Random Thoughts and Discussion Ideas#6 About the Case

[kageykaren]

I just do not understand why defense is so desperate to keep the video from the public, there is no audio, I doubt the quality is particularly brilliant, what then are they trying to keep us from seeing?

Possibly KC alter ego, showing the callous, selfish, out of controll, evil she possess on her inside. We have only been privy to one episode showing KC frustration and threats of walking off if confronted with questions and that was towards her parents via the jailhouse tapes and it appeared she used much restraint at that time. KC has appeared to keep her emotions in check at some of the most difficult times, ex: LE interviews. I don't think a young manipulating, thief, liar,con artist escalating into possible murder would be able to keep her chit together this long. Even a long term sociopath will display some form of emotion or at least try and mimick an emotion. Those days KC stated while incarcerated the first arrest, "I have to keep it together in order to talk with LE" (something like that to Christina) are way behind her when Caylee's body was found. It was stated by the guard that she was listening to the radio and stated she wanted to watch the tele concerning what she was listening to on radio. I beleive her mixed up on purpose statement while at home july 16 to TL,"If they never find her guess who has to spend eternity in jail", came back to haunt her. "They found the body and now guess who gets to spend an eternity in jail." This is what she meant early on and so long as searchers were looking elesware KC was in the clear. I think the discovery brought her to buckling with fear for the future of self. Two things I'm happy about is that KC was incarcerated at the time Caylee was found. Can you imagine if she was home on house arrest with her parents? Also who would have been KC's babysitter the evenning her parents were in LA and found out about Caylee. That is scary in its self. Maybe Mother Nature does have a handle on how this case will play out, because so many other things concerning this case could have gone haywire that haven't. Like others have said, maybe the simplest answer to the crime of where who and how have already been uncovered by detectives. Maybe mother nature in her fury of loosing a beautiful blossom of a girl made those storms come to protect what evidence was there when she was found. I just have to believe stronger forces have been at work to conquer over evil. I'll come down off my pulpit, again. Second thing I'm grateful for is how cell phones, pings,texting,GPS, towers, computers, emails, instant messages just may have locked this criminal up. If I'm correct this was the first reported murder by fillicide case where cell activity was followed so strenuously. <3

 

[Mystic]

I've been thinking that her friends have shown a great deal of restraint. If Casey was my friend, could I keep my mouth shut or would I want the 25,000 fish from The Enquirer?

I will never, as long as I live, ever understand why Casey didn't say she hadn't seen Caylee since "yesterday" or "last week". Why admit to the 31 days? Why admit to that, and nothing else?

I was standing outside at work yesterday, smoking a cigarette, looking into the woods, and I couldn't get this girl off my mind. I kept thinking how exactly does one put a baby in a bag and throw it in the woods? I'm a big woods person, I will spend hours walking through forests. And now, I'm terrified that I'll "stumble" upon something. It's really ruined it for me.

Excellent question, really stumped me when I read it. Why not lie about the last time she saw Caylee... up to this point we definately know she doesn't let the truth stand in the way of her story. Although they would still find her real whereabouts for the previous 31 days and nothing of Caylee. Makes me wonder if we look at it from the angle of this question could we possibly discover any information or clues we may have missed?

 

[Gaia713]

Now tjhat Baez has a signed waiver from G&C regarding confiden tiality with DCasey, I am mor epositive than ever that Baez is going to throw G&C under the bus to save Casey.

 

[Marina2]

I've been thinking that her friends have shown a great deal of restraint. If Casey was my friend, could I keep my mouth shut or would I want the 25,000 fish from The Enquirer?

I will never, as long as I live, ever understand why Casey didn't say she hadn't seen Caylee since "yesterday" or "last week". Why admit to the 31 days? Why admit to that, and nothing else?

I was standing outside at work yesterday, smoking a cigarette, looking into the woods, and I couldn't get this girl off my mind. I kept thinking how exactly does one put a baby in a bag and throw it in the woods? I'm a big woods person, I will spend hours walking through forests. And now, I'm terrified that I'll "stumble" upon something. It's really ruined it for me.

