CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #48

[Emma Ems]

Of course, MR doesn't do much on his own does he?IMO

I would hope that instead of reading online he was indeed passing out fliers like he said he does when he has time off from work.

Just my thoughts on that...

 

[Bayou Mistress]

I always find it a bit unnerving when the people involved in these cases start complaining about what is happening on the Internet. Makes me think they are spending too much time reading it. Plus, I don't like the whole ~blaming game. Like Dylan can't be found because people on the Internet are speculating about the case. Your child is missing...Stop googling yourself.

I did too at first. And then I saw time and time again that the families of missing sometimes get more information from the media than they do from LE. Like the 9:37 communication from Dylan. I can't imagine the agony of having a missing child and LE having to by necessity, not tell me what was going on.

 

[azgrandma]

I do not believe LE will be searching again. I personally believe they don't have the funds for it. Elaine and family are getting their own divers that will have, from what I understand, ROV's. The dive team is supposed to awesome. They are just waiting until the ice breaks up enough to safely put in boats.

I'm not sure if Wendy and her team will be back. Right now they need to get the lake searched.

The divers will be there for a while. They want to make sure the lake is searched good.

Wouldn't that be a wonderful opportunity for MR to show some independent support for Dylan? They are looking for places for the divers to stay, some people have offered their homes, perhaps MR would offer his home for a bit. He wouldn't need anyone's permission (as he has implied before) it wouldn't cost him anything, he could continue to work as always so it would not interrupt his employment, I'm sure he has a at least one spare room he could offer.
Sounds like a perfect opportunity to aide in the search for Dylan.

 

[Seajay]

I'm curious as to why other WS'ers think about the hits on the lake and why LE has seemed to discount it???

This has always been troubling to me because the only real information we get is from LE. We know that SAR has reported hits on the lake in different places. Why doesn't LE take their seriously and so quickly discounted it out of hand as the dogs making a mistake???

 

[nursebeeme]

I'm curious as to why other WS'ers think about the hits on the lake and why LE has seemed to discount it???

This has always been troubling to me because the only real information we get is from LE. We know that SAR has reported hits on the lake in different places. Why doesn't LE take their seriously and so quickly discounted it out of hand as the dogs making a mistake???

jmhoo but I don't think they have discounted it... I think they did what they could at the time with the weather and water temps.

they also could have more investigative info that we are not aware of?:twocents::twocents:

 

[findDylan]

Wouldn't that be a wonderful opportunity for MR to show some independent support for Dylan? They are looking for places for the divers to stay, some people have offered their homes, perhaps MR would offer his home for a bit. He wouldn't need anyone's permission (as he has implied before) it wouldn't cost him anything, he could continue to work as always so it would not interrupt his employment, I'm sure he has a at least one spare room he could offer.
Sounds like a perfect opportunity to aide in the search for Dylan.

It would be a great opportunity for him. But we both know, IMO,the chances of that happening. And I'm not sure they would want to stay there. But the gesture would be nice. IMO

 

[findDylan]

I'm curious as to why other WS'ers think about the hits on the lake and why LE has seemed to discount it???

This has always been troubling to me because the only real information we get is from LE. We know that SAR has reported hits on the lake in different places. Why doesn't LE take their seriously and so quickly discounted it out of hand as the dogs making a mistake???

The only thing that makes any sense to me is that they know someone is down there and their divers couldn't get to whomever is down there and so they down play it until spring in hopes the person floats up or they get their divers down there. IMO. I just can't figure out another reason why.

 

[Ghostwheel]

I'm curious as to why other WS'ers think about the hits on the lake and why LE has seemed to discount it???

This has always been troubling to me because the only real information we get is from LE. We know that SAR has reported hits on the lake in different places. Why doesn't LE take their seriously and so quickly discounted it out of hand as the dogs making a mistake???

LE might have seemed to discount it because:
They didn't have enough money or manpower to search the whole lake.
They are trying to throw any person that they are suspicious of off, make them feel more secure that they will not be caught (maybe make a mistake).
They wanted to wait until spring thaw.
They didn't discount it out of hand, just mentioned other options that they think could cause the dogs to hit on the lake, and it was misinterpreted by MSM (or someone else).

Those are a few reasons, IMO, why it might look like LE has discounted it, but maybe really didn't.

 

[Emma Ems]

I'm curious as to why other WS'ers think about the hits on the lake and why LE has seemed to discount it???

