toddler, woman killed by pit bulls

[justthinkin]

Yes, lots of dogs bite, but not like this. Warning graphic images of pit bull attacks http://tinyurl.com/yj288gv

 

[Filly]

Yes, lots of dogs bite, but not like this. Warning graphic images of pit bull attacks http://tinyurl.com/yj288gv

If lots of dogs did that there'd be a bunch of threads about them.

That photograph is similar to what the photos of my brothers attack looked like. He wasn't bit he was mauled. I've already posted that by the time he almost bled to death and the EMT's got there the dog had "run away". The dog had already attacked a person prior. Unfortunately later on the dog "happened to come back" so now there's a child maimed for life. Kid lost his eye. He's looking at skin grafts like my adult brother had.

We've got a little boy who is fighting along with a ton of Doctor's right now to save his arm in Philadelphia. We racked up a death by a pitt, a kid almost losing his arm and a woman almost losing hers.

 

[Filly]

I would imagine a HUGE percentage of the dogs in "pitbull" attacks, as labeled by the media or bystanders, are just muscular-short-haired dogs.

Really?

A huge percent? It's media worthy and they aren't pitbulls? In the case of my brother being mauled they knew that was a pitt as the dog already had a "bite". Of course the owner had no insurance, but he did admit it was a full bred pitt. Then the owner was mad the dog ran away. The d*mn dog didn't run away they hid it in Jersey. It bit someone in Jersey. Then when the dog a few months later maimed a child for life it was determined it was a pitt. If my child lost an eye and needed skin grafts and plastic surgery I'd want to know what kind of dog hurt him that severely.

I'm fairly sure the little 10 year old laying in a hospital in Philly right now fighting to keep an arm had someone who cared enough to be sure what kind of dogs attacked him. Same as the other person almost lost an arm over the weekend in Philly.

Christine Staab's own mother told us it was one of her six pitts that killed her daughter. Just my opinion, but I doubt the media runs around reporting on strong, short muscular dogs who maul people.

My brother is a postal carrier. He's been BIT quite a few times as have his co-workers. Then he was mauled by a dog with it's jaws locked on him so bad the owner couldn't get the dog off with a two by four. His co-workers many, many have been bit by dogs. One guy had to go out because he's missing half his behind and a testicle thanks to a pitbull. Guy can't walk right let alone deliver mail.

A link here with the little Sheriff boys name and what hospital he's in. Maybe I can find an obit for Christine Staab too.


Philly three pitbull attacks cause havok and death - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

 

[pittsburghgirl]

1. No owner should have more than 2 dogs unless he or she knows how to lead the pack. Otherwise, the ANIMALS resort to instinctual behavior.
2. Anyone owning a large breed dog or a dog from a breed that is prone to aggression should learn how to manage that dog in a healthy way.
3. And no children are safe around large groups of dogs left unsupervised.

 

[justthinkin]

I am sorry to hear about your brother, filly. I have had dogs my whole life. I love dogs; they are such great companions, small or large. The children who survive dog attacks will likely always be fearful of dogs, and never grow to love dogs which is a huge shame for both dogs and humans.

My significant other's ex-wife is now married to a man whose 3 year old granddaughter was attacked last year by the family pit bull that lived with the child and her parents. She was in critical condition, fighting for her life, but was slowly recovering last I heard, some months back.

The problem with legislating the owners of pits or any other breed well known for its potential for aggressiveness is that irresponsible owners will be non compliant with the laws, and the only way problems will be addressed is after an attack. After the attack is not good enough. Bans haven't been all that successful either. I guess when enough of the irresponsible owners have been bitten themselves is when we will see a decline in the popularity of aggressive breeds.

 

[kgeaux]

Yes, lots of dogs bite, but not like this. Warning graphic images of pit bull attacks http://tinyurl.com/yj288gv

Those pictures are indeed horrific. But I bet pictures of people mauled by other breeds are just as horrific. I certainly don't mean to diminish this child's pain and suffering in anyway, but the newborn who was bitten "hundreds" of times by a Pom and died as a result surely looked just as bad! A mauling is a mauling, no matter what breed does it. I'm needing to pray for this young man, because I've seen the recovery of someone who lost large amounts of skin and muscle, and that probably will be as horrible as the attack itself.

As disguiseduser mentioned in an earlier post, dobermans and rottweilers were once the "breed to be banned" I was around in the 70's and 80's....in fact in the 50's and 60's too! I remember when German Shepherds were considered the most dangerous breed around!

