Book: Precious Angels

[Goody]

Goody....I have been reading the transcripts. The problem is....that the "facts" differ from one witness to another. I made this thread to talk about the books vs the testimonies. I am in no way an expert on this case. I have read many MANY things on the web about this case. I followed it when it was going on. The problem is....that everyone has a different "opinion" of the "facts". I am just trying to find a middle ground...and wanting to know which "account" to believe.:waitasec: If I say something wrong...for god's sake straighten me out. That is why I am here.

I am sorry,danielle (is that right?). I was posting that to beesy or thought I was. For some reason I messed it up.

This is what I was replying to. http://www.justicefordarlie.net/transcripts.php
It's alot to wade through. What I do is if I need to know one particular thing, I just do a search for it.

I didn't think it was a good way to understand the evidence from the trial transcripts. Mostly because different witnesses say different things. Sometimes you do have to pick and choose which version seems more logical. The whole trial concept is based on what is reasonable to believe, not so much on who is telling the whole truth and who isn't. Sometimes the facts do get lost in the shuffle, but most of the time I think you can weigh which fact is more likely to have occurred based on your own life experiences. Like when Darlie told the jury that she forgot to tell Mercedes she was dreaming when she saw the man standing over her/fighting with her/stabbing her (whichever it was), and that is why Mercedes might assume that it was a real memory as opposed to a dream, I found it totally unreasonable to believe. Who tells someone about a dream and doesn't start it with "I had a dream last night...."? But some people do believe her....go figure. If one didn't read all the transcripts and just that testimony alone, they might not realize how many different stories people claimed she told about how she was attacked.

Personally, I think the books are good and I am glad they are out there because they do provide some information you can't find in the transcripts , but the authors do make mistakes. Sometimes big ones, like Barbara Davis' on the knife going all the way thru Devon's body and sticking in the floor. Anyway, that is something to consider. The authors do try to tell the truth, I think, but they aren't under oath. They also might be pushed a little by publishers to "sensationalize" a bit. But my experience with true crime is that no one EVER gets it all right, not even the appellate courts when they hand down an opinion. Somewhere in the mix there will be a fact, usually some background info, that has slipped into the paperwork in error and is never corrected. I guess it is because so many people are involved.

 

[beesy]

I didn't mean to suggest I have never read the transcripts. I have. She said she was having trouble with it all so I thought I pass along to her what I do now. Which is to do a search for something specific, because I don't think it's all still in my brain. But, if Goody thinks they should all be read, then that's what you should do.

 

[Goody]

I didn't mean to suggest I have never read the transcripts. I have. She said she was having trouble with it all so I thought I pass along to her what I do now. Which is to do a search for something specific, because I don't think it's all still in my brain. But, if Goody thinks they should all be read, then that's what you should do.

Goody thinks if you are going to use the transcripts as a source of information to base an opinion on, you should read as much of the information on the topic as you can. At trials, people are under oath so it is the best source. But using the transcripts in parts and sections might be misleading. I guess it is really up to the individual how much time they want to devote to it. I just wanted to warn anyone doing that there are pitfalls in legal documents when you don't read them in their entirety, but I understand that it can also be a boring, cumbersome project to read all the material and not something everyone wants to do. There are plenty of knowledgable people here to help shake out the misconceptions.

 

[deanws]

Another place besides the two books that said the knife went all the way through Devon's body is the Arrest warrant. There is a copy of the arrest warrant in Springer's book starting on page 126-134. The specific information on the exit wound is on page 132(bottom paragraph)-133. So...I assume this is true...or at least the LE believe it to be true. I want to know if this is factual or not. I believe it is important because it would show extreme rage. This is a sign that a murder is personal according to the psychological make up of murderers.:waitasec:

 

[Goody]

Another place besides the two books that said the knife went all the way through Devon's body is the Arrest warrant. There is a copy of the arrest warrant in Springer's book starting on page 126-134. The specific information on the exit wound is on page 132(bottom paragraph)-133. So...I assume this is true...or at least the LE believe it to be true. I want to know if this is factual or not. I believe it is important because it would show extreme rage. This is a sign that a murder is personal according to the psychological make up of murderers.:waitasec:

Apparently they found what they thought was a nick in the flooring under the carpet when they cut out the carpet where Devon was laying. I think that is where the rumor started. It is one of those errors that once they find their way into the record take on a life of their own and never get corrected. The ME testified that Devon had no wounds that went all the way thru his body. As I recall, she was specific about that so my money is on her.

 

[beesy]

Apparently they found what they thought was a nick in the flooring under the carpet when they cut out the carpet where Devon was laying. I think that is where the rumor started. It is one of those errors that once they find their way into the record take on a life of their own and never get corrected. The ME testified that Devon had no wounds that went all the way thru his body. As I recall, she was specific about that so my money is on her.

and on the pictures

 

[Goody]

and on the pictures

Are the pictures of Devon's back?

