AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #23

[pieper4]

RSBM

From a few of the photos I have seen it has given me the impression of theatrical makeup which I have seen actors wearing in performances.

The one photo reminds me of the production of Cats. It was the first thing that did pop into my head when I saw some of them.

I am not entirely sure, but if you are referring to the pic. of Isabel in "tiger" face makeup, I do believe that's just face painting as opposed to theatrical makeup. I've worked in entertainment for many years. That picture (if the same you are thinking of) is not theatrical makeup. It's not "thick" enough. Face painting is a really popular party activity; whether a backyard bday party or a day at Reid Park Zoo here in Tucson. I have a good friend who does face painting for kids, adults and Dia de los Muertos in town.

JMO, etc.

 

[GutFeeling!]

RSBM

From a few of the photos I have seen it has given me the impression of theatrical makeup which I have seen actors wearing in performances.

The one photo reminds me of the production of Cats. It was the first thing that did pop into my head when I saw some of them.

That is face paint not make-up.

 

[Dr. Know?]

Isa got her face painted. Common at events here. Maybe at Reid Park Zoo? There's many who volunteer for kids here at events. Some talented people btw. I'm not going to try to find a JBR (rip) in that picture or any others as I'm not seeing it. jmo

 

[carole]

Isa got her face painted. Common at events here. Maybe at Reid Park Zoo? There's many who volunteer for kids here at events. Some talented people btw. I'm not going to try to find a JBR (rip) in that picture or any others as I'm not seeing it. jmo

I've seen face painting done here in North Carolina many times at fairs and festivals. It's nothing but fun for the kids, a way to express themselves as animals, princesses, superheroes, etc. Absolutely innocent childhood fun for kids, parents, grandparents. IMO, of course.

 

[white rabbit]

Too quiet. Too sad. Isa is still missing. Family? MSM? TPD? Nothing, nada.

Is it the calm before the storm?...why is it so quiet? Been here before.. garrr...

nope, zilch...

there is a car wash today. BC posted it on her facebook too. wonder if the family will attend.

 

[white rabbit]

post deleted

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Murder/rape/kidnapping has always been a high offense and suspects are arrested everyday and brought to trial and punishment meted out.

We are seeing the punishment for those that murder a child esculating in terms of severity over what we use to see. Imo, there is a long way to go when it is a bio mother (then the blinders are still on in some degree.) A lot of times the punishment for same like crimes are not the same when a mother murders her own vs. a father doing the same thing.

Meh- Yes, clearly- murder /rape.....

But what is the Federal charge for hiding a child's horrific unintended death- is it really "tampering with a corpse" ? "unlawful burial?" there is a difference in the cases to which i am referring...is all I am saying. All the missing are not going to the same place.(with the exception of heaven)

The same parents really are victims - are so afraid of government and cps/ and consumed with protecting their own "rights" ( and images ) that they escape taking responsibility and take things into their own hands.

Hey the path has been cut before. they push the screen a little, sound the alarm, and hope people will buy that their family tragedy was part of this whole sick trend of America's missing. - two different tragedies maybe.

Praying for them all out there ...praying for Isa.
My heart goes out to all the families who have lost children.

:yellow:

I really must admit that I dont quite understand what you mean when you state ' a child's 'unintended death." I am not sure I have ever heard of an actual case where the child died accidentally or from natural causes and it was covered up by the parent or parents. If that is what you mean by 'unintended death.' Now of course I am aware of the CA defense which I do not believe for one nano second was an accident or an unintentional death of any kind.

Or are you saying the child was killed by the parent and they did not intend to kill the child? Sorry for not being very sure about what you are saying, iSleuth. If you are saying they abused the child and that resulted in death then I absolutely do not see how that is an 'unintended death.' Any actions taken by anyone that any reasonable person would know could cause grave bodily injuries and death is certainly not an 'unintended death', imo.

I missed the cases you are referring to in your post. What court cases involved a child's unintentional death and the evidence supported that the parent(s) hid the child's body to cover it up? tia

Maybe I need another cup of coffee this morning.