I have a pit. He passed the "Good Neighbor" test as administered at age 6 months and again at about 2 years old by a trained veterinarian. My dog's first lesson was "DROP IT!" Even now, if he hears me say "I dropped it!" or any variation of that, he comes running up to me to show me his mouth wide open and his jaw slack. If a dog cannot pass the "good neighbor" test (a very clear indicator of the dog's propensity to become agitated and react unpredicatably) then the dog needs to be put down, or kept in very stringent conditions by its owner. If a dog cannot be taught to open it's mouth and "drop" whatever it has chomped onto while he and his owner are both calm, then that dog is probably not trainable to listen to his owner in times of agitation, aggression or stress. A dog that cannot or will not listen to his owner's command is probably best being put down or (as I said before) kept in very stringent conditions.

Pits are smart, smart dogs-----and they love their people-----at least the ones who haven't been fed iron filings or blood, or thrown into a pit to fight to survive.

 

[kgeaux]

http://www.westminsterkennelclub.org/breedinformation/

The book I mention above has the terrier as part of the Sporting group. I remembered that the Westminster Show had just taken place and there was a Pit Bull terrier (I think) in the finals. The list above does not put 'terrier' in either the working or sporting groups, just grouped as 'terriers'. :waitasec:

Interesting.

I found this, http://www.akc.org/breeds/bull_terrier/

American Kennel club - states the bull terrier was popular as a Sporting dog. Then, later says, "Terrier Group".
Terrier is a group of their own now?

I think American Stafforshire Terriers, and Pit bull Terriers are the "official name" for pit bulls......and while Westminster may not classify them as herding or working dogs, terriers were originally bred to chase rodents out of areas where humans would follow to work----such as chasing rats out of a mine before the miners went in to do their jobs. In fact, it is probable that yorkies are so tiny because they were bred to be as small as it took to flush the rats out of small spaces!~!

My husband and I have a picture taken in the late 1800's which shows his entire family----in excess of 30 people!---posed around the front of their farming home, with their three pits standing at attention, left, right and middle. The pits had jobs---they herded the animals.

So while Westminster may classify them as a "sporting dog" pits can and do work and herd!

The article which birthed this thread has two very important details: #1. The woman who was killed was fighting with the owner of the dogs......doesn't make the attack any "better" but it does point out that it is not a random attack. #2. The toddler's family owned a Bull Dog Ranch.....bull dogs are NOT pits.

Another interesting caveat is to know that statistics are based on "pit bull and pit bull like" breeds.......exactly what an earlier poster mentioned....

 

[Jack]

The trouble with this article is that the toddler was killed by dogs identified as pitbulls, while the article also says: MyFox Orlando reported that a three-year-old girl was killed at her Ocala home Saturday (EST) - where her family operated a business called Haakers Dream Bulldog Ranch

Bulldogs and pits are two separate entities. So many types of dogs are mistaken for pits that it is unbelievable.......I am curious as to whether the dogs in question were indeed pits, or bulldogs.

The American Bulldog is not an AKC recognized breed. They are a designer breed just like the labradoodle, only a bit older. Early 70's probably. Thought originally to be a mix between a bull terrier and a mastiff. Their standard is not well defined. It is possible that dogs thought to be American Bulldogs have indeterminate bully breed blood as some breeders use dogs called southern whites which are not really a "pure" bloodline. Poor breeding = unstable dogs.


BTW, I think American Bulldogs are gorgeous. My neighbor has one and I thought of getting one myself before I finally decided on a Boxer.

 

[lonetraveler]

I still don't blame the dogs in the stories. In the first one, the dogs thought their owner needed them. She and her daughter were arguing and they probably thought she was being threatened. In the case of the toddler, tragic as it is, the parents should never have left her alone with so many dogs on the property unless they were more secure where she couldn't get to them. I feel for the families of both victims.

I have to disagree with your logic on this one. These dogs are aggressive dogs period. These dogs were originated and bred for their agressive nature. That is why they have been used for security purposes since they became a breed. Yes, other breeds do attack humans, but some dogs are bred and it is in their instinctive genes to do so. I have bred dogs professionally and shown them in the AKC matches. You learn in this business the differences between the breeds. This breed as well as Dobermans, Rottweilers, Chows along with the Pit Bulls are very unpredictable and can change from the most loving, gentle pet into a killing machine in a matter of seconds. Yes, some Pit Bulls are abused and trained to be aggressive and maybe that would explain an attack on a human but if you will read on the many, many cases of Pit Bull attacks you will find that most of these dogs were very loved family pets until that second they turned into killers. That is just the way it is. I know that some owners will not ever see the possibility that their beloved pet can kill them, until, unfortunately the owner or another person is attacked by that very same gentle, loving pet.