 

[deanws]

Apparently they found what they thought was a nick in the flooring under the carpet when they cut out the carpet where Devon was laying. I think that is where the rumor started. It is one of those errors that once they find their way into the record take on a life of their own and never get corrected. The ME testified that Devon had no wounds that went all the way thru his body. As I recall, she was specific about that so my money is on her.

She is the one who said it. Dr Janice Townsend-Parchman.

 

[deanws]

Are the pictures of Devon's back?

Read the autopsy reports. It is under wound one. It say it goes from left to the right and penetrates into the right posterior chest approximately 1/16 inch. So, that is probably why we can't see the wound coming through the back area in the pictures. A 1/16 is a tiny tiny little split. So, the tip went through the body barely...which of course means that the knife could not have nicked the cement under the carpet. Never the less, it did go though him.

 

[beesy]

Are the pictures of Devon's back?

There is a cut-away scan of his injuries, the answer to that would be yes.

 

[Mary456]

Read the autopsy reports. It is under wound one. It say it goes from left to the right and penetrates into the right posterior chest approximately 1/16 inch. So, that is probably why we can't see the wound coming through the back area in the pictures. A 1/16 is a tiny tiny little split. So, the tip went through the body barely...which of course means that the knife could not have nicked the cement under the carpet. Never the less, it did go though him.

When it says "1/16 inch into the posterior chest", it means the back part of the body, the posterior. The depth of the wound was actually 5 inches, so it penetrated almost 5 inches into the anterior, and 1/16 inch into the posterior (Hope this makes sense!)

Anyway, the wound didn't exit his back and nick the floor. Page 298 in MTJD clearly shows Devon's back, and there are no exit wounds. As Goody said, the nick in the floor was put there when the house was built, and someone at the scene misinterpreted it when the carpet was removed. Very much like Dr. Lee misinterpreted an impression in the concrete in the O.J. Simpson case. It happens and, unfortunately, becomes an urban legend.

 

[deanws]

When it says "1/16 inch into the posterior chest", it means the back part of the body, the posterior. The depth of the wound was actually 5 inches, so it penetrated almost 5 inches into the anterior, and 1/16 inch into the posterior (Hope this makes sense!)

Anyway, the wound didn't exit his back and nick the floor. Page 298 in MTJD clearly shows Devon's back, and there are no exit wounds. As Goody said, the nick in the floor was put there when the house was built, and someone at the scene misinterpreted it when the carpet was removed. Very much like Dr. Lee misinterpreted an impression in the concrete in the O.J. Simpson case. It happens and, unfortunately, becomes an urban legend.

and penetrates into the right posterior chest approximately 1/16 inch. Read the autopsy. Wound one....it says it goes in from the left side of the chest....and penetrates...meaning it goes through... I am well aware what the meaning of the word posterior means. The point went through the back side 1/16th of an inch. That is a very very small point. Read my original post again. You will see that I did say that it would not have caused the nick on the floor under the carpet.

 

[deanws]

Anyway, the wound didn't exit his back and nick the floor. Page 298 in MTJD clearly shows Devon's back, and there are no exit wounds. As Goody said, the nick in the floor was put there when the house was built, and someone at the scene misinterpreted it when the carpet was removed. Very much like Dr. Lee misinterpreted an impression in the concrete in the O.J. Simpson case. It happens and, unfortunately, becomes an urban legend.

What MTJD is trying to do is challenge the ME's autopsy. I see the picture you are referring to. Do you know how small 1/16th of an inch is? The picture is not even a close up of his back. There would be no way to see it in the picture they presented. No one said it was a gaping wound. ( - ) See inside the ()? The little - is the size of 1/16th of an inch.

 

[Mary456]

and penetrates into the right posterior chest approximately 1/16 inch. Read the autopsy. Wound one....it says it goes in from the left side of the chest....and penetrates...meaning it goes through... I am well aware what the meaning of the word posterior means. The point went through the back side 1/16th of an inch. That is a very very small point. Read my original post again. You will see that I did say that it would not have caused the nick on the floor under the carpet.

I'm sorry, Pam. When you said, "So, the tip went through the body barely", I thought you meant that it only penetrated Devon's skin 1/16 of an inch. My mistake.

And yes, I was agreeing with you that the knife didn't cause the nick in the floor. Sometimes I don't express myself real well in writing. I apologize for any misunderstanding.

 

[deanws]

I'm sorry, Pam. When you said, "So, the tip went through the body barely", I thought you meant that it only penetrated Devon's skin 1/16 of an inch. My mistake.

And yes, I was agreeing with you that the knife didn't cause the nick in the floor. Sometimes I don't express myself real well in writing. I apologize for any misunderstanding.

I was looking at that wound because I believe it shows extreme rage, which is often associated with a crime that is personal. Can you imagine the wack that she had to take for the knife to go that far into his little body? It also nicked the rib bones as it tore through him. It really makes me wonder where all that rage came from..and how a mother could actually do such a thing to their child. Anyway, that is why I was researching that wound.

 

[Goody]

She is the one who said it. Dr Janice Townsend-Parchman.

She did the autopsy on Damon, not Devon. However, I did find this. Is this what you are referring to?

