GUILTY CA - Leslie Lamb, 36, tortured & beaten to death, Oakland, 26 Aug 2006

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Yes; it might have to be moved into the bizarre thread!
 
southcitymom said:
Neither do dildos, vibrators and *advertiser censored* tapes, but parents manage to keep these hidden. Most parents don't even TRY to explain the full spectrum of sexual behavior and somehow kids manage to figure it out on their own!;)

Maybe Glitch's dungeon is off premises...
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"Maybe Glitch's dungeon is off premises"
I sure hope so!

There is a difference between *advertiser censored* etc. and "the blood of several people" and equipment used to cause that blood. If it can easily be mistaken for a torture chamber perhaps having it in a home with children isn't a good idea.

To me it's kind of like keeping a loaded gun in your room where children might get ahold of it. Or having a "nice pitbull" as a pet. What IF?!?!
If they were to play with this stuff they find they could get hurt or hurt someone else seeing how it's so easy to have an instance when "the guy wasn't so good at it and accidently she died". Certainly if "the guy" had an accident, couldn't the kids as well?

As for having the blood of several people on your walls or wherever, I imagine seeing the blood would be a pretty scarey thing for a child!

JMO
 
OneLostGrl said:
"Maybe Glitch's dungeon is off premises"
I sure hope so!

There is a difference between *advertiser censored* etc. and "the blood of several people" and equipment used to cause that blood. If it can easily be mistaken for a torture chamber perhaps having it in a home with children isn't a good idea.

To me it's kind of like keeping a loaded gun in your room where children might get ahold of it. Or having a "nice pitbull" as a pet. What IF?!?!
If they were to play with this stuff they find they could get hurt or hurt someone else seeing how it's so easy to have an instance when "the guy wasn't so good at it and accidently she died". Certainly if "the guy" had an accident, couldn't the kids as well?

As for having the blood of several people on your walls or wherever, I imagine seeing the blood would be a pretty scarey thing for a child!

JMO
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In Glitchwizard's original posting, Luminol was mentioned. This led me to believe that any blood that might be around would not be readily apparent, and I don't imagine it could be seen without forensic assistance.

Heck, blood can certainly be shed in sexual encounters that don't involve any "toys" at all.
 
And there are places on the body that even with tiny deep scratches will bleed profusely. I didn't read the article word for word, but I don't recall them saying there was copious amounts of blood all over the place. It's tragic whether she was willing or not. But I think there may have been some willingness since she didn't live there. If I was into that and then decided not to go that route anymore and lived at home, when creepo came over I'd just tell Mom & Dad and his reception would let him know in no uncertain terms he needed to move along in life.
 
The man has a history of Violence! Come on!
His ex-wife had a restraining order out on him! His neighbors saw him being verbally abusive to women. "We saw him argue with other girlfriends," said one man, who asked not to be named because he feared retribution. "We know that he had a temper and could be quite angry."

Is that part of the "sex games" too? From my understanding of S&M it is about the ultimate in trust and love not -anger and abuse! There is a huge difference!
 
OneLostGrl said:
The man has a history of Violence! Come on!
His ex-wife had a restraining order out on him! His neighbors saw him being verbally abusive to women. "We saw him argue with other girlfriends," said one man, who asked not to be named because he feared retribution. "We know that he had a temper and could be quite angry."

Is that part of the "sex games" too? From my understanding of S&M it is about the ultimate in trust and love not -anger and abuse! There is a huge difference!
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Yes, you are probably right. We don't really have enough information to know if there was a true S&M angle. These guy could well just be an angry psycho.

And I agree with you that BDSM is grounded in trust, safety and respect.
 
This does not sound like sex games accidently going wrong. The autopsy showed she was horribly tortured and killed. No accident. The blood is from her and 2 other women. He likely is a serial killer.
 
Someone likened Glitches dungeon to that of having a loaded gun in the house.
I would think that anyone with a gun in the house and who had children would take the neccessary precautions.
Why would a S&M chamber be any different?
Plenty feel there is nothing wrong with having a gun in the house and I agree as long as safety procautions are taken with children in the home. (Like a lock box)

Many parents don't permit their children in their bedrooms at all or their offices.
Why would that be any different then a locked door for an adult orientated room?

