    After performing my own analysis on the ransom note many years ago, I recently came across a web site which used a simplified version of the algorithm developed by Argamon and Koppel. I typed in the Ramsey ransom note text to obtain a gender analysis from the computer program. The result confirmed my earlier analysis, and that of many others. The Argamon and Koppel program said the ransom note author was female. In fact, the score was 1077 (female) to 464 (male).

    --try using writings known to be male and female and see how well this program works.

    Murdering pedophiles do not leave ransom notes, fake or otherwise, and they certainly don’t take their time composing a three page letter in their victim’s home using pen and paper left on the kitchen counter.


    He should read what happened to Susan Denegan and Marian Parker

    Marian Parker (1927)
    • Case Details. Marian, age 12, "was snatched in 1927 by someone who sent ransom notes to the family. But kidnapping wasn't the motive; the "kidnapper" collected a ransom and delivered the girl back to her family -- she had been killed and her body desecrated in a classic case of Lustmord or lust murder. See an excellent summary by Mark Gribben." Source: Laura James at Clews The Historic True Crime Blog.

    Susan Denegan
    RN
    Get $20,000 ready & waite (sic) for word. Do not notify FBI or police. Bills in $5's and $10's." On the backside was a warning: "Burn this for her safty

    From a page on Richard Heirens:

    "In a comfortable neighborhood on the north side of Chicago, James Degnan lived with his
    wife, Helen, 9-year-old daughter, Betty, and 6-year-old daughter, Suzanne. In the early
    morning hours of January 7, 1946, Suzanne Degnan was kidnapped from her home and a
    ransom note was found on the bedroom floor. Before nightfall, police discovered her
    dismembered body parts in the sewers of her north side neighborhood. The autopsy later
    revealed that the child had been strangled."

    Suzanne was sleeping in a room very close to her parents' room. Her mother heard some noise in the
    night, called out to Suzanne and asked if everything was alright. The child answered yes and the mother
    went back to sleep.

    The next morning the child was gone, taken in the night, and a note was left.

    The front of the ransom note:

    Get $20,000 Ready + Waite
    for Word. Do Not Notify
    FBI or Police. Bills in 5's
    and 10's.
    Back of the note:
    BURN THIS FOR HER SAFETY
    The child was not safe. She had been taken to a nearby basement, strangled, dismembered. Her head
    was the first part found.

    17 year old Richard Heirens was caught burglarizing a house 6 months later. He was tried for three
    murders, two elderly women who were killed during burglaries, and Suzanne Degnan.

    L&L were alleged to have “molestation” given BF was naked and gagged, the brutality of the crime, selection of target, mutilation of corpse, and L&L were openly gay. - I cannot ad more as a single post I've reached the lmit.
    Last edited by voynich; 05-26-2009 at 12:50 AM.

  2. #2
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    Many myths busted, claims refuted you have.

    Esp. the 'conclusion' the Rn is 'fake', based only on its content or length. The content is mainstream standard ransom note, its length only above average.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holdontoyourhat View Post
    Many myths busted, claims refuted you have.

    Esp. the 'conclusion' the Rn is 'fake', based only on its content or length. The content is mainstream standard ransom note, its length only above average.
    Exactly, master HOTH, -- there are too many counterexamples in his premises to draw any firm conclusions about the author.

    Cherokee writes "There is another component to this section containing the words “she dies.” As has been discussed in other analyses of the ransom note, there are phrases and ideas within it that seem to have been taken directly from three different action movies, “Dirty Harry,” “Ransom” and “Speed.” The next few sentences continue that association.

    Following is a list of the various story lines and phrases from these movies which match the ransom note.

    “DIRTY HARRY” –

    Story Lines
    Specified denomination of bills and type of container for delivery of the ransom
    The delivery of the ransom requires extreme physical exertion
    The kidnapper employs counter-surveillance

    Phrases
    "If I even think you're being followed, the girl dies."
    "If you talk to anyone, I don't care if it's a Pekinese p i s s ing against a lamppost, the girl dies."
    "... that's the end of the game. The girl dies."
    "Now listen to me carefully."
    "Now listen. Listen very carefully."
    "It sounds like you had a good rest. You'll need it."