22 Q. Okay. Are we now looking at stab wound
23 number 1?
24 A. Yes. It's gone through the 8th rib.
25 And you can see that it goes into the left lung to a depth
Sandra M. Halsey, CSR, Official Court Reporter
121
1 of one and three quarter inches.
2 And stab wound number 2 goes through
3 the right 8th rib. All the way through the right lung and
4 actually penetrated the anterior chest wall, not all the
5 way through.
6 Q. Is this area here the anterior chest
7 wall?
8 A. Yes. The anterior chest wall, the
9 inside.
10 Q. Okay.
11 A. Stab wound number 3 goes through the
12 right 8th intercostal space, the muscle between the right
13 8th and 9th ribs and goes into the right lung, as you can
14 see there.
15 Q. Okay.
16 A. And stab wound number 4 is in the right
17 11th intercostal musculature between the right 11th and
18 12th ribs. And it goes through the right lung diaphragm
19 and into the right lobe of the liver.
20 Q. Okay. Thank you, Doctor.
21
22 (Whereupon, the witness
23 resumed the witness
24 stand, and the
25 proceedings were resumed
Sandra M. Halsey, CSR, Official Court Reporter
122

1 on the record, as
2 follows
3
4 BY MR. GREG DAVIS:
5 Q. Doctor, let me just ask you, what is
6 your opinion concerning the cause of death of Damon
7 Routier?
8 A. Sharp force injuries to the back.

 

[deanws]

She did the autopsy on Damon, not Devon. However, I did find this. Is this what you are referring to?

22 Q. Okay. Are we now looking at stab wound
23 number 1?
24 A. Yes. It's gone through the 8th rib.
25 And you can see that it goes into the left lung to a depth
Sandra M. Halsey, CSR, Official Court Reporter
121
1 of one and three quarter inches.
2 And stab wound number 2 goes through
3 the right 8th rib. All the way through the right lung and
4 actually penetrated the anterior chest wall, not all the
5 way through.
6 Q. Is this area here the anterior chest
7 wall?
8 A. Yes. The anterior chest wall, the
9 inside.
10 Q. Okay.
11 A. Stab wound number 3 goes through the
12 right 8th intercostal space, the muscle between the right
13 8th and 9th ribs and goes into the right lung, as you can
14 see there.
15 Q. Okay.
16 A. And stab wound number 4 is in the right
17 11th intercostal musculature between the right 11th and
18 12th ribs. And it goes through the right lung diaphragm
19 and into the right lobe of the liver.
20 Q. Okay. Thank you, Doctor.
21
22 (Whereupon, the witness
23 resumed the witness
24 stand, and the
25 proceedings were resumed
Sandra M. Halsey, CSR, Official Court Reporter
122

1 on the record, as
2 follows
3
4 BY MR. GREG DAVIS:
5 Q. Doctor, let me just ask you, what is
6 your opinion concerning the cause of death of Damon
7 Routier?
8 A. Sharp force injuries to the back.

There was an autopsy on both children. It did go through Devon. Read the autopsy. Wound one.

 

[Goody]

There was an autopsy on both children. It did go through Devon. Read the autopsy. Wound one.

Sorry, but all I could find in Dr Joni McClain's testimony about Devon is that the number one wound was 5 inches deep. The other reference we have already posted here is on Damon. It sounds to me like if it happened at all, it had to be to Damon, not Devon.

 

[deanws]

Sorry, but all I could find in Dr Joni McClain's testimony about Devon is that the number one wound was 5 inches deep. The other reference we have already posted here is on Damon. It sounds to me like if it happened at all, it had to be to Damon, not Devon.

It was Devon. I am not talking about the transcript. I am talking about the official autopsy. Read the official autopsy. I copied that part of the autopsy in my above posts relating to the fact that the knife went through the body and came out the other side....1/16th of an inch. It was the point of the knife. As I said before, it couldn't have caused the nick under the carpet because the tip barely came out the posterior chest wall. Posterior means the back side of the chest. You can't see it in the photos because 1/16th of an inch is about this - big.

and penetrates into the right posterior chest approximately 1/16 inch. Read the autopsy. Wound one....it says it goes in from the left side of the chest....and penetrates...meaning it goes through... The point went through the back side 1/16th of an inch.

 

[beesy]

It was Devon. I am not talking about the transcript. I am talking about the official autopsy. Read the official autopsy. I copied that part of the autopsy in my above posts relating to the fact that the knife went through the body and came out the other side....1/16th of an inch. It was the point of the knife. As I said before, it couldn't have caused the nick under the carpet because the tip barely came out the posterior chest wall. Posterior means the back side of the chest. You can't see it in the photos because 1/16th of an inch is about this - big.

and penetrates into the right posterior chest approximately 1/16 inch. Read the autopsy. Wound one....it says it goes in from the left side of the chest....and penetrates...meaning it goes through... The point went through the back side 1/16th of an inch.

You're right. I've read the autopsy reports many times. I was protesting the nick in the subflooring rumor, not the depth of the wound. You done good, love.