If a key for a lockbox is enough to ensure a gun in the home of children ensures safety then why would a key not be enough for a room?
I would think a two sided keyed deadbolt would be sufficient.

I also think that some people tend to get a little uncomfortable when sexuality is mentioned and it brings about unreasonable reactions.

I admire Glitches comfort in mentioning it.

That all being said.... This man seems to be very violent and I am not so sure this room really was an innocent thing that went to far.
I think it is more likely a place he took women against there will.
Possibly he brought her to the hospital because she would be missed and the others whom he harmed would not be? Maybe he did not know her mother knew nothing of their relationship?
 
OneLostGrl said:
The man has a history of Violence! Come on!
His ex-wife had a restraining order out on him! His neighbors saw him being verbally abusive to women. "We saw him argue with other girlfriends," said one man, who asked not to be named because he feared retribution. "We know that he had a temper and could be quite angry."

Is that part of the "sex games" too? From my understanding of S&M it is about the ultimate in trust and love not -anger and abuse! There is a huge difference!
Click to expand...
Well it's SUPPOSED to be about trust and there's supposed to be a "safe word" to use when one participant wants to bail, but......... apparently this wasn't the set up in the OT
 
Amraann said:
Someone likened Glitches dungeon to that of having a loaded gun in the house.
I would think that anyone with a gun in the house and who had children would take the neccessary precautions.
Why would a S&M chamber be any different?
Plenty feel there is nothing wrong with having a gun in the house and I agree as long as safety procautions are taken with children in the home. (Like a lock box)

Many parents don't permit their children in their bedrooms at all or their offices.
Why would that be any different then a locked door for an adult orientated room?

If a key for a lockbox is enough to ensure a gun in the home of children ensures safety then why would a key not be enough for a room?
I would think a two sided keyed deadbolt would be sufficient.

I also think that some people tend to get a little uncomfortable when sexuality is mentioned and it brings about unreasonable reactions.

I admire Glitches comfort in mentioning it.

That all being said.... This man seems to be very violent and I am not so sure this room really was an innocent thing that went to far.
I think it is more likely a place he took women against there will.
Possibly he brought her to the hospital because she would be missed and the others whom he harmed would not be? Maybe he did not know her mother knew nothing of their relationship?
Click to expand...
Great post. Agree with all of it.
 
Call me crazy, but when LE cringed (did you see the officers talking about it?) while speaking of the "torture chamber" I assumed they knew what they were talking about. I'm sure they've seen it all as far as BDSM goes...and I bet they know the difference between the two.
 
This has less to do with bondage and more to do with kidnapping and killing. When I first read the thread bondage never even cossed my mind.The guy most likely a psycho serial killer!
 
Amraann said:
Someone likened Glitches dungeon to that of having a loaded gun in the house.
I would think that anyone with a gun in the house and who had children would take the neccessary precautions.
Why would a S&M chamber be any different?
Plenty feel there is nothing wrong with having a gun in the house and I agree as long as safety procautions are taken with children in the home. (Like a lock box)

What I said was "To me it's kind of like keeping a loaded gun in your room where children might get ahold of it. Or having a "nice pitbull" as a pet. What IF?!?!

Many parents don't permit their children in their bedrooms at all or their offices.
Why would that be any different then a locked door for an adult orientated room?

My bedroom is my & hubby's private space and my boys know that they may not come hang out in there but sometimes in the middle of the night they will come to my room because they are sick or something. Even if a room is off-limit's, there may be a reason kids may enter it at some point.

I feel the potential danger of keeping a loaded gun in my home is too great. Violence breeds violence and I don't want my kids to ever think I would commit any kind of violence- on anyone!

I would never try to tell someone the choices they make for their kids are wrong... I was just saying how *I* felt, is all!
If a key for a lockbox is enough to ensure a gun in the home of children ensures safety then why would a key not be enough for a room?
I would think a two sided keyed deadbolt would be sufficient.