 

[buggsmom]

I completely agree. As I have mentioned before, they could release more videos to the media of Isa.Those could definitely reach more people then just their neighborhoods. More people IMO would be better able to recognize her by seeing her in action. I'm sure the family would have plenty of home videos that could let us hear her voice and see her different facial expressions! I don't believe that would cost the Celis' anything to have the news media get it out there? In fact the news media may even pay to have use of videos of Isa which I'm sure would be a lot more than selling bracelets and buttons. That would give more exposure for Isa which, if alive could truly bring her home! (also more funds to the family for the increased fliers that they feel they are in need of.)


Where are you little Isa? :rose:
You have many who think of you daily and want to see you home safe.:heart:

Personally, I don't think media should pay families for their missing child's photos or videos. I shouldn't be about making money, it should be about finding the child. I would like to see the parents, a family member, or friend representing the family put a face on the urgency of finding Isa. Let their comments and behavior be torn apart by the skeptics/public/media...that shouldn't matter. What should matter is finding Isa and showing that she has a family that misses her and needs to find her. Make her more than just a photo.
JMO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I've seen face painting done here in North Carolina many times at fairs and festivals. It's nothing but fun for the kids, a way to express themselves as animals, princesses, superheroes, etc. Absolutely innocent childhood fun for kids, parents, grandparents. IMO, of course.

Our daughter in law is an artist. She does face painting for many occasions for different festivals we have in the area. The children love it and also some of the mothers will have their face done too.

 

[OtherEyes]

It's very unpopular here on WS for parents to make any money selling pictures and videos of their child. It has caused a lot of criticism in Caylee and Lisa's case, because people believe the family members were involved. In cases where the parents are considered innocent, the whole selling footage issue is just not mentioned. I think most people just assume that innocent parents just give the footage away for free, which is probably true in most cases. From a public opinion standpoint, it would not look good for Becky and Sergio if it ever comes out they were paid for pictures/videos of Isabel.

Perhaps I should clarify. I was responding to the link originally posted by Jules in which a car wash was mentioned to be able to keep handing out fliers to the neighborhood. A spokesperson from Bring Isa Home said that " A lot of people still don't know who Isa is" "We want to spread her name and face out there as much as we can." the reporter asks what the funds will be used for and again it is stated for "more fliers and more materials to get Isa's face out there."

My response was based on the recent NBC Today piece where they did an experiment on missing child posters to see how effective they were. Most people who they tested felt they had seen the child in the missing poster/flyer but still felt unsure if it was in fact the missing child so they did not call authorities. My point was that while fliers are obviously something you want to have, it is only a flat one dimensional view of that child. After watching that piece I felt that indeed something else should be used along side of fliers to give a better view as to what that child really looks like with facial and body movement. I personally feel that seeing a video of someone makes a person more recognizable that just a still shot.

So while I completely understand the selling pictures for money issue,(Caylee, Lisa) that was not really what I was trying to convey. It was that getting more video out there could be very helpful as opposed to just papering their neighborhoods over and over.



http://www.tucsonmorningblend.com/videos/156047845.html
http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/47704638#.T9NblrB8B51

 

[PlainJaneDoe]

Our daughter in law is an artist. She does face painting for many occasions for different festivals we have in the area. The children love it and also some of the mothers will have their face done too.

Jmo jmo jmo...

I agree with everyone who has posted along these lines, that for Isa we have nothing to suggest that makeup was anything but fun and innocent. The only theoretical problem that I as an individual would have with kids wearing makeup would be if it that was a reflection of the child being taught or internalizing the idea that without a mask, he or she is somehow less valuable or less acceptable as a person.(Same problem I have with some adults who have to "put on their face.") IMOO it is not the makeup but the reasons for wearing it so I can't judge, but I don't get that from Isa's pics. :moo:

ETA, this may be OT, but I'm not "picking on" makeup. I feel the same way about push-up bras, hair color, etc. :cow:

 

[TxLady2]

It shows that individuals have different perceptions. I have looked closely at everything that has been released and I see no evidence whatsoever that shows me that Becky and Sergio are involved in Isa's kidnapping.

While some seem to believe that the 'suspects' and 'POIs' LE says they have are Becky and Sergio ......I think just as strongly that they are not and it is others that we arent aware of at this time.