I think she gave the truth about 31 days because she knew her baby's body lie just down the street from her house. She didn't know if Caylee would be found immediately or ever. If she was found right away she would be in an advanced state of decomposition and that wouldn't coincide with a kidnapping having just happened yesterday or last week.

 

[2goldfish]

I think she gave the truth about 31 days because she knew her baby's body lie just down the street from her house. She didn't know if Caylee would be found immediately or ever. If she was found right away she would be in an advanced state of decomposition and that wouldn't coincide with a kidnapping having just happened yesterday or last week.

while that's true, she also had no qualms walking LE all the way to the end of the hall at Universal before admitting that was a lie - so she wasn't exactly afraid of getting caught in a lie.

 

[doogiesgirl]

Here's my random thoughts.

Much speculation has been made regarding how it seems like KC has a secret she is holding over her parents head...and I've always had this nagging thought that GA & CA were KC's intended murder victims originally. So...

Whatif...CA was plotting to find GA dead from a tragic "household acceident" and KC had knowledge of her mother's plans. A co-conspirator? Maybe GA was to die vacation week. Thus causing CA's excuse to GA that it wasn't a good time to go away cause of her father. After finding GA dead, CA would go stay with her mother in Winter Park. Didn't KC tell Amy that's where her folks were moving to? Then KC would stay in the house, have Amy move in to keep her company in her time of need. (KC might have pulled a Scott P. by inviting Amy to move in prematurally.)
But CA couldn't bring herself to go through with it. The fight on the 15th...KC demanding to her mother to do it NOW! CA refuses, KC comes up with "plan B" on the spot and turns her murderous attention towards Caylee... This secret could explain alot. That's all I got for now. Too random or plausible?

Well CA's "What have you done!?" would fit with this scenario. Remember those were the first words out of CA's mouth to KC once she found out KC hadn't seen Caylee for 31 days?

http://www.wftv.com/video/17557603/index.html

JMO

 

[doogiesgirl]

Possibly KC alter ego, showing the callous, selfish, out of controll, evil she possess on her inside. We have only been privy to one episode showing KC frustration and threats of walking off if confronted with questions and that was towards her parents via the jailhouse tapes and it appeared she used much restraint at that time. KC has appeared to keep her emotions in check at some of the most difficult times, ex: LE interviews. I don't think a young manipulating, thief, liar,con artist escalating into possible murder would be able to keep her chit together this long. Even a long term sociopath will display some form of emotion or at least try and mimick an emotion. Those days KC stated while incarcerated the first arrest, "I have to keep it together in order to talk with LE" (something like that to Christina) are way behind her when Caylee's body was found. It was stated by the guard that she was listening to the radio and stated she wanted to watch the tele concerning what she was listening to on radio. I beleive her mixed up on purpose statement while at home july 16 to TL,"If they never find her guess who has to spend eternity in jail", came back to haunt her. "They found the body and now guess who gets to spend an eternity in jail." This is what she meant early on and so long as searchers were looking elesware KC was in the clear. I think the discovery brought her to buckling with fear for the future of self. Two things I'm happy about is that KC was incarcerated at the time Caylee was found. Can you imagine if she was home on house arrest with her parents? Also who would have been KC's babysitter the evenning her parents were in LA and found out about Caylee. That is scary in its self. Maybe Mother Nature does have a handle on how this case will play out, because so many other things concerning this case could have gone haywire that haven't. Like others have said, maybe the simplest answer to the crime of where who and how have already been uncovered by detectives. Maybe mother nature in her fury of loosing a beautiful blossom of a girl made those storms come to protect what evidence was there when she was found. I just have to believe stronger forces have been at work to conquer over evil. I'll come down off my pulpit, again. Second thing I'm grateful for is how cell phones, pings,texting,GPS, towers, computers, emails, instant messages just may have locked this criminal up. If I'm correct this was the first reported murder by fillicide case where cell activity was followed so strenuously. <3

