John Ramsey felt empathy for Karr !!!!

[4sure]

BUT, the fact that they subjected her to constant rehearsing and pageants and hair dying and make up, etc. is something that I cannot agree with".

.

This is why Solace. It's statements like the one above that are completely dumbfounding. I think your use of the word constant is very misleading. It would seem to matter little if you agree with it or not. If her hair was dyed or lightend for the pageants to match costumes and such I have way less of a problem with it then if she was dying her hair just to go to school or for no reason.

 

[Nehemiah]

What key?
I dont see how people still think he was in any way involved.
Nehemiah- do you think he was part of a ped. ring?

No, I don't think he was a part of a pedophile "ring", at least not anything "organized". Not that he had a key in the literal sense, but perhaps he knows someone who was involved. I think some of his knowledge and actions are suspect, and if the DNA evidence doesn't exonerate the Rs, then it should not exonerate him either. I'm hoping that there's more to him and this case.

 

[LinasK]

Do you remember, or did we ever find out what things he put in the emails that could have panned out? The second thing is pretty general, unless he specificly named children by name.


Scandi

He did, one little girl whose name was supposed to be blacked out, but I read in one of the disgusting e-mails was named Christine. Another might be a Megan.

 

[LinasK]

If John was the one sexually abusing JonBenet, then he knows what it's like to be a child sex offender, and he could empathize with Karr.

Or, John Ramsey feels empathy for Karr because he knows he didn't do it.

Parents of murdered children, just don't get over it. They mourn and re-live the tragedy the rest of their lives.

Instead of focusing so much on Karr, Erin should have asked John why he was reading that detective's book about "staged murder scenes" right before JonBenet was murdered.

Excellent points! It's what I myself would have said had I been here at the beginning of the thread!!!:clap:

 

[LinasK]

This is why Solace. It's statements like the one above that are completely dumbfounding. I think your use of the word constant is very misleading. It would seem to matter little if you agree with it or not. If her hair was dyed or lightend for the pageants to match costumes and such I have way less of a problem with it then if she was dying her hair just to go to school or for no reason.

Her hair was not highlighted, it was a complete and total dye job. JB was a brunette. Regardless of for pageant or for school, do you think this is acceptable to expose a 4-year-old to those kinds of chemicals???:doh:

 

[4sure]

Her hair was not highlighted, it was a complete and total dye job. JB was a brunette. Regardless of for pageant or for school, do you think this is acceptable to expose a 4-year-old to those kinds of chemicals???:doh:

Don't think she was a burnette or had any thing close to brown hair. See when you start a post with a complete exsageration I lose interest in the point your trying to make.

 

[LinasK]

Don't think she was a burnette or had any thing close to brown hair. See when you start a post with a complete exsageration I lose interest in the point your trying to make.

Ummm, yes she was a natural brunette. There are pictures of her at age 4 with completely brown hair, I've seen them!

 

[coloradokares]

Don't think she was a burnette or had any thing close to brown hair. See when you start a post with a complete exsageration I lose interest in the point your trying to make.

She was a veryvery dark light brown not even dirty blond. That is according to pictures of her before the hair started going blond in that Michigan sun. Film can be deceiving but not that deceiving and that is pictures in DOI as well as others taken through the years.

 

[LinasK]

She was a veryvery dark light brown not even dirty blond. That is according to pictures of her before the hair started going blond in that Michigan sun. Film can be deceiving but not that deceiving and that is pictures in DOI as well as others taken through the years.

I'm sorry, her hair did not become uniformly almost platinum (not sure of the color name) blonde on it's own. JB's hair was clearly dyed, and I think it's even been admitted to...

 

[4sure]

Ummm, yes she was a natural brunette. There are pictures of her at age 4 with completely brown hair, I've seen them!

First pictures of what is known as dirty blonde can vary greatly depending on lighting, camera, film and developing type. Also Ive seen the sun lighten my daughters hair in the summer. Also I have noticed depending on how its cut and also the type of shampoo used the color can look very much lighter or darker.
Second it is possible for hair to change by shades as one ages.
We all know this. Really, again do you have so little evidence to use that you have to invent your own.