 

[lonetraveler]

I think American Stafforshire Terriers, and Pit bull Terriers are the "official name" for pit bulls......and while Westminster may not classify them as herding or working dogs, terriers were originally bred to chase rodents out of areas where humans would follow to work----such as chasing rats out of a mine before the miners went in to do their jobs. In fact, it is probable that yorkies are so tiny because they were bred to be as small as it took to flush the rats out of small spaces!~!

My husband and I have a picture taken in the late 1800's which shows his entire family----in excess of 30 people!---posed around the front of their farming home, with their three pits standing at attention, left, right and middle. The pits had jobs---they herded the animals.

So while Westminster may classify them as a "sporting dog" pits can and do work and herd!

The article which birthed this thread has two very important details: #1. The woman who was killed was fighting with the owner of the dogs......doesn't make the attack any "better" but it does point out that it is not a random attack. #2. The toddler's family owned a Bull Dog Ranch.....bull dogs are NOT pits.

Another interesting caveat is to know that statistics are based on "pit bull and pit bull like" breeds.......exactly what an earlier poster mentioned....

Some peope call Boxers bull dogs. they aren't but I've had plenty of people call my two Boxers, bull dogs.

 

[lonetraveler]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pit_Bull#Fatalities_reported_in_the_United_States_.282005-2009.29


Take note on the information for fatalities for pitt bull type dogs percentage wise. It appears that according to the above link, it is actually the fierce bite and refusing to let go of the person being attacked that inflicts the horrific mauling and deaths.

 

[kgeaux]

Some peope call Boxers bull dogs. they aren't but I've had plenty of people call my two Boxers, bull dogs.

I love boxers, and have owned some. Bull Dogs are cute little dogs, and I'd love to have one, not now because we are a "1" dog family! I can't imagine anyone confusing the two breeds, but I guess if you are unfamiliar with them.....

 

[impatientredhead]

I have to disagree with your logic on this one. These dogs are aggressive dogs period. These dogs were originated and bred for their agressive nature. That is why they have been used for security purposes since they became a breed. Yes, other breeds do attack humans, but some dogs are bred and it is in their instinctive genes to do so. I have bred dogs professionally and shown them in the AKC matches. You learn in this business the differences between the breeds. This breed as well as Dobermans, Rottweilers, Chows along with the Pit Bulls are very unpredictable and can change from the most loving, gentle pet into a killing machine in a matter of seconds. Yes, some Pit Bulls are abused and trained to be aggressive and maybe that would explain an attack on a human but if you will read on the many, many cases of Pit Bull attacks you will find that most of these dogs were very loved family pets until that second they turned into killers. That is just the way it is. I know that some owners will not ever see the possibility that their beloved pet can kill them, until, unfortunately the owner or another person is attacked by that very same gentle, loving pet.

Here is the rub for me, people that don't believe breed bans accomplish anything are painted with this unreasonable-illogical paintbrush that just dismissive (speaking in general, and using your post as a jump off point).

But speaking for myself personally I am not naive about the power of a large dog, any large dog. I don't think every dog is a candidate for rehab, I don't think every dog that bites someone was tortured by its redneck owner. Animals are living creatures, and just like people some of them are not wired right.

Doing rescue and rehoming work I can tell you it is a pretty crappy day when your "hobby" or volunteer project for the day is taking in someone elses dog that they walked away from and having it put down because you don't trust it. That is part of the job though, and it is also part of the job of being a petowner. Recognizing the warning signs, getting help from someone that knows more than you, and having the the backbone to put Fido down if that is what needs to be done.

I don't believe any animal turns from a loving docile family pet to a killing machine in two seconds no matter what the breed. There are always warning signs. They may be ignored or unrecognized but they are there. I say the same thing when the perfectly normal, great student, 15 year old kills someone and everyone says it came out of nowhere. No it didn't!

I have two large dogs of my own. Neither of them are pitbulls, but I promise you I am completely aware of the fact that my German Shepherd is protective and picks up any nervous energy on my part. He is not allowed around delivery people or service workers, period. I wouldn't leave either of my dogs with small children, not because I think anything would happen because I believe with all my heart they wouldn't harm a child, but common sense overrides belief and says it is not worth the risk to either species.

