Dr. Phil Interviews Burke Ramsey (9/12 & 9/13 2016)

[Raindancemaggie10]

First of all, I have no idea if he has ASD or not. I will say my only child does have Autism, and IME with her and other children and adults all over the spectrum it would certainly make sense of his affect and answers/reactions to questions both as a child and as an adult.

Also as a palliative care nurse his reaction at 9 to his sisters death is not as unusual as some may think. If he is on the spectrum, his reaction as an adult (reflecting) isn't necessarily surprising either.

He is bright, and likely always has been... But if anything the interview with Dr. P really makes me wonder if he would have been capable of maintaining his story as a youth if it weren't the truth.

I had always felt the Burke did it by accident theory was a good possibility... But after watching the interview I have serious doubts.

 

[asyousay]

So we now have Burke wandering around downstairs when a potential kidnapper is around.

Hell Burke was probably in the room that Jon Benet ended up being murdered in so the question is if we are to believe the Ramsey's why would a kidnapper ignore Burke when he was he was the easier target ?

IMO

 

[dizzychick]

Did anyone question the Ramsey's about calling the cops so fast? If the note was indeed written by the killer it said they would be head JonBenet if they called the cops, so would you call the cops that fast? I would at least tell the 911 operator to send un marked cars in case the killer/s had someone watching my house, this IMO is another BIG red flag

 

[fraudqueen]

Whoever did it, I still believe it was soon after they arrived home...hence the tombstone read date of death as Christmas Day. Also believe PR never went to bed since she had on the same clothes in the morning as the night before, not something I see happening if she got up and got dressed to leave on vacation that day.

 

[dizzychick]

Whoever did it, I still believe it was soon after they arrived home...hence the tombstone read date of death as Christmas Day. Also believe PR never went to bed since she had on the same clothes in the morning as the night before, not something I see happening if she got up and got dressed to leave on vacation that day.

more red flags

 

[dizzychick]

Burke's demeanor is the exact same now as it was when he was 9, even the odd smirk I saw as he left the funeral, so what does that mean ?

 

[madeleine]

there are moments when I can smell his FEAR.he was definitely afraid of some of the questions.and i found his demeanor interesting while he wss watching his own police interview.dunno if he did it but he is defintely hiding something he knows about the murder.imo

 

[PositiveLight]

I think he witnessed it. IMO

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[BoldBear]

Wyle,

So sorry for the losses you experienced as both a child and an adult.

You have an interesting narrative and viewpoint on loss and grief. Burke is different than you, me, everyone else. His situation is different. We can't take our own feelings about what happened to us and then project it onto Burke and say, "this is what he is feeling, what he is experiencing." That's just not valid.

What you're describing is how you feel, what a murder would feel like to you, with your thoughts and memories and impressions, what loss felt like for you as a child.

But that doesn't have anything to do specifically with Burke, who we don't know. As that forensic psychiatrist who was on one of the other shows said (this is not Dr Phil), we have to remove ourselves from the equation, remove our own feelings. This is very difficult to do, but it's imperative to really look at a case.

Please don't disqualify what you understand about the case because you have emotions and can empathize with others. Your experiences help you analyze. It gives you a sense for what doesn't feel 'right'. Only you can bring your lifetime of experiences to what you understand here. And what you shared was helpful to me.

I empathize with Burke, Patsy, John and Jonbenet. That doesn't stop me from trying to understand what happened. My emotional baggage helps me understand the finer details of this case. Had I removed my empathy, there are some things I would have never seen.

 

[BoldBear]

I agree Dogface, I think Burke was coached for many years and probably doesn't have too many authentic thoughts about what happened. I believe he stayed in his room or at least says he stayed in his room because he was told to stay in his room, not because of fear.

Now we're talking. Thank you. I'm glad someone said it!

A black cat calling someone dogface. That's just rude...(just kidding)

 

[PositiveLight]

Just a question
Did They ever say what BR was doing the whole time he was in his room? Was he only pretending to sleep or did he play his games?
Curious

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[BoldBear]

I haven't seen Burke point to IDI yet. It's been only a few short minutes for the first 2 episodes, but there has been no finger pointing. (Wow, just got the worst case of deja vu like I've written exactly this before...creepy.)

It's also clear why Burke hasn't done any interviews previous to this. The only difference from this and when he was 9 is that he's not curling-up in the chair. As for the smile, like father like son. John doesn't grin as much, but he does grin when answering these types of questions. I thought he was remembering a Disneyland trip when he was saying, "I did not kill my daugher." I also thought John was doing a not so convincing liars smile.

I'd be hard pressed to remember Christmas presents I got when I was 9. I don't think I can. I know those details about that night and morning should be hard to forget, but memory doesn't work that way. Memory changes as we remember things. The very act of remembering changes the memories. If you're old enough, try to remember the small details of what you were doing 20 years ago.

Finally, of course Burke has read the note. He's been online. He's seen enough about the case to make him sick and he's probably read some of the BDI threads. It goes against logic to think he's completely naive about this case and what's been said about him. What if he said he read the note to Dr Phil? Then he would have had to answer questions about the note, it's contents and what it meant. Had he said he'd been online, then he would have had to address fine details about the case. It's best for him to focus on what he remembers about that night and claim he doesn't know anything else. And I'm not saying this to point the finger at him. I'm saying that because it makes sense. He'd have to live his life completely in a vacuum in order to claim that he's never been curious and didn't want to know.