    “RANSOM” –

    Story Lines
    Specified denomination of bills and type of container for delivery of the ransom
    The delivery of the ransom requires extreme physical exertion
    The child is bound with his hands placed above his head
    Duct tape is used on the child
    The child's parent is a wealthy businessman
    The kidnapper employs counter-surveillance

    Phrases
    "Do not involve the police or the FBI. If you do, I will kill him."
    "Do not inform the media or I will kill him."
    "No tracking devices in the money or the cases or I will kill him."

    “SPEED” –

    Story Lines
    Specified denomination of bills and type of container for delivery of the ransom
    The kidnapper employs counter-surveillance

    Phrases
    "You know that I'm on top of you. Do not attempt to grow a brain."
    The phrase “Don’t try to grow a brain” is almost word for word the same sentence as “Do not attempt to grow a brain” from spoken dialogue in the movie thriller Speed, a movie that came out in 1994, two years before the ransom note was written. Many analysts have interpreted the inclusion of this phrase by the ransom note writer to be an attempt to sound streetwise and criminal, but there is more than that behind the words.

    By placing John’s name directly after the phrase “Don’t try to grow a brain,” the writer is giving a larger hint as to their purpose. This isn’t just some vague and ridiculous threat. It is a specific message from the author to John. Why would the ransom note writer choose this particular phrase? Because they knew it meant something to both them and to John, kind of like a secret password that holds the key to encryption.



    -- Maybe this is a conception of a young teenager who likes to watch those movies. Is Cherokee stating that JR had no involvement with the initial creation of the RN? When did JR first read the RN, and did PR tell him what to expect in its contents?

    So is PR writing for JR, LE?

  4. #4
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    Overly analytical. Most likely this note was written by one (or more) morons, who specifically filled it with movie lines, and if you take it at face value, thought it would be scary enough that the Ramseys would not call the police.

    What is a "real" kidnapper anyway? No, this wasn't an organized group. The fact that JBR was found dead could indicate they were amateurs and did not think out the whole plan--particularly how they would get her out of the house. Something made him/she/they angry in the basement, and they kllled her--end of plan.

    There were a few things going on we do know about:

    *Ransom playing locally
    *A recent article only days before of Access Graphic's success highlighting JR
    *A beauty queen trophy daughter

    To an immature mind, they might have thought they could pull this off and make some quick money. Much more profitable then breaking and entering and stealing small stuff.

    Why were movie lines and themes chosen? They could have written a note without that---they either thought they were being clever......English wasn't their first language....they had an immature mind and the crime is what it appears to be. Amateurs that blew the kidnapping.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holdontoyourhat View Post
    Many myths busted, claims refuted you have.

    Esp. the 'conclusion' the Rn is 'fake', based only on its content or length. The content is mainstream standard ransom note, its length only above average.
    Ummm, I don't believe that ANYBODY has said that it was fake based on the fact that it was long. It is fake because it rambles on and on without making sense, and the handwriting matches Patsy's. This is why it is a fake.. Let me remind you...John himself...said that is was an "inside job", meaning that even HE did not believe that it was some member of a SFF. This ALSO makes it a FAKE. John says that it "appears the RN was written by a woman", and Nedra...Patsy's own MOTHER...said that the RN looked like Patsy's handwriting. This also makes it a FAKE...considering there was really no small foreign faction involved in a kidnapping/murder at all.
    "This time we get it right."

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    The problem is that the vast majority of expert profilers agree with us.
    I'm as mad as HELL and I'm NOT gonna take it anymore!.

  7. #7
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    The RN is also fake because there was no real kidnapping. So, no need for a RN. The "kidnapping" was invented to cover for a death. The arrival of the first police car provided an excuse for killing the (already dead) victim. Or rather, so people would believe that is why she was killed- because they called police.

