MO - Elizabeth Olten, 9, St Martin's, 21 Oct 2009 #12

[Prof]

I have been following this thread for awhile and not to judge KB, but where was she when 14yo MB was running around with an 18 yo CB thus becoming pregnant and giving birth to Alyssa at 15? What mother allows a 14 yo girl to "date" an 18 yo man? In my opinion, it would appear she doesn't have the best track record as far as monitoring her own children.

Is there any public documentation that states what exactly the state considered near daily therapy for Alyssa? While I do think Alyssa should be held accountable for her actions; in my opinion the system, her parents and KB failed her.

There has been some speculation as to 2007 being the "breaking point" for Alyssa as that is when she attempted suicide. According to Casenet, 2007 was indeed a bad year for the family/Alyssa

CB plead guilty and was sentenced for assault
MB had numerous court appearances for traffic violations and evictions
KB petitioned and became guardian of EA
KNP (under 21 at the time) had issues of her own with possession of alcohol and intoxication.

In my opinion, the person who would be the most "mentally fragile" in this family situation is KNP. It would seem that at a young age, all of the attention would have been directed towards MB and her children, thus growing up with a lot of resentment towards MB and her children.

- when she was 6, her 15 yo sister had a baby, and then 4 years later gave birth to twins.
- at 13/14 her mother became legal guardian to her sister's 3 children.
- Approximately one year later, her sister gives birth to another child
- at 16/17 she was moved to MO, transferred to a new high school and her mother again petitioned to be the guardian of 3 of her sister's children.
- 2 years later, her mother is now the legal guardian of all 4 of MB's children.
- At some point in the midst of this, her parents divorced and her mother remarried.

Frankly, I think the whole family needs intense therapy (especially her brothers and sister). Any hosility/animosity anyone felt towards the other must have increased immensely after Alyssa confessed and was taken into custody.

Exactly-- thanks for putting all of this together this way -- great first post!

The aunt has posted on a public profile about her own mental state, so IMO at least she is self-aware

IMO The aunt does have a relationship with her bio father -- visits him/goes on vacation with him -

I think the gm's petition for custody of the half sister in 2007 may have had a large effect on both AB and KNP

[deleted question as I read the post wrong and am going for more coffee]

Anyway, I have lots of questions about all of the adults in this case

Welcome!!!

 

[gliving]

Welcome 2shihtzus!

Great entry post. You ask a lot of questions that we've questioned also.

As to an 18 yo CB dating a 14 yo MB, you have to wonder. I know I wouldn't allow it for my daughter. Still, to give KB the benefit of the doubt, it could have been as simple as a church outing to a park. When kids want to 'get together' they find a way and it only takes a few minutes. But that doesn't bode well for KB as she apparently didn't know what was going on in her daughter's life, or for MB having unprotected sex at 14.

Do we have the marriage record for CB and MB? It would be interesting to see the dates. I've wondered if KB has other children besides MB and KNP. There's a good ten years age difference in their ages so I assume there are other siblings to throw into the mix.

 

[KBL100]

Does anyone know how old KB is? How old was she when she had MB?

 

[Prof]

Does anyone know how old KB is? How old was she when she had MB?

I believe she is in her 50s, so she must have been 20 at least?

 

[gliving]

KB is 52 according to veromi.net. MB is 30-31, so KB was about 21?

We don't know if MB was her first child though.


Edit: Marriage records show KB was married in TX to another man before she married KNP's father. He will remain unnamed as he's not part of this.

 

[Elley Mae]

Does anyone know how old KB is? How old was she when she had MB?

I don't know the years of birth, but Alyssa being 15-16 anf her mother being 15 when she had her would make her roughly 30, and I thought that KB was 52 I could be wrong, Is MB the oldest child?

 

[Prof]

I believe her first marriage was well over 30 years ago (I think she's on her third marriage)-- MB and KNB have different fathers, I think -- I have not seen any evidence of any additional children, but it is possible

 

[KBL100]

I'm also wondering if KB was married at the time MB was "dating" CB and became pregnant with AB. Was there a father figure in the home or was KB a single mother at the time?

 

[AndresEscobar]

snipped from article

Police in Jefferson City, Missouri, say she dug two graves five days before the murder then told them: “If you want to find her, start digging.”

