IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #9

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Jodi, I wondered about Mr. C's sighting too.
What if he confused that day with another day?
Not saying he did, just what if?

The reason I think he didn't have the days confused is because he said that investigators came to his house that same evening. He certainly wouldn't have forgotten what had just happened that same afternoon. Maybe he confused who he saw but I don't think he would have confused the day.
 
JPirro Show

JT Hart:

-family friction going on-even still
-L's mom: was living upstairs
-Maternal GMa believes girls abducted because Dan narc'ed
-dogs let everyone know girls were more toward the woody area

Grandma and Tammy on Phone

BBM

Wonder what's up with that? Wish she'd asked the family abou it. Lots of interesting info in a very short amount of time.
 
Thats what i heard. Wonder how old the girls were? Didn't someone say she never went to the lake unless with an adult?


Hard to say what she meant..she definitely said she went there with the girls across the street and knew the lake...maybe there was an adult with them at the time.

Tammy seemed to contradict gma who, when asked if they had ridden to the lake, said "Never". But, maybe they didn't go by bike and that's what she meant. MOO
 
I didn't hear Aunt T say Lizzie rode there, though.

I heard her say Lizzy knew the lake and that she had been there before.

I thought she said she had gone with the three neighbor girls before.
 
gma denies saying that Dan might have people who would retaliate..."I did not say that". MOO

I heard GMa tell Pirro, "I did not say that!" re a question Pirro asked about Dan.

What exactly did Pirro ask her? I believe Tammy interrupted after GMa said that.
 
Maybe the family didn't know Elizabeth had been to the lake until recently. The girls (3?) she went with may have shared the info. ?????????????
 
I heard GMa tell Pirro, "I did not say that!" re a question Pirro asked about Dan.

What exactly did Pirro ask her? I believe Tammy interrupted after GMa said that.


The connection was so bad it was hard to understand, but that's the way I heard it also. The question was regarding Dan 'narking'.
 
This may explain Aunt Tammy's gut feeling about the lake.

I was going to say the same thing. And I think that MAYBE Auntie knew the girls sometimes rode with the neighbor girls, but didn't tell Grandma about it. JMO
 
To answer your question, I would guess a girl on a bike could get from Lake and Arbutus to the spot where the bikes were found in under 30 seconds easily if they traversed the grassy area. It is slightly downhill, not too rough, would be a quick ride. I bet I could make it on foot in 10 seconds. However, whenever I'm there with my kids, they like to take Arbutus all the way to where the trail crosses, and race down and around the curve back to the wooded area. On here bike, fast as she could go, my daughter could likely make that trip in a minute. It's the equivalent of riding almost around a block.

BBM -

Thank you, Ollipop! That is exactly what I have wanted to know. Now I need to go back and look at your photos again. Thank you so much for taking the time to help all of us and for helping the girls.
 
I think it could have happened very simply. The girls at around 12:15:
"Let's ride to the lake and back fast before we have to go home!"
They are riding fast in the video. They got to the lake and were going to ride around it and out fast.
At the point where the bikes were found, someone got them to drop their bikes and come with him, either by calling urgently to them "Come and help me find my dog, kitty, baby, whatever" or threatening with a weapon. They dropped their bikes and went into the woods with him and he quickly subdued them, either with a knife to the throat of one, or hit them, knocked them out, whatever it was, it was quick and possibly violent. TG rides by, they are back in the undergrowth being kept quiet. Perp then takes them to a waiting vehicle and is gone. All in a minute or two.

The noise from the adjacent highway has been mentioned here several times, it would mask any noise made by movement in the undergrowth and also any outcries from the girls.
It happens, so fast no one notices. It even happens in places not hidden nearly as well as this pathway is at that point.

I think this person was there and saw them coming from across the lake. That gave him just enough time to get into place if he needed to move a little or get a knife out, whatever.

I do not believe it could have been planned as no one knew they would be there.

I believe this was a crime of opportunity. He had the opportunity and he took it. It happens.

...the only thing that I can't fit into this scenario is the purse being on the other side of the fence, set down neatly as if dropped over the fence and not thrown.

Where is the closest place that a vehicle could park to the spot where the bikes were found?
I've looked at the maps and can't tell. TIA MOO JMO
 
The connection was so bad it was hard to understand, but that's the way I heard it also. The question was regarding Dan 'narking'.

Here is what it seemed like to me:

Judge J said something like : " didn't you say that you thought Dan's history with meth might have been a factor in this situation?"

NO, I NEVER said that...[ quite forcefully answered...]
 
I was going to say the same thing. And I think that MAYBE Auntie knew the girls sometimes rode with the neighbor girls, but didn't tell Grandma about it. JMO

If that is the case, why has it been stated otherwise for the past two weeks?

I really do not know what to believe at this point.
 