    Of course, if you actually believe this, then you have to realize that for the killing to be retaliation for disobeying orders not to tell anyone, then the killing had to happen after the note was found and 911 called. So basically, the killing had to occur after 6am when the parents were awake and had found the note. Now, if the kidnappers were in the basement, how did they know the parents were calling 911? Think they were peeking into the kitchen? ("Oh, crap, we forgot to take the flashlight, and the pineapple and the kleenex and the bowl. Oh well, no one would believe it doesn't belong to the house. Let's just mosey on back down to the basement and kill this kid. Quietly.")

    Now, we KNOW she wasn't killed after 6am. We KNOW she died between midnight and 1am. You can argue all you want about theories, but science doesn't lie.
    So the premise of a retaliatory killing falls apart right there.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ames View Post
    Ummm, I don't believe that ANYBODY has said that it was fake based on the fact that it was long.
    [ame="http://www.forumsforjustice.org/forums/showthread.php?t=6404"]Analysis of the Linguistics and Handwriting in the Ramsey Ransom Note - Forums For Justice[/ame]

    "The ransom note is famous for its length. At two and a half written pages, it defies the most common rule of ransom notes … keep it short. The less said the better; the more you say, the more you reveal, so make your demands and shut up."


    Quote Originally Posted by Cherokee
    The salutation only addresses one parent, not both parents of the allegedly kidnapped child. The ransom note author uses the formal “Mr. Ramsey.” What is interesting is why the author felt a salutation was necessary. A ransom note only has to state the amount of money demanded and the time of a call and/or where to make the drop. Finding the note in their home, and their daughter missing, the Ramseys would assume the note was addressed to them.
    .

    Quote Originally Posted by Ames View Post
    It is fake because it rambles on and on without making sense, .
    Perhaps is a fake ransom note

    Dear Sir!

    Have 50000$ redy 25000$ in
    20$ bills 15000$ in 10$ bills and
    10000$ in 5$ bills After 2-4 days
    we will inform you were to deliver
    the Mony.
    We warn you for making
    anyding public or for notify the Police
    The child is in gut care.
    Indication for all letters are
    singnature
    and three holes.

    "mony" "gut" "redy" "5000$"

    Who talks and spells like this?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ames View Post
    .. Let me remind you...John himself...said that is was an "inside job", meaning that even HE did not believe that it was some member of a SFF. This ALSO makes it a FAKE.
    Yet you claim that JR dictated part of the letter, and worked closely with PR for the remainder. He did not believe in his own lies?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ames View Post
    John says that it "appears the RN was written by a woman",
    He worked with PR in writing this note and staging the crime scene, including the garroting and sexual assault on his daughter, and yet this is exactly what JR would say if he's trying to deflect attention away from PR?


    Quote Originally Posted by Ames View Post
    and Nedra...Patsy's own MOTHER...said that the RN looked like Patsy's handwriting. This also makes it a FAKE...considering there was really no small foreign faction involved in a kidnapping/murder at all.

    I agree "there was no SFF"

    "The child is in gut care." Fake or real RN?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    The RN is also fake because there was no real kidnapping. So, no need for a RN. The "kidnapping" was invented to cover for a death. The arrival of the first police car provided an excuse for killing the (already dead) victim. Or rather, so people would believe that is why she was killed- because they called police.

    Of course, if you actually believe this, then you have to realize that for the killing to be retaliation for disobeying orders not to tell anyone, then the killing had to happen after the note was found and 911 called. So basically, the killing had to occur after 6am when the parents were awake and had found the note. Now, if the kidnappers were in the basement, how did they know the parents were calling 911? Think they were peeking into the kitchen? ("Oh, crap, we forgot to take the flashlight, and the pineapple and the kleenex and the bowl. Oh well, no one would believe it doesn't belong to the house. Let's just mosey on back down to the basement and kill this kid. Quietly.")