 

[Kortnie]

Of course JB's hair was dyed blonde.

Karr had nothing to do with JB's murder. The parents did it. Karr's a delusional nutcase.

The Ramsey murder is obviously a staged domestic homicide. The R's wrote the "ransom note," obviously.

I agree that the recent "48 Hours" was a total joke, and I congratulate Dave on writing his letter to Moriarty.

Yeah, that JR could "sympathize" with someone who could be his daughter's killer is unbelievable. It shows that he knew, of course, that Karr had nothing to do with it.

I think Burke might crack before 40.

 

[Credence]

I'm still a fence sitter and I usually lurk more than post so I've been going through the posts and see a couple of them talk about extensive bleeding in her head but the autopsy report says 7-8 cc which is less than two teaspoons. Can someone tell me why they think the bleeding was extensive? The 7-8cc is what led me to believe she had started to be strangled, then hit on the head and finished off by tightening the cord around her neck. I don't think she could have fought back because she was tied up and there was duct tape on her legs so maybe she was even taped to a chair.

Also I don't think John sympathized with Karr because of his behavior but understood how he was hounded by the media so much and that is why he related in that sense and also the rush to judgement.

 

[Credence]

I disagree, 4sure.

It doesn't take someone well-known to a child to surmise she didn't enjoy wetting herself on a regular basis or to gather that she wasn't keen on baring her tush for a doctor - or even being in a situation where her physical condition required such examination. Common sense tells you she wasn't wetting herself or having recurring vaginal irritation because she enjoyed cruising about in urine-soaked clothing or submitting to a vaginal exam five or six times in three years.

And it isn't bending the evidence to state that the head wound showed marked development and there was no indication of a struggle. Go ahead and prove me wrong.

But she never had a vaginal exam. Here are her doctor visits. I saw this on another forum:

[font=verdana, arial, helvetica] 1990
8-06: JonBenet Ramsey born at Northside Hospital in Atlanta, Georgia

1991
12-06: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf for fever, cough and wheezing

1992
?

1993
1-?: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf for ear infection

8-31: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf

9-?: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf (diarrhea)

11-?: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf for cough and stuffy nose
1994

1-?: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf for bad breath, cough, congestion

?: JonBenet Ramsey hit on cheek with golf club by brother Burke

2-?: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf, suggested by Nedra Paugh

4-?: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf for pain during urination (advised no bubble baths for JonBenet Ramsey)

5-18: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf for allergic rhinitis, earache
10-5: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf for routine physical (notes bedwetting)

10-5: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf for scar left by golf club

10-?: JonBenet Ramsey to plastic surgeon in Denver for scar

11-01: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf for diarrhea and lethargy

1995
1-01: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf for chickenpox

2-01: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf for cough and temperature

2-01: JonBenet Ramsey seen by Dr. Beuf for abdominal pain and fever

4-?: JonBenet Ramsey had cough but refused examination

5-08: JonBenet Ramsey to Dr. Beuf for fall on nose at Alfalfa Food Mart

12-?: JonBenet Ramsey to Dr. Beuf for fall hitting head above left eye

1996
3-?: JonBenet Ramsey to Dr. Beuf for coughing

6-?: JonBenet Ramsey to Dr. Beuf for fall bending fingernail on left hand

8-27: JonBenet and Burke Ramsey routine physicals with Dr. Beuf

9-?: JonBenet Ramsey to Dr. Beuf for coughing

10-?: JonBenet Ramsey to Dr. Beuf for stuffy nose and bad breath

11-12: JonBenet Ramsey to Dr. Beuf for sinus infection

2-03: JonBenet Ramsey to Dr. Marilyn Dougherty for eyesight check

12-17: Patsy Ramsey called Dr. Beuf three times (reason unknown)

http://www.angelfire.com/ar3/jonbenet/page11.html
[/font]

 

[Nuisanceposter]

Dr. Beuf told Diane Sawyer he gave JonBenet five or six vaginal exams in three years.


http://thewebsafe.tripod.com/09101997bynumabcprimetime.htm

DIANE SAWYER: (voice-over) So many he said, there was some concern about asthma.