I wonder where they got that info? I wonder if there is any truth to that statement?

Since we haven't seen it before and it popped up in a random UK newspaper, I'm going to say it doesn't pass the smell test.

 

[JLMcKenna83]

Since we haven't seen it before and it popped up in a random UK newspaper, I'm going to say it doesn't pass the smell test.

And considering this is the sub line.. I would absolutely never have any faith in this paper.

A GIRL of 15 could end up on Death Row facing execution by lethal injection after a US judge ruled she must be tried for murder as an adult. http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/143023/Girl-15-could-be-executed-for-murder

ETA: We know that there is no possibility of her ending up on death row.. And I have half a mind to fire off a letter about their crappy reporting.

 

[AndresEscobar]

And considering this is the sub line.. I would absolutely never have any faith in this paper.



ETA: We know that there is no possibility of her ending up on death row.. And I have half a mind to fire off a letter about their crappy reporting.

The UK has many tabloid-type newspapers with very low journalistic standards. They rarely let facts get in the way of their story. Most have "Page 3" girls, which are pictures of topless/naked women on the third page. I'm guessing this is one of those newspapers.

 

[Csquare]

And considering this is the sub line.. I would absolutely never have any faith in this paper.



ETA: We know that there is no possibility of her ending up on death row.. And I have half a mind to fire off a letter about their crappy reporting.

sounds like irresponsible reporting to me

 

[JLMcKenna83]

The UK has many tabloid-type newspapers with very low journalistic standards. They rarely let facts get in the way of their story. Most have "Page 3" girls, which are pictures of topless/naked women on the third page. I'm guessing this is one of those newspapers.

Absolutely disgusting. :sick:

 

[Csquare]

:truce:

The UK has many tabloid-type newspapers with very low journalistic standards. They rarely let facts get in the way of their story. Most have "Page 3" girls, which are pictures of topless/naked women on the third page. I'm guessing this is one of those newspapers.

 

[2shihtzus]

I'm also wondering if KB was married at the time MB was "dating" CB and became pregnant with AB. Was there a father figure in the home or was KB a single mother at the time?

From what I was able to find in California public record, KB and GB were married at least 2 years before Alyssa was born.

 

[akashana]

I've been thinking about the age difference (15 - 18) of Alyssa's parents. That's the difference between a senior and a sophomore in high school. I dated seniors as a sophomore, and would have allowed my daughter to do so also, but she was dating a classmate during those years. Kids in HS date within that age range all the time. It's really not that huge a gap IMHO.

 

[Prof]

Yes, 2Shihtzus and KLB100

I believe the GM was not a single parent when MB got pregnant with AB, but which might be more of an issue -- being raised by a single parent, or having three different "dads" by the time you are 14? IDK

 

[Prof]

I've been thinking about the age difference (15 - 18) of Alyssa's parents. That's the difference between a senior and a sophomore in high school. I dated seniors as a sophomore, and would have allowed my daughter to do so also, but she was dating a classmate during those years. Kids in HS date within that age range all the time. It's really not that huge a gap IMHO.

Perhaps, but I believe the ages were 14 and 18, (there's a four year difference in age, and AB was born when MB was 15) and I believe 18 is legal, where 14 is not -- in the states I know anyway

I was not allowed to date at all that age lol

 

[Elley Mae]

I agree 14 year olds should not be dating 18 year olds, Number one what 18 year old wants to date a 14 year old, other then sex. at those ages it is too much of a difference, now if he were 28 and was dating a 24 year old female that is different

 

[PAXIMUS]

I agree 14 year olds should not be dating 18 year olds, Number one what 18 year old wants to date a 14 year old, other then sex. at those ages it is too much of a difference, now if he were 28 and was dating a 24 year old female that is different

Needs to be decided on a case by case basis, I dont think it is fair or prudent to suggest it is always about sex, I am sure there many cases where it wasnt, my mother was 14 and my father was 18 when they met and they are still together 55 years later.

Also, females mature faster than males do so mentally, bio-physiologically a 14 year old female and an 18 year old male are a lot closer than you may at first assume.

That is not to say that I would let my daughter date an 18 year old if she were 14 but I would be willing to meet the boy and see what the situation is before I would draw any conclusions.

Case by case.