What if someday in a locked dungeon (In a childs home) something goes wrong and someone dies? Surely the cops would have to be called, no? That locked room would be opened when the child is there. A kid knowing someone died in their home would be enough, but, for the child to also be faced with the fact that "mommy or daddy" died in that room and there is blood in the room they were in.

A childs mind does not process things the way ours does.
The child would be left wondering why mommy or daddy "killed" someone.
Nope, the risk is too great for me.



I also think that some people tend to get a little uncomfortable when sexuality is mentioned and it brings about unreasonable reactions.

Discussing sexuality does not make me uncomfortable. The potential for violence does. If this woman died engaging in S&M then, yeah, I guess that does make me uncomfortable! A "guy wasn't so good at it" and someone else died!



I admire Glitches comfort in mentioning it.

That all being said.... This man seems to be very violent and I am not so sure this room really was an innocent thing that went to far.
I think it is more likely a place he took women against there will.
Possibly he brought her to the hospital because she would be missed and the others whom he harmed would not be? Maybe he did not know her mother knew nothing of their relationship?
Click to expand...

I understand that we cannot live for our children, we have to have a life outside of them but when I get in the car I wear my seatbelt because it's the responable thing to do- Two children depend on me- I have to stay safe for them!
 
This is, of course, my personal opinion but I STRONGLY feel that anyone who would knowingly cause pain to another human, even if that peson WANTED them to, has a problem! It goes against every instinct in my soul. Would they also kill someone if the person WANTED to be killed? To me it seem reasonable that if smoking pot leads to harder drugs, then causing pain will lead to harder torture and maybe to murder. Sick, sick, sick in my opinion!!!
 
Amraann said:
That all being said.... This man seems to be very violent and I am not so sure this room really was an innocent thing that went to far.
I think it is more likely a place he took women against there will.
Possibly he brought her to the hospital because she would be missed and the others whom he harmed would not be? Maybe he did not know her mother knew nothing of their relationship?
Click to expand...
Agreed. I got the impression from the articles I've read locally about this case, that she was a battered woman, this was not the first time he beat her up! So why keep going back to him if she wasn't living with him???:doh:

I think his story that he found her in a car when he brought her to the hospital was stupid! The police didn't believe it for a second. Was he so stupid or arrogant to think he wouldn't get caught? And I'm p.o.'ed at the neighbors for not reporting the fights outside. This is a case of a batterer turned murderer.
 
POSTED: 3:20 pm PDT October 6, 2006
UPDATED: 10:11 am PDT October 7, 2006


OAKLAND -- A man suspected of killing a San Leandro woman after torturing her in the basement of his Oakland home made his first court appearance Friday morning, but his arraignment isn't expected to take place until next week.

Earlwilliam Scott Stefanson Jr., 41, was scheduled to enter a plea Friday in Alameda County Superior Court on charges that he murdered 36-year-old Leslie Lamb.

The case, however, was referred to the public defender's office and the arraignment is scheduled to continue Tuesday afternoon before Judge Trina Stanley in Department 112.

"Earl" Stefanson is being held on no-bail status in Alameda County jail.

According to Oakland police, Stefanson drove Lamb to Highland Hospital the night of Aug. 26. She had been severely beaten and was pronounced dead shortly afterward.

Stefanson told police that he found her in a car, but investigators quickly determined that wasn't the case and a search warrant was issued for Stefanson's home in the 3400 block of Coolidge Avenue, according to police Sgt. Tony Jones. more at link:http://www.ktvu.com/news/10020147/detail.html
 
This is my first time back to this thread in awhile, it seems!

First of all, sexual proclivities run the full gamut from being non-sexual to more than most human brains (including mine!) can comprehend. Masters and Johnson did a study to see just what was "normal" behavior in the bedroom and found out that there isn't any normal. S&M was actually taken OUT of the DSM books that psychologists use to diagnose mental disorders. Literally tens of thousands of normal people show up to conventions every single year - and those don't include people like me that don't go. I'm sorry the one poster thinks it's wrong. It's okay though, because I have the same opinion of people with closed minds. It doesn't make either of us right, it's just how it is.