(From taped telephone conversation) How many times did you give her a vaginal examination?

Dr. FRANCESCO BEUF: Well, it was five or six times in that three-year period.

 

[4sure]

Dr. Beuf told Diane Sawyer he gave JonBenet five or six vaginal exams in three years.


http://thewebsafe.tripod.com/09101997bynumabcprimetime.htm

DIANE SAWYER: (voice-over) So many he said, there was some concern about asthma.

(From taped telephone conversation) How many times did you give her a vaginal examination?

Dr. FRANCESCO BEUF: Well, it was five or six times in that three-year period.

You left out this.

DIANE SAWYER: Did you see in any of these examinations any sign of possible sexual abuse?

Dr. FRANCESCO BEUF: No, and I certainly would have reported it to the social service people if I had. That's something that all of us in pediatrics are very acutely aware of.
Lucky she had so many exams because we can now be sure JBR was not sexually abused. We have the word of a professional.

Thanks Nuisanceposter

 

[4sure]

I disagree, 4sure.

It doesn't take someone well-known to a child to surmise she didn't enjoy wetting herself on a regular basis or to gather that she wasn't keen on baring her tush for a doctor - or even being in a situation where her physical condition required such examination. Common sense tells you she wasn't wetting herself or having recurring vaginal irritation because she enjoyed cruising about in urine-soaked clothing or submitting to a vaginal exam five or six times in three years.

And it isn't bending the evidence to state that the head wound showed marked development and there was no indication of a struggle. Go ahead and prove me wrong.

People who have cancer don't edure Kemo because they love it either.

 

[Credence]

Dr. Beuf told Diane Sawyer he gave JonBenet five or six vaginal exams in three years.


http://thewebsafe.tripod.com/09101997bynumabcprimetime.htm

DIANE SAWYER: (voice-over) So many he said, there was some concern about asthma.

(From taped telephone conversation) How many times did you give her a vaginal examination?

Dr. FRANCESCO BEUF: Well, it was five or six times in that three-year period.

I'm not sure what you think this is supposed to prove. During routine physical exams a vaginal exam is given (not saying internal) or at least my pediatrician did with my daughter. That would account for three out of the six since he's talking about a three year period.

 

[Eagle1]

......See when you start a post with a complete exsageration I lose interest in the point your trying to make.

I don't know about exaggerations of the facts of the case, but isn't it a violation of TOS if we snap at someone like Capps, on the first page of this thread I think. I don't know if there's still time to edit and maybe PM him or her. They were just being nice. Nothing could be wrong with that. I too was turned off and only skimmed to here.

 

[BBB167893]

I'm still a fence sitter and I usually lurk more than post so I've been going through the posts and see a couple of them talk about extensive bleeding in her head but the autopsy report says 7-8 cc which is less than two teaspoons. Can someone tell me why they think the bleeding was extensive?

Yeah, I can. Read the autopsy: three areas of bleeding, including a scalp hemorrhage described as extensive.

"I don't think she could have fought back because she was tied up"

Please. The way she was tied wouldn't restraint a two-month-old.

Lucky she had so many exams because we can now be sure JBR was not sexually abused. We have the word of a professional.

Sure, a professional who hadn't seen her in months.

 

[capps]

Originally Posted By Solace:

"Just once, I would like to hear a Ramsey supporter be honest and say "I don't believe Patsy and John killed their daughter, BUT, the fact that they subjected her to constant rehearsing and pageants and hair dying and make up, etc. is something that I cannot agree with".
I have yet to hear that."

Solace,

That's not true. If you look through past threads and posts,you will see many IDI's claim,(me included),that they did not agree with everything the Ramsey's did.

Although I tend to think the Ramsey's didn't do it,there are some things that are puzzling,and I'll admit it. But it's hard to discuss things,when post after post is mocking,"the IDI's should get a brain" and "IDI 101"... and so forth.So I tend to just lurk and put my two cents in, here and there.

Eagle1,

I'm right here ... don't worry about me,I just ignore posters that are rude.