There would be much more advantage by arresting one of the parents or both than letting them to continue to walk free to go to and from where they wish. Freedom is priceless and taking it away is devastating especially if it was behind bars. The community would be highly upset if LE knew the parents had harmed Isa and they didnt even arrest them and let them walk around free as a bird.

IMO, they have not arrested Sergio and Becky because they do not have one shred of evidence that they are involved.

IMO

They could have evidence that one or both parents are involved that we don't know about, but not enough to bring charges. We just don't know.

I have to say that over the several years that I've been following these cases of missing persons, it seems to me that whenever a family member or someone close to the family is involved, LE manages to figure it out and make an arrest fairly quickly. But if it is a stranger, or someone not known well by the family, the case takes a lot longer to resolve or in some cases, it is never solved and goes cold. I could be wrong and I really have no stats to back up this opinion, I'm just going by recollection. I'm sure there are cases out there where a family member has gotten away with it... but the cases I'm familiar with, it's usually pretty easy to figure out. Not many people have the skills to pull off something like that in their own home and get away with it. Blood evidence cannot be eradicated completely, traces can still be found years later with the equipment and technology LE has today. And even without any physical evidence, I don't know many parents who could go about their lives without displaying some kind of emotion, guilt or otherwise, unless they planned this, which I seriously doubt. If guilty, they will slip up sooner or later, and LE will be watching and listening.

As it stands now, I have no solid belief one way or another on whether they're guilty or innocent. I just pray that whoever is responsible will be held accountable and if the parents are not guilty, then they deserve some answers.

 

[cluciano63]

They could have evidence that one or both parents are involved that we don't know about, but not enough to bring charges. We just don't know.

I have to say that over the several years that I've been following these cases of missing persons, it seems to me that whenever a family member or someone close to the family is involved, LE manages to figure it out and make an arrest fairly quickly. But if it is a stranger, or someone not known well by the family, the case takes a lot longer to resolve or in some cases, it is never solved and goes cold. I could be wrong and I really have no stats to back up this opinion, I'm just going by recollection. I'm sure there are cases out there where a family member has gotten away with it... but the cases I'm familiar with, it's usually pretty easy to figure out. Not many people have the skills to pull off something like that in their own home and get away with it. Blood evidence cannot be eradicated completely, traces can still be found years later with the equipment and technology LE has today. And even without any physical evidence, I don't know many parents who could go about their lives without displaying some kind of emotion, guilt or otherwise, unless they planned this, which I seriously doubt. If guilty, they will slip up sooner or later, and LE will be watching and listening.

As it stands now, I have no solid belief one way or another on whether they're guilty or innocent. I just pray that whoever is responsible will be held accountable and if the parents are not guilty, then they deserve some answers.

When the child is not found, I am not sure how this applies...there are a few cases, such as Bianca Jones, where LE goes ahead and takes action, but it seems like there are more where they do not...JMO

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

When the child is not found, I am not sure how this applies...there are a few cases, such as Bianca Jones, where LE goes ahead and takes action, but it seems like there are more where they do not...JMO

One evening recently, DH asked me if there was anything new in the Celis case, and I said that there had been no new developments, no LE pressers, no national media coverage, etc. and that I was worried that there would never be an arrest or justice for Isabel. DH reminded me that it took several months before the Wayne County Prosecutor filed charges against Bianca's father, D'Andre Lane, who will now stand trial for the little girl's murder even though her body has not been recovered. Justice is coming for little Bianca Jones, and I hope that there will eventually be justice for Isabel. :moo:

 

[TxLady2]

Respectfully, driving drunk with a child in the car is not safe behavior, it puts a lot of people at risk...Also, CPS was at the house in December of last year. Perhaps we may not be aware of evrything that has happened ? Just MOO

With all due respect, how do we know that she was actually drunk? "Under the influence" is not the same as falling-down-drunk, and many people get arrested when they are barely over the legal limit, but still capable of driving responsibly. Obviously, they made at least one mistake or they would never have been stopped... but people also run red lights and stop signs when they're stone cold sober.
As far as putting a child at risk with even ONE drink inside you, I absolutely agree with you. NO ONE should get behind the wheel of a vehicle if their judgement has been slowed or altered with ANY substance. However, I know people who take OTC medications for allergies or prescriptions for pain, who get in a vehicle and drive all over the place, and never get stopped or involved in an accident. So to me, it's six of one and half a dozen of another.
I can't keep blaming someone for a DUI that happend five or six years ago, and using that to say it makes them capable of murder. Sorry, no disrespect intended, just stating my POV.