This has always been troubling to me because the only real information we get is from LE. We know that SAR has reported hits on the lake in different places. Why doesn't LE take their seriously and so quickly discounted it out of hand as the dogs making a mistake???

This is just a back of the mind thought I had as I wanted to research it more before I tossed it out there, but I just tried to pull up information and while I see the Vallecito area is rich in Native American culture I can't find any information as to if, when they built the lake in 1939-40, to indicate whether it may have been built where any Native American tribes may have had burial sites. Locals would probably know more about the folklore of the area as it seems the Archaeological Resources Protection Act didn't come into existence, from what I have found thus far, until 1979. I recall reading some studies were dogs were able to detect decomp over a hundred years old. My thoughts were kind of like, maybe the local PD may know a history of the land better than any outsiders would, and had considered that if the hits were in various parts of the lake that maybe it was because there was a possibility natives had been buried there and that the decomp remained in the soil as old as it was, and was pushed around during construction of the lake. It seems that could be a possibility because from what I have read there have been many tribes that have inhabited the area for quite a while. Like I said, this is just a thought that's been in the back of my mind as a possible consideration too.

Just to add in a few links on Vallecito history:

http://www.blackhawkpublishing.com/BP010102Vallecito Stories.htm

http://dino3535.wordpress.com/bayfield-vallecito-lake-history/

Your post reminded me that it was something I had wanted to look into at a later time.

 

[Angelonline]

jmhoo but I don't think they have discounted it... I think they did what they could at the time with the weather and water temps.

they also could have more investigative info that we are not aware of?:twocents::twocents:

In news articles with LE quotes they have seemed to discount it. IMO. However maybe that is only what they are telling the public, and they aren't really discounting them at all. Who knows..

 

[Confusion]

I'm curious as to why other WS'ers think about the hits on the lake and why LE has seemed to discount it???

This has always been troubling to me because the only real information we get is from LE. We know that SAR has reported hits on the lake in different places. Why doesn't LE take their seriously and so quickly discounted it out of hand as the dogs making a mistake???

I believe there's a very good chance that someone is down there. That doesn't mean it has to be Dylan; there are a lot of homeless people in the general area who may not be missed, someone could have been there on a fishing trip and drowned, Emma Ems' idea could be possible, or any nuber of other things.

I don't really think they're discounting the hits. I think it's more like them saying when LE will say that they don't believe there's a predator out there, doing whatever the predator is out there doing, when they have no idea if it's true or not. I think there are just times when their best option is to just say something to pacify people as much as possible when they don't know (and aren't likely to learn real soon) what the truth is but they want to avoid panic/riots/vigilantism, etc. MOO

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I did too at first. And then I saw time and time again that the families of missing sometimes get more information from the media than they do from LE. Like the 9:37 communication from Dylan. I can't imagine the agony of having a missing child and LE having to by necessity, not tell me what was going on.

But there's a difference between reading an article online, and reading the comments below that article. If you want to read what's happening on the Internet, read MSM articles. If you want to read the opinions of ordinary people, go ahead, but be warned that you might read things you don't like. I also don't agree about complaining about it to the media.

 

[aust amateur slueth]

someone had asked in the last thread to post this picture....

View attachment 31419

https://www.dcshoes.com.au/media/catalog/product/d/c/dc_mens_metalcore_t-shirt_51200549_blk_1_c.jpg

I don't know how to make it a bigger picture...sorry

It does look close to the shirt Dylan was wearing at Walmart and the airport. Someone had mentioned that it may have been a hand-me-down from Cory and I think that could be a possibility.....could have been washed many, many times....

This could all be cleared up if AZgrandma knows what he was wearing when he got on the plane.... :blushing:

My son no longer has his old DC shirt...

Thanks Scorekeeper!

I think it could just be the graininess of the walmart and airport pictures that make it appear as if it was an old t shirt.

 

[Seajay]

Thanks to those who replied to my question. It just seemed odd that LE said that it was probably an elk or something, like it wasn't a big deal.

Granted, because they knew they would not be able to get into the lake at that time, and didn't want to panic anyone, they downplayed the importance of it, but when Wendy took her dogs in and they alerted on pretty much the same areas, I had to wonder why LE didn't think it was much to start with.

Several good thoughts have come up though. Indian Burial grounds. I would never have thought of that, but it's possible. Centuries before we set foot in the area, Native Americans have lived there. We've all heard countless times where contruction is going up someplace and burial grounds were found. Heck, a couple of years ago over by where I live, a business was relandscaping the front of their business and found ancient burial grounds of an indigenous tribe that lived in the area a few hundred years back.