I don't have a tv, so sorry if I asked something that any dummy should know at times. Did she actually say that Lizzy rode bike to the lake with the other girls, or just that she rode there with them? It is possible that she rode there in a car with the girls and their parents, isn't it?
 
gma denies saying that Dan might have people who would retaliate..."I did not say that". MOO

As many have mentioned, grandma's connection was terrible so it was hard to hear her. However, I heard her say the same thing about her narc'ing - she denies ever saying that.
 
Here is what it seemed like to me:

Judge J said something like : " didn't you say that you thought Dan's history with meth might have been a factor in this situation?"

NO, I NEVER said that...[ quite forcefully answered...]

I heard her say, "I did not say that" forcefully.
 
This is interesting about the new info with girls in the neighborhood and these two had been places with them before. I was saying the other day on here when we rode bikes on paths in the woods, we met up with other kids. They had a place over the water and it was dangerous. Our parents wouldn't have let us go there and we didn't tell.

Now I wonder where had these girls been before with them. They traveled as far as the lake with them, where else? Was anyone watching girls in the neighborhood? I imagine these neighborhood girls were spoken to and do they know anyone else that could have had contact with the girls or any homes they might have visited. SO's would be so interested in a place where alot of girls lived and riding bikes alone, away from their homes. It could be people familiar with Lyric's parents, but now that we know about these girls, it opens up more possibilities.
 
Seems it was Elizabeth that knew the way..and she was in the lead on the video (although they were going away from the lake at that point in time). MOO
 
Seems too sophisticated an abduction to be boys. Somebody who knows the area very well...and most likely drives. MOO
 
If that is the case, why has it been stated otherwise for the past two weeks?

I really do not know what to believe at this point.

Well, Auntie T. knew exactly where to go look for the girls, immediately. And Aunt T. has an 11 yr old daughter herself. And she said the 3 girls across the street from Elizabeth's house often rode to that lake.

So I have to believe that Auntie T. had an inkling that the girls might have been there or been tempted to go there.

Grandma believes that the girls never went more than a block or two away, but I really think that is wishful thinking on her part.
 
OK OK...in one post, in response to some at the end of the last thread:

Today I saw a police cruisers drive by my house...twice. It was exciting, because it is rare. They never stopped, though. And its not rare because two little girls are missing from the area, its rare all the time. Evansdale PD generally keeps to the main roads, which around my house are Gilbert, Evans, and River Forest. They do not come up my street often, and I usually take note when they do. I'm curious like that. Or nosy. To see it twice in a day got me thinkin, "are they watching someone on my street? could it be me?" I'm innocent, btw.

As for the "family of meth-heads" invoking their faith. I think it was addressed about people in recovery finding the lord. I also think that we've seen it less as time has gone on, and I remember stating early on that I thought that MCM and DM were, in some way, trying to emulate Drew and Heather. Like when my older sister and I were interviewed by the local paper years and years ago, and I was shocked to hear my sis act so mature and to be so articulate. I made a point of standing taller, speaking clearer, trying to sound more "knowledgeable." I honestly don't even remember why they were interviewing us.

As to Sapphire's post, concerning starting a file, gossip and hearsay being passed on as fact, people missing posts or asking the same question that was just answered, etc. I couldn't agree more. It is frustrating. But that's likely because I've read every post in every thread on this case. It has been incredibly time-consuming to keep up, and I realize I have the luxury of time to do so. I realize not everyone has that. I apologize if that frustration has caused me to come across as short or accusatory.

And on the topic of the RSO's in the area: I think Evansdale has 9 or 10, and our population is about 5000. However, we are separated from Waterloo (pop. 68k) by a line on a map, and Waterloo is separated from Cedar Falls (pop. 40k) by a line on a map. We are all really one big community. When I say "in town", I'm generally referring to the metropolitan area (funny to say that about an Iowa town tho, lol), which is said to hold about 160k ppl according to this page on Waterloo – Cedar Falls metropolitan area - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. In the Waterloo-Cedar Falls area - which includes lil ol' E'dale - there are over 200 RSO's.


One final note on Ted Gamerdinger. His spotting of the bikes has caused so much confusion and speculation, yet he's only mentioned cursorily by LE. (I agree that Breault of the FBI, when referring to the guy who "runs the lake," likely meant to say "rides the lake." I don't know, but it seems to make sense to me and to be an easy mis-speak.) I just barely remember seeing on FB when his daughter had said that her dad had mentioned spotting bikes. Then he came on further down in the comments and confirmed. That seemed so long ago, and I believe the only mention was in a few MSM reports that paraphrased the time to "about 12:20." I cannot, anywhere, find where we got the time of "12:27," so I'm assuming that was on FB. I do remember reading somewhere that he'd made a pretty precise guess of how long it took him to ride to the gas station from that spot.

Is it possible that our ointment fly Ted meant that he'd seen the bikes at 12:27, based on his own estimation? As in, maybe his phone call was at 12:33, and he estimated the sighting at 12:27? Again, we've determined that not every clock or cell phone is in sync. Is it possible that the guy at the auction house's cell is slightly different than is TG's? Or that he misstated what he meant? I know I've often called a clock "slow" when I actually meant the opposite, and vice versa.
 
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