    Now, we KNOW she wasn't killed after 6am. We KNOW she died between midnight and 1am. You can argue all you want about theories, but science doesn't lie.
    So the premise of a retaliatory killing falls apart right there.
    Your account doesn't rule out a kidnapping gone bad, Maikai outlines it here:

    Quote Originally Posted by Maikai View Post
    Most likely this note was written by one (or more) morons, who specifically filled it with movie lines,

    What is a "real" kidnapper anyway? No, this wasn't an organized group. The fact that JBR was found dead could indicate they were amateurs and did not think out the whole plan--particularly how they would get her out of the house. Something made him/she/they angry in the basement, and they kllled her--end of plan.

    To an immature mind, they might have thought they could pull this off and make some quick money. Much more profitable then breaking and entering and stealing small stuff. Amateurs that blew the kidnapping.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    The RN is also fake because there was no real kidnapping (evidence of cord fiber in JBR's bed contradicts this). So, no need for a RN. The "kidnapping" was invented to cover for a death (evidence of JBR packed 'to go' with tape on her mouth, ligature for her arms/legs, and wrapped in a blanked contradicts this also). The arrival of the first police car provided an excuse for killing the (already dead) victim. Or rather, so people would believe that is why she was killed- because they called police.

    Of course, if you actually believe this, then you have to realize that for the killing to be retaliation for disobeying orders not to tell anyone, then the killing had to happen after the note was found and 911 called. So basically, the killing had to occur after 6am when the parents were awake and had found the note. Now, if the kidnappers were in the basement, how did they know the parents were calling 911? Think they were peeking into the kitchen? ("Oh, crap, we forgot to take the flashlight, and the pineapple and the kleenex and the bowl. Oh well, no one would believe it doesn't belong to the house. Let's just mosey on back down to the basement and kill this kid. Quietly.")

    Now, we KNOW she wasn't killed after 6am. We KNOW she died between midnight and 1am. You can argue all you want about theories, but science doesn't lie.
    So the premise of a retaliatory killing falls apart right there.
    Would this be a bad time to bring up the science of the unknown male trace DNA found on either side of JBR's longjohn's waistband, that matched DNA found mixed with her blood in the underwear she was wearing the night she was murdered?

    I'm not sure RDI can rationalize this and maintain any credibility whatsoever. That this DNA migrated to these places innocently on the night she was murdered is about the most ridiculous thing I've ever read in my life.

    Equally ridiculous is the idea that RDI can rule in or out any motive or scenario like 'retaliatory killing' when we know so little about what happened. I mean, we don't even know the date JBR was murdered! For hours and hours, we don't even know what was happening!

    We have a lot to learn about JBR's murder.


  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperDave View Post
    The problem is that the vast majority of expert profilers agree with us.
    I remained astonished by both IDI and RDI here @ ws at very little reference to
    Forensic linguistics By Gerald R. McMenamin, Dongdoo Choi

    http://www.webbsleuths.com/cgi-bin/d...m=DCForumID101

    New legal requirements for forensic science evidence requires the expert
    witness to provide a basis for an opinion that is quantifiable, McMenamin said.
    The database can serve that role, he said, by providing a basis to identify a
    specific author by writing style, similar to DNA tests that rely on chemistry,
    although the social sciences or human behavior are less predictable, he said.

    Probability of identifying a specific author improves when a document contains a
    combination of unusual factors that were extremely rare in the database,
    McMenamin said. He cited one example, where only one letter writer from the
    sample of 1,200 used 001 to signify the year 2001. That, combined with other
    unusual usage of grammar, punctuation or sentence structure make it easier to
    pinpoint a specific author, he said.