Yes, S&M is all about trust and safety - I am THRILLED that some of you know that! It's been very clear to me that S&M marraiges are CLOSER and more INTIMATE than any other type of marraige I've seen. I'm jealous of it, actually - the intimacy is just so intense you can FEEL it just being around them.

However, in this case, we aren't talking about a marraige. We're talking about a girl that went to a guy's house without telling her parents of the relationship. To me, that's just like the single women I know who sleep around - but with an element of S&M involved, you don't just tell your parents, of course. Anyway, just because S&M relationships are SUPPOSED to be SAFE, SANE and CONSENSUAL - doesn't mean they all are. Just like any other relationship. No relationship is supposed to kill you, or be anything you don't want. But they are. Regular relationships, S&M relationships - unfortunately all involve human beings. You don't have more of a chance of being killed in any kind of relationship, actually.

It's entirely possible she went to his dungeon on multiple occassions, enjoyed the heck out of it - or was "new" to this and was actually being abused and didn't leave - many women in all kinds of relationships stay during abuse. It's possible he was a horrible person - drawn to the lifestyle because of all the cool toys - but takes things too far. I wasn't saying he's a good guy - I was saying it MIGHT be something else. However, for the police to say "savagely" beaten - that's not S&M, that's just wrong. Very few people in this world agree to be savagely beaten, I'd say.

And yes, I have a daughter. She's 14. She isn't home when I am in the dungeon - and I do not do anything extreme enough that it's dangerous or that an accident could occur that would require emergency personnelle. I know people who do those things (breath play, etc.) but I don't lock up anyone where they can't get out in case of fire, etc. I have had a kid for the last 14 years - so safety has been on my mind all that time - I'm not putting anyone else at risk either.

And yes, the dungeon is actually located separate from the house, in a locked shed. Someone broke into it once and fled, not taking the time to shut the door and it made me look at the room in a whole new light. To me, it was a place of fun and games - to the guy breaking in looking for power tools - well, he probably got terrified thinking *I* was a Silence of the Lambs kind of girl. :)

But to each his own. Just as one of you can't imagine someone spanking someone else for fun, I can't imagine laying in a bed with a man I was married to - knowing that each sexual time would be just like the last time - dissappointed, boring, routine. What makes you happy doesn't make me happy. Doesn't make either of us wrong. It just means we date/marry different types of men. That's all.
 
GlitchWizard said:
......(snip)
But to each his own. Just as one of you can't imagine someone spanking someone else for fun, I can't imagine laying in a bed with a man I was married to - knowing that each sexual time would be just like the last time - dissappointed, boring, routine. What makes you happy doesn't make me happy. Doesn't make either of us wrong. It just means we date/marry different types of men. That's all.
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Hey Glitchwizard. Thanks for sharing this. The story about the guy looking for power tools is HILARIOUS! :)

I highlighted the part of your post that describes me and dh to some extent! We're pretty vanilla these days and it works for us like a charm. IMHO, in the arena of sexual practice there's no right or wrong between consenting adults.

I also wanted to mention that I know one couple bound in a BDSM relationship and their level of intimacy and honesty is really amazing.
 
Ahem... back to the topic. Anywhoooo... the mother sounds somewhat intelligient and that this was some big secret kept from her. Her daughter's "relationship" with this guy, that is. Sounds like he's a meth-head. Maybe she got caught up in meth and he was her meth-daddy... got her into some bondage then killed her in a meth rage. Wonder if they found drugs in her system?
 
southcitymom said:
Hey Glitchwizard. Thanks for sharing this. The story about the guy looking for power tools is HILARIOUS! :)

I highlighted the part of your post that describes me and dh to some extent! We're pretty vanilla these days and it works for us like a charm. IMHO, in the arena of sexual practice there's no right or wrong between consenting adults.

I also wanted to mention that I know one couple bound in a BDSM relationship and their level of intimacy and honesty is really amazing.
Click to expand...


Southhhhhhhhh!
 
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