 

[TxLady2]

When the child is not found, I am not sure how this applies...there are a few cases, such as Bianca Jones, where LE goes ahead and takes action, but it seems like there are more where they do not...JMO

True, I was just pointing out that usually, IMO, if a parent is guilty, it's fairly obvious to LE early on, more often than not.
I did say that I have no real facts, just my impressions of what I recall, which could also be wrong.

 

[liz b.]

With all due respect, how do we know that she was actually drunk? "Under the influence" is not the same as falling-down-drunk, and many people get arrested when they are barely over the legal limit, but still capable of driving responsibly. Obviously, they made at least one mistake or they would never have been stopped... but people also run red lights and stop signs when they're stone cold sober.
As far as putting a child at risk with even ONE drink inside you, I absolutely agree with you. NO ONE should get behind the wheel of a vehicle if their judgement has been slowed or altered with ANY substance. However, I know people who take OTC medications for allergies or prescriptions for pain, who get in a vehicle and drive all over the place, and never get stopped or involved in an accident. So to me, it's six of one and half a dozen of another.
I can't keep blaming someone for a DUI that happend five or six years ago, and using that to say it makes them capable of murder. Sorry, no disrespect intended, just stating my POV.

Once again, I was resonding to another poster,who said that RC and SC had never done anything to put their kids at risk. Drunk driving is putting the child in the car with her at risk. That is what my post was about. MOO

Drunk driving is a choice. MOO I just have zero tolerance for it...MOO

 

[FrayedKnot]

With all due respect, how do we know that she was actually drunk? "Under the influence" is not the same as falling-down-drunk, and many people get arrested when they are barely over the legal limit, but still capable of driving responsibly. Obviously, they made at least one mistake or they would never have been stopped... but people also run red lights and stop signs when they're stone cold sober.
As far as putting a child at risk with even ONE drink inside you, I absolutely agree with you. NO ONE should get behind the wheel of a vehicle if their judgement has been slowed or altered with ANY substance. However, I know people who take OTC medications for allergies or prescriptions for pain, who get in a vehicle and drive all over the place, and never get stopped or involved in an accident. So to me, it's six of one and half a dozen of another.
I can't keep blaming someone for a DUI that happend five or six years ago, and using that to say it makes them capable of murder. Sorry, no disrespect intended, just stating my POV.

It isn't against the law to drive while taking Sudafed.

Maybe it SHOULD be, but as of now, it is not illegal.

I do not think a DUI suggests that someone is capable of murder. Manslaughter, definitely. When an impaired person gets behind the wheel and drives, it is only by the grace of God that they do not kill someone. Or just lucky, for those who don't believe in a higher power.

It is a stupid, criminally negligent thing to do and there is NEVER a good excuse for driving under the influence. And when one makes that decision with one's own child in the vehicle........don't get me started!!!!!

It does not make RC a murderer, but it does suggest that she has made a dangerously poor choice regarding her children in the past. She may be an awesome mom, we don't know; and I don't think anyone is still 'blaming' her for something she did years ago. But the incident was brought up as a rebuttal to a statement made that RC has never done anything to endanger her kids. And frankly, that isn't the case.

My anger is not directed at you, txlady, or any other poster , it is directed at people who have zero regard for their lives and the lives of others and get into their cars while impaired. That is something I have no tolerance for!

JMO

 

[FrayedKnot]

Once again, I was resonding to another poster,who said that RC and SC had never done anything to put their kids at risk. Drunk driving is putting the child in the car with her at risk. That is what my post was about. MOO

Drunk driving is a choice. MOO I just have zero tolerance for it...MOO

LOL, Liz b. Great minds and all.

 

[SpongeBathHotPants]

Just a quick question and if it is way out of left field and incorrect than I'm sorry but I keep hearing about fund raisers and donations and such and my question is what is the money for? And who gets it? I have been reading a lot of these cases over the years and usually money is one of the last subjects brought up and here it seems to be one of the most prevalent. Again, sorry if I am misinformed.