    McMenamin is a recognized scholar in stylistics and an internationally known
    forensic linguist. He regularly serves as a consultant in criminal and civil cases,
    including the high-profile Unabomber and JonBenet Ramsey cases.



    http://linguistlist.org/people/perso...PersonID=13841


    Name: Gerald R. McMenamin
    Institution: California State University, Fresno
    Email: click here to access email
    Linguistic Field(s): Sociolinguistics
    Text/Corpus Linguistics
    Forensic Linguistics
    Subject Language(s): Spanish
    Postal Address: 21143 E Weldon Ave.
    Tivy Valley
    Sanger, CA
    USA 93657
    Phone: 559-787-9752
    Fax: 559-787-9653
    Selected Publications: Forensic Stylistics, Elsevier 1993
    Forensic Linguistics, CRC Press, 2002
    Announced on LINGUIST - Perspectives in Linguistics
    Reviewed on LINGUIST - Perspectives in Linguistics
    Courses Taught:

    Sociolinguistics
    Stylistics

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holdontoyourhat View Post
    Would this be a bad time to bring up the science of the unknown male trace DNA found on either side of JBR's longjohn's waistband, that matched DNA found mixed with her blood in the underwear she was wearing the night she was murdered?

    I'm not sure RDI can rationalize this and maintain any credibility whatsoever. That this DNA migrated to these places innocently on the night she was murdered is about the most ridiculous thing I've ever read in my life.

    Equally ridiculous is the idea that RDI can rule in or out any motive or scenario like 'retaliatory killing' when we know so little about what happened. I mean, we don't even know the date JBR was murdered! For hours and hours, we don't even know what was happening!

    We have a lot to learn about JBR's murder.
    Not at all. Bring it up whenever you wish. The DNA has nothing to do with the RN. It is a fake for the reasons I said. A kidnapping gone bad can still end with ransom being paid if the victims' family do not know she is dead. But this obviously precludes the victim being left in the house to be found.

    We know when she died within a 2- hour window, which is a good as you're gonna get in most circumstances. The exact date is only in question because the death occurred around midnight. If the coroner had done his job when first examining the body, we may have had a narrower time frame for her death, but if it was still around midnight the date could still have been either the 25 or 26.
    And right, there are hours where we do not know what was taking place. But we have a pretty good idea, even if we can't prove exactly who did what, we know what was done.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    Not at all. Bring it up whenever you wish. The DNA has nothing to do with the RN (I can certainly understand why RDI would attempt to separate and ignore the DNA evidence. It makes the entire RDI argument moot! Dont take my word for it, ask JBR's investigative authority who has made the most recent statement. Yes, that would be the DA's office. You know, the statement vindicating the R's!). It is a fake for the reasons I said (Stated as fact, when only a claim it is). A kidnapping gone bad can still end with ransom being paid if the victims' family do not know she is dead. But this obviously precludes the victim being left in the house to be found.

    We know when she died within a 2- hour window, which is a good as you're gonna get in most circumstances. The exact date is only in question because the death occurred around midnight. If the coroner had done his job when first examining the body, we may have had a narrower time frame for her death, but if it was still around midnight the date could still have been either the 25 or 26.
    And right, there are hours where we do not know what was taking place. But we have a pretty good idea, even if we can't prove exactly who did what, we know what was done.
    Pretty good idea?? This is patently false. We have absolutely no idea what transpired during those hours. RDI maintains some scenarios while IDI maintains others. We'll not have anything resembling a 'pretty good idea' until after the killer is found and tells us.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by voynich View Post
    I remained astonished by both IDI and RDI here @ ws at very little reference to
    Forensic linguistics By Gerald R. McMenamin, Dongdoo Choi

    http://www.webbsleuths.com/cgi-bin/d...m=DCForumID101

    New legal requirements for forensic science evidence requires the expert
    witness to provide a basis for an opinion that is quantifiable, McMenamin said.
    The database can serve that role, he said, by providing a basis to identify a
    specific author by writing style, similar to DNA tests that rely on chemistry,
    although the social sciences or human behavior are less predictable, he said.

    Probability of identifying a specific author improves when a document contains a
    combination of unusual factors that were extremely rare in the database,
    McMenamin said. He cited one example, where only one letter writer from the
    sample of 1,200 used 001 to signify the year 2001. That, combined with other
    unusual usage of grammar, punctuation or sentence structure make it easier to
    pinpoint a specific author, he said.