I so get what you are saying. I made it my mission to get on my knees and pray every time an alert comes on tv that a child has gone missing. It started with BO. When little Caylee came up missing I prayed and prayed and prayed and prayed........(not knowing that a MR had tried several times to report this childs remains and been rebuffed!) Several months down the road I was praying and I said "OK God if there is nothing left to find then I guess you cannot have someone find her. So if that's the case God help me to accept that but bring every person who had a hand in her murder to juctice". I used to pray that God would shine a light on her so that a searcher would be lead to her remains. And I gotta tell you when I finally got to praying that prayer--about if nothings left of her---I heard inside "Trust me (insert my name), I got this". Loved, loved loved hearing that so I continued on praying for her to be found. Do you know what day she was found on? My son's birthday. Now some of you may not understand my next statement but "that was the very best gift". She's found, she's coming home. When you know a person is dead but their body is lost, yes, finding that body is the best gift. Since the day she was found I've prayed for juctice and so on the days that I despair--I just remember those words "Trust me, I got this". JMO

 

[spartanmom]

I've been thinking that her friends have shown a great deal of restraint. If Casey was my friend, could I keep my mouth shut or would I want the 25,000 fish from The Enquirer?

I will never, as long as I live, ever understand why Casey didn't say she hadn't seen Caylee since "yesterday" or "last week". Why admit to the 31 days? Why admit to that, and nothing else?

I was standing outside at work yesterday, smoking a cigarette, looking into the woods, and I couldn't get this girl off my mind. I kept thinking how exactly does one put a baby in a bag and throw it in the woods? I'm a big woods person, I will spend hours walking through forests. And now, I'm terrified that I'll "stumble" upon something. It's really ruined it for me.

I have always wondered this too. What is the reason for 31 days???? I know, what is the reason for anything that Casey does or says, but really, why not even, saying last week was the last time she saw her????

She still had the story of the nanny watching her to all of her friends and Cindy and had been telling them that....i'm just thinking here,.....help me understand this.....random thoughts, lol

 

[RJOINNH]

I have always wondered this too. What is the reason for 31 days???? I know, what is the reason for anything that Casey does or says, but really, why not even, saying last week was the last time she saw her????

She still had the story of the nanny watching her to all of her friends and Cindy and had been telling them that....i'm just thinking here,.....help me understand this.....random thoughts, lol

Because KC knew on what day Caylee had died!!!!! She knew exactly when the last time anyone had seen her with Caylee. She knew that there would be people that could verify this!!!! IMO this is the only time that KC thought ahead...to what could and would be found out. Thus stating that her daughter was missing on the day she knew she died.

 

[countzero]

I was actually looking for something else, but this caught my eye. I understand that children do change but this is complete contrast to what MM knew and what KC is saying. KC of course plays her famous word game:crazy:.

From MMs' deposition:
&#65532;
YM: How would you describe her relationship with, with Caylee at that time, her daugher?

MM: Good um every time I saw them together, Casey or Caylee was always very attached to her. You know like I would try and like you know take, you know I love kids so I would um you know try and take Caylee and play with her, chase her around or whatever and you know she would only have some of that for a short amount of time but after a couple of minutes like she was right back um, right back to Casey or she would never even let Casey leave her sight. You know she&#8217;d always wanna be held you know by Casey



From KC's Interview (describing her last phone call with Caylee)

KC: She seemed perfectly fine. There was nothing in the background...

JA: Telling you about a book, telling you -- no sign of any type stress at all?

KC: Not at all.

JA: Great. That`s wonderful. Now, let me ask you a question. Your daughter hasn`t seen you in over a month, and she`s not -- she`s...

KC: She was excited. She was excited to talk to me. But at the same time, it`s crazy that she didn`t get upset when she talked to me, which had it been my mom, I know it would have been...

JA: Is that another thing...

KC: ... totally different.

JA: Is that another thing that makes sense to you?

KC: She never gets upset when she talks to me, whether I haven`t seen her for an entire day, or if I had to work late at night and I didn`t see him almost an entire day until the next morning.


So, KC's saying that Caylee never gets upset when she doesn't see her and that it's normal. Yet again, she says that it's crazy that Caylee didn't get upset LIAR! MM has quite a different take on that. JMO

BBM: Brought this over from the MM interview thread.