To paraphrase a West Wing episode:

"I never read anything in the tabloids about myself."
"Then you don't know what they said?"
"Well, let me say It's would be better if I never read them. I read everything about myself."

While I don't think he reads everything about himself, I'm sure he's read enough. That's kind of sad.

 

[PositiveLight]

Agreed BoldBear! DP acted kind of shocked that BR would even say he hadn't read the ransom note. I believe he suggested he'd seen pictures of it. Oh please just say yes you read the dang note!
I just hope DP goes all in and calls him and his daddy out on their bs. Since this is their only interview they will give.

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[Wyle_E_Coyote]

Wyle,

So sorry for the losses you experienced as both a child and an adult.

You have an interesting narrative and viewpoint on loss and grief. Burke is different than you, me, everyone else. His situation is different. We can't take our own feelings about what happened to us and then project it onto Burke and say, "this is what he is feeling, what he is experiencing." That's just not valid.

What you're describing is how you feel, what a murder would feel like to you, with your thoughts and memories and impressions, what loss felt like for you as a child.

But that doesn't have anything to do specifically with Burke, who we don't know. As that forensic psychiatrist who was on one of the other shows said (this is not Dr Phil), we have to remove ourselves from the equation, remove our own feelings. This is very difficult to do, but it's imperative to really look at a case.

Thank you.

I certainly agree with you....

My point was, simply, that there are a lot of people who expect a child to behave as an adult would in that situation. They don't. Children don't think abstractly at that age, and there is nothing more abstract than death.

Sudden, violent death is traumatic. And trauma has a consistent impact on a person (increase in cortisol, for example). People who haven't experienced it themselves discount the impact of trauma.

My post was a long winded attempt to make those two points.


http://www.suddendeath.org/help-for...-guidance/2-uncategorised/75-challenginggrief

http://www.survivorresources.org/grief-knowledge/articles-survivors/sudden-traumatic-death/

http://www.carolkearns.com/columns/col_ptsd-bereaved.html



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[asyousay]

I am wondering if we may finally get to the truth as I still think Burke hit her as from the little I have read John and Patsy didn't seem to get on and the marriage was a front. So why if one of them killed her did they cover for each other when they clearly was in such a unhappy marriage.

Also Patsy was deeply religious from the stuff I have read so her covering for Burke would make the most sense as she would of believed that she was doing the right thing and it was saving her family. IMO

 

[andreww]

Thank you.

I certainly agree with you....

My point was, simply, that there are a lot of people who expect a child to behave as an adult would in that situation. They don't. Children don't think abstractly at that age, and there is nothing more abstract than death.

Sudden, violent death is traumatic. And trauma has a consistent impact on a person (increase in cortisol, for example). People who haven't experienced it themselves discount the impact of trauma.

My post was a long winded attempt to make those two points.


http://www.suddendeath.org/help-for...-guidance/2-uncategorised/75-challenginggrief

http://www.survivorresources.org/grief-knowledge/articles-survivors/sudden-traumatic-death/

http://www.carolkearns.com/columns/col_ptsd-bereaved.html



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I agree with what you are saying, but in this case the three people that were in that house are all acting extremely odd. It's not just Burke. We have John and Patsy saying that doesn't appear to be their flashlight, yet now we have Burke admitting that both he and John used it that night. If nothing else that is concrete evidence that the Ramseys were not being honest or cooperative right from the beginning. Ask yourself why???


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[andreww]

I am wondering if we may finally get to the truth as I still think Burke hit her as from the little I have read John and Patsy didn't seem to get on and the marriage was a front. So why if one of them killed her did they cover for each other when they clearly was in such a unhappy marriage.

Also Patsy was deeply religious from the stuff I have read so her covering for Burke would make the most sense as she would of believed that she was doing the right thing and it was saving her family. IMO

I wouldn't be so sure that the Ramseys are as religious as they seem. From what I have read, their involvement with the church in Boulder had more to do with social networking than anything else. Patsy seemed to use religion to justify her actions and present the image of someone not likely to be a killer.


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[necnaw]

I have been pleasantly surprised with the Dr Phil shows so far. It seems fairly balanced over all and I am not getting the impression that DP is treading lightly around BR or that he is biased and automatically believes him innocent. I was expecting it to be much more like the A&E show, so that is good. Although I find American TV very frustrating over all, so many ads and going back and forth.. stringing things out and repeating things.

I found the clips of the psychologist interview with 9 year old Burke very interesting. Having read previous transcripts or summaries of that interview, I always found it odd that Burke said he likes his mother because "she gives me lots of hugs and kisses".. but actually seeing it for myself I can now see that the psychologist is the one who said those words and Burke just agreed. However watching him 'act out' the murder was very disturbing.

He doesn't come across as very sure in a lot of his answers but it's hard to tell whether that is because he is genuinely unsure, lying, or it's the awkwardness.

 

[nona's mum]

I've just watched part 2. Does anyone else think Burke's demeanour and body language change depending on the nature of the question? I feel like the more general questions - what was your mum like, what did you get for Christmas - he's grinning like a Cheshire Cat. The ones directed at 26th December and Burke's involvement - did you hit your sister, were you present for the 911 call - the smile goes and his lack of eye contact gets worse.

 

[dizzychick]

I can see BR not remembering his gifts correctly.
Nothing good has came out of this interview for him. Only makes him look worse.

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Oh I suspect he got some serious moola for this. Since George and Cindy Anthony got 600K which was made public his publicist got him at least that much if not twice as much or more. Software developers are a dime a dozen these days so the all mighty dollar had something to do with this no doubt