And of course, we don't know if someone else drowned in that lake and the remains were never recovered, this could be why the dogs alerted on the area.

It's just that I like to take LE's statements as the most reliable, over MSM, and the family, because MSM goes for sensationalism and the family tends to be biased in their opinions. IMO

Even at that, LE has been known to leak false or partial information in order to get a specific response, sort of like a fishing expedition. IMO, JMO, MOO.

 

[MissJ]

Interesting comment upthread about whether an old cemetery could be under the lake. I lived in a community where Army Corps forced us to leave and flooded thousands of acres including possibly as many as 15 cemeteries. There were attempts to remove and re bury most of the graves that could be found but in one of the native american cemeteries the headstones were gone. But could old graves give off human decomp after so many years, who knows? JMO

 

[TxLady2]

BBM.., I didn't see where they said they got a search warrant. All it said was it was routine. For all we (general) know Jessica's mom said to go ahead and go in. MR let LE go in and do a search as well. Then 10 days later they showed up with a warrant. There is a reason for that. IMO

quote:
Not more than 10 minutes later, the FBI set up a mobile crime scene lab, put on protective clothing and entered Jessica's home.

Sounds like a full forensics search to me, which would probably require a SW.
MOO.

 

[deoneta]

quote:
Not more than 10 minutes later, the FBI set up a mobile crime scene lab, put on protective clothing and entered Jessica's home.

Sounds like a full forensics search to me, which would probably require a SW.
MOO.

From OCT 10, regarding the search of the Jessica's home:

GRACE:
The mom has completely cooperated with police. The police, the FBI, the K-9s came into the home with her agreement. It was a permission search. They did not have to seek a warrant. And she says she understands they got to look at her first and then move on. She`s been nothing but cooperative, to my understanding, Shaul.

I forgot to say from the Nancy Grace show.

 

[SCHMAE]

Slightly OT but not really.
I'm finally watching " the imposter' . It's on netflix stream. It's somewhat similar to Dylan's case and so far very fascinating and disturbing if anyone is so inclined. It's a true story about a missing boy, fyi.

 

[*Lash*]

In my opinion, if LE was aware of any Indian burial grounds or decomp left in the soil of the reservoir, they would have stated this as a possible reason for the cadaver hits. Just like they used the elk excuse.

 

[Emma Ems]

Interesting comment upthread about whether an old cemetery could be under the lake. I lived in a community where Army Corps forced us to leave and flooded thousands of acres including possibly as many as 15 cemeteries. There were attempts to remove and re bury most of the graves that could be found but in one of the native american cemeteries the headstones were gone. But could old graves give off human decomp after so many years, who knows? JMO

They could and have before in the past. I was looking for some examples but while doing that, I also came across part of a book in Google Books that said that if a body is in cool, damp soil something called adipocere can slow down decomp and I seem to recall that the Vallecito area is/was at one point the site of a glacier. So it's probably very possible. I also think of miners (lots of mines in the area it seems too) and drifters of the past. People who stayed in town or died in town were buried in the town cemeteries, but drifters who died on the "road" were usually buried in unmarked graves along the way and it's likely nomadic Native American tribes wouldn't have designated burial grounds either.

I can't quote this article because it won't allow to copy the except but it should take you to that part on the link. http://books.google.com/books?id=Eo... detect decomp for over hundred years&f=false

Also it appears that there is an archeological study regarding the use of HRD dogs in locating ancient burial sites.

The Institute for Canine Forensics has been conducting field studies at historic cemeteries. These field studies have proven to be auspicious as the dogs were able to identify several lost graves in the cemetery Boca Cemetery, Truckee, CA, ICF 2004. Since this field study, the dogs have been utilized at several other historical context burial sites. These types of studies are also encouraging, as they help substantiate the use of human remains detection canines in archaeological studies. These positive results suggest that the areas identified by the HRD dogs at the Alder Creek site may have been in contact with human remains.

http://www.k9forensic.org/human-signature.htm

and more on the Boca Cemetery project/history...

http://www.k9forensic.org/boca.html

The dogs are fascinating to say the least.

I wanted to respond also, in short to Seajay. I could see that they wouldn't want to panic people thinking there may be a predator out there when they didn't know just who the remains belonged to, especially since they were limited to what they could do at the time.