I have witnessed many young toddlers who have been verbally abused and/or ignored by a parent suffer from similar behaviors. In private settings they are so programmed to entertain themselves, yet when in public they cling to any familiar person to get attention.

After seeing the video where KC is on the floor and Caylee is bouncing around on her legs, I could see the pain on Caylee's face as well as the "forced" smiles in many of the photos where KC is in them.

And if we have discussed this previously, please chalk this up to hormonal blips off the radar.

 

[gamom]

while that's true, she also had no qualms walking LE all the way to the end of the hall at Universal before admitting that was a lie - so she wasn't exactly afraid of getting caught in a lie.

ITA. Part of me thinks she was HOPING the body would be found so that she could then start the story about her being with the Nanny and being shocked that they Nanny would have done this. I think that is why she kept on partying as usual, etc. I don't think she thought she would go as long as she did before the body being found or that CA would corner her. But who knows with this girl. LP says she lives her life 10 minutes at a time, so that could be true as well.

As someone who has studied extensely kids who kill (although KC not a kid could still apply here) It is not unusual for someone who has an issue with rage to go into a rage or a tantrum then appear unusally normal after the fact. I think KC has alot of rage which is why her mom tip toes around her and once called her a sociopath.

 

[essies]

ITA. Part of me thinks she was HOPING the body would be found so that she could then start the story about her being with the Nanny and being shocked that they Nanny would have done this. I think that is why she kept on partying as usual, etc. I don't think she thought she would go as long as she did before the body being found or that CA would corner her. But who knows with this girl. LP says she lives her life 10 minutes at a time, so that could be true as well.

As someone who has studied extensely kids who kill (although KC not a kid could still apply here) It is not unusual for someone who has an issue with rage to go into a rage or a tantrum then appear unusally normal after the fact. I think KC has alot of rage which is why her mom tip toes around her and once called her a sociopath.

:wave::Welcome-12-june: I agree GM! Good first post!!

 

[AnotherGladysKravitz]

I know this has been discussed several times, but it just BUGS the heck out of me, and I cannot let it go...it even wakes me up in the middle of the night! RG, who seems like a very honest and credible person, stated in his interview with LE that Casey used the name Zenaida Gonzalez back in '06 when she told him she had another sitter for Caylee. How is this possible?? Had Casey really been using this "fantasy nanny" for over 2 years?? We all KNOW that this ZG doesn't exist, don't we? I mean, no cell phone records, no one has ever met her, etc. Was RG just so stressed at the time of the inter-view that he BELIEVED he heard the name in '06? IIRC, at the time of that interview, RG and JG had heard from LP that the A's were accusing JG of having something to do with Caylee's disappearance, I believe the words used were "actively framing" him. This is one of many things that stick in my craw, but it bothers me the most and drives me CRAZY.

Maybe '06 is when Casey procured the ZFG fake id for the purpose of buying alcohol/getting into clubs? IIRC it was said that there was another id in her wallet that the police collected.

 

[countzero]

Maybe '06 is when Casey procured the ZFG fake id for the purpose of buying alcohol/getting into clubs? IIRC it was said that there was another id in her wallet that the police collected.

And that lone piece of info is what I want to see the most. Either it directly implicates KC or it doesn't. Me thinks it IS a photo id with KC's photo next to a fictitious name. Hopefully ZFG or another one that LE/FBI/SA has tied into her case.

 

[Mare10]

BBM: Brought this over from the MM interview thread.

I have witnessed many young toddlers who have been verbally abused and/or ignored by a parent suffer from similar behaviors. In private settings they are so programmed to entertain themselves, yet when in public they cling to any familiar person to get attention.

After seeing the video where KC is on the floor and Caylee is bouncing around on her legs, I could see the pain on Caylee's face as well as the "forced" smiles in many of the photos where KC is in them.

And if we have discussed this previously, please chalk this up to hormonal blips off the radar.

While I do agree, it sounds like Caylee may have suffered from Separation Anxiety. There are many causes, including abuse. Also included are stress in the home, fear of something real, new caretaker etc.