    McMenamin is a recognized scholar in stylistics and an internationally known
    forensic linguist. He regularly serves as a consultant in criminal and civil cases,
    including the high-profile Unabomber and JonBenet Ramsey cases.



    http://linguistlist.org/people/perso...PersonID=13841


    Name: Gerald R. McMenamin
    Institution: California State University, Fresno
    Email: click here to access email
    Linguistic Field(s): Sociolinguistics
    Text/Corpus Linguistics
    Forensic Linguistics
    Subject Language(s): Spanish
    Postal Address: 21143 E Weldon Ave.
    Tivy Valley
    Sanger, CA
    USA 93657
    Phone: 559-787-9752
    Fax: 559-787-9653
    Selected Publications: Forensic Stylistics, Elsevier 1993
    Forensic Linguistics, CRC Press, 2002
    Announced on LINGUIST - Perspectives in Linguistics
    Reviewed on LINGUIST - Perspectives in Linguistics
    Courses Taught:

    Sociolinguistics
    Stylistics
    Expressions that I believe are probably telling:

    Victory! when used as a letter-closing salutation
    'Any deviation...' used at the beginning of a sentence.
    'she will be beheaded.' in reference to a child.
    'immediately executed' in reference to a child.
    'you're not the only fat cat' in reference to a rich man
    'proper burial'
    'follow our instruction to the letter'.

    Personally I think the RN author may have read some of these other RN's for words and phrases. It makes sense for FFDI ESL.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by voynich View Post
    Analysis of the Linguistics and Handwriting in the Ramsey Ransom Note - Forums For Justice

    "The ransom note is famous for its length. At two and a half written pages, it defies the most common rule of ransom notes … keep it short. The less said the better; the more you say, the more you reveal, so make your demands and shut up."
    Yep, it DOES defy the most common rule of ransom notes. But that is NOT what makes it a fake. I believe that DeeDee and I have pointed out what makes it a fake.


    Perhaps is a fake ransom note

    Dear Sir!

    Have 50000$ redy 25000$ in
    20$ bills 15000$ in 10$ bills and
    10000$ in 5$ bills After 2-4 days
    we will inform you were to deliver
    the Mony.
    We warn you for making
    anyding public or for notify the Police
    The child is in gut care.
    Indication for all letters are
    singnature
    and three holes.

    "mony" "gut" "redy" "5000$"

    Who talks and spells like this?
    Sounds like somebody with a very low IQ, or someone that isn't very educated. Why are we even talking about this particular RN note? What does this one have to do with JB?


    Yet you claim that JR dictated part of the letter, and worked closely with PR for the remainder. He did not believe in his own lies?
    Right, I do believe that JR dicated parts of the RN to Patsy, and then Patsy threw in her two cents, when she should have just left it alone. Maybe THEN it would have been more believable.


    He worked with PR in writing this note and staging the crime scene, including the garroting and sexual assault on his daughter, and yet this is exactly what JR would say if he's trying to deflect attention away from PR?
    IMO...at that particular time, he didn't think that they would get away with it. SO, IMO...he wasn't trying to deflect attention away from Patsy. He is the one that grabbed the note pad and handed it to officers in the first place. I believe that he thought that it was over with at that point...and so he was just focusing on trying to deflect attention away from HIMSELF. At that point and time...he was probably thinking..."The heck with Patsy, I need to save my own behind now". Either that...or he was thinking at that time....that he would try to pin it on LHP, the housekeeper, or some other woman, like PW (Priscilla White). He threw both of them under the bus so fast...with friends like the Ramseys...who needs enemies. Go back and read John's interview...and see how many ways he tries to make PW suspicious looking. It is RIDICULOUS!!!

    I agree "there was no SFF"
    Well at least we can agree on SOMETHING.

    "The child is in gut care." Fake or real RN?
    My guess...its real. Written by an uneducated person, or someone that is mentally retarded (not to offend anyone!)
    "This time we get it right."

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