It does make me think that perhaps it was getting more and more difficult for KC to leave Caylee with someone unfamiliar. This would not work well for KC who was losing her favorite "Nanny's" by the minute (her parents were making that more difficult as well) and was in need of finding new ones. If Caylee did indeed have Seperation Anxiety, this would have been almost impossible as I'm sure the new "Nanny" would have a very hard time and likely not want to babysit. IMO, KC found a very cooperative "Nanny". :cry:

 

[SoSueMe]

I think she gave the truth about 31 days because she knew her baby's body lie just down the street from her house. She didn't know if Caylee would be found immediately or ever. If she was found right away she would be in an advanced state of decomposition and that wouldn't coincide with a kidnapping having just happened yesterday or last week.

KC also knew that no one had seen her with Caylee for 31 days. The "nanny story" started immediately with her friends.

 

[NSS]

Trying to solve the Amy moving in angle has been driving me nuts. I assumed KC plotting to kill both, but recently, with all the talk of a secret, I came up with this version. CA would have been forced to walk a very fine line in the handling of KC. Sweetheart...Maybe by July 15th, CA had already figured out a story to tell if KC spilled the beans to LE.
Also, IIRC, someone pointed out a pattern of KC hating her mother, then early '08, she switched gears and spoke nicely of her mother to others, and changed to hating George.

I think the house ownership could have resulted from CA GA divorce talk. It also explains why KC switched from hating her mother to hating her father.

KC probably just heard "I'm going to stay at my Mothers" from CA during arguments and her imagination ran wild from there.

The searches for 'household weapons" etc, was simply KC and her fantasy life hoping that her mum would do away with her dad.

The problem with some forms of sociopathy is that they are very literal in their interpretation of situations. It is our emotional side that interprets "I'll kill you" into 'Oh heck, that person is angry'.
Being devoid of emotion, most sociopaths interpret it for exactly what it says.

 

[spyhouston]

I stumbled onto something I think is kinda significant, which probably means it's already been covered here and I just missed it. Plus, I'm not very good at doing searches and I don't know how to attach a document to my post (sorry......but at least I can type)! That being said, here's something I noticed.

In CA's deposition, she made such a HUGE deal out of "C" Zenaida signing the guest card at Sawgrass. For whatever reason, it was just such a big deal for CA. But, when I looked at the guest card, as has been said before, it looked like Mr. Garcia started to write Gonzales first, and that was the mistake that sorta looked like "C", it was the start of the "G". BUT in looking at the guest card, it looked to me like the real Zenaida filled out part of that guest card and Mr. Garcia filled out part, even though I've read that he said he completed the entire card.

THEN on the statement the real Zenaida gave LE, it looks like she AND someone else wrote parts of that statement. But look, when she starts to write her name, she does it again........starts to write "Zenaida", then notices the info is asked for in reverse order, stops and then writes "Gonzales" first.

I don't think this is hugely significant, but for me, it easily shows the "C" Zenaida that CA was using as solid proof that this poor girl's name was different was clearly a mistake and she did it again on the LE statement, confusing last name first, etc as asked for on both forms. Does this make any sense or do I need more coffee?

 

[KenoshaKid]

Maybe '06 is when Casey procured the ZFG fake id for the purpose of buying alcohol/getting into clubs? IIRC it was said that there was another id in her wallet that the police collected.

Could be, though we don't know for sure it was an id, just something that LE took that according to Lee appeared to be an ID. LE has made no comment about it at all (which in and of itself is kinda interesting, huh?)

 

[doogiesgirl]

You know I was listening to the JH depo the other day, listening to him describe how close CA and DC had gotten, the rubbing and hand holding, the hour?(can't remember) that CA and DC disappeared and then reappeared (was it at the Ritz-my memory is soo bad), all this going on in front of GA. I thought to myself, what would cause a person to ignore "hanky panky" from their mate? I was sick to my stomach at where my thoughts went. Then I kept remembering more things to add to my list that would support my "wondering". I don't buy the b/c of money. But I suppose I should head to TPL to see if there is any place this subject can be discussed. JMHO