Personal responsibility.
Reasonable and consistent penalties for irresponsible dog owners.
That is what will make people safer, and if we choose to live with companion animals there will always be horribly unfortunate incidents.
They can be minimized greatly, but living with animals comes with risks.
Banning breeds won't change that on any level.

moo

 

[impatientredhead]

I love boxers, and have owned some. Bull Dogs are cute little dogs, and I'd love to have one, not now because we are a "1" dog family! I can't imagine anyone confusing the two breeds, but I guess if you are unfamiliar with them.....

I have seen shelter workers (lots of exposure to dogs, resource materials, it being their job to identify breeds....) identify a greyhound as a great dane, an akita as a chow, dozens of malamutes as huskies if they are lucky and don't get the wolf hybrid label, everything short haired and muscular is a pit mix, been called to pick up a malamute that was an australian shepherd, rhodesian and vizslas as lab mixes, etc...... My GSD was listed as a black lab puppy when we adopted him. It takes a lot to surprise me with misidentification of breeds.

 

[pooky169]

I was attacked by a Pit back in April. I was standing in front of my house talking to a tow truck driver that was towing my car to be repaired. the Pit lived down the street and got loose when his owner tried to chain him out back and came down and attacked me in front of my house. The tow truck driver was going to get his gun and shoot him after I broke free of the dog and I got in the front seat of the tow truck. The dogs owner caught his dog and took it home and then I called animal control and went to the ER. The dog was not current on his shots and had to be quarantined. They destroyed the animal after 10 days because the animal had been known to be aggressive in the past.
The owner had more pit bulls and I was leary to walk past his house afterwards knowing he wasn't being a responsible owner. He had been breeding them with another neighbor who has a couple of pits. I am leary of those dogs too.
I am not usually afraid of dogs as my husband and I have 2 ourselves. We have a spitz/chow/border collie mix and I have a pug.
I don't hate pits they are really beautiful hardy dogs but I have become leary of the breed due to my attack by one. I don't think it's the dogs fault by any means it's how they are raised and bred that makes them vicious and untrustworthy.

 

[impatientredhead]

I was attacked by a Pit back in April. I was standing in front of my house talking to a tow truck driver that was towing my car to be repaired. the Pit lived down the street and got loose when his owner tried to chain him out back and came down and attacked me in front of my house. The tow truck driver was going to get his gun and shoot him after I broke free of the dog and I got in the front seat of the tow truck. The dogs owner caught his dog and took it home and then I called animal control and went to the ER. The dog was not current on his shots and had to be quarantined. They destroyed the animal after 10 days because the animal had been known to be aggressive in the past.
The owner had more pit bulls and I was leary to walk past his house afterwards knowing he wasn't being a responsible owner. He had been breeding them with another neighbor who has a couple of pits. I am leary of those dogs too.
I am not usually afraid of dogs as my husband and I have 2 ourselves. We have a spitz/chow/border collie mix and I have a pug.
I don't hate pits they are really beautiful hardy dogs but I have become leary of the breed due to my attack by one. I don't think it's the dogs fault by any means it's how they are raised and bred that makes them vicious and untrustworthy.

That must have been terrifying!

The owner should have had all of his dogs impounded.
He should be prosecuted under an assualt by dog statute.
And he should never be able to own an animal again.

Putting down one dog and leaving the rest to breed is as illogical as the sex predator registries. We know there is a danger here but you deal with it. This is what I mean by the reform needs to come by enforcing the laws that we already have and deal with these ahole owners.

I am really sorry that happened to you.
I can't imagine still having to deal with him.

 

[Tizzle]

That must have been terrifying!

The owner should have had all of his dogs impounded.
He should be prosecuted under an assualt by dog statute.
And he should never be able to own an animal again.

Putting down one dog and leaving the rest to breed is as illogical as the sex predator registries. We know there is a danger here but you deal with it. This is what I mean by the reform needs to come by enforcing the laws that we already have and deal with these ahole owners.

I am really sorry that happened to you.
I can't imagine still having to deal with him.

I feel exactly the same. Well said. I want to add that I find it refreshing that pooky doesn't blame the animal, but blames the owner and didn't let it completely alter their opinion of the breed because of this terrifying experience.

I'm sorry this happened to you, pooky, and I hope you are doing well. I'm sorry that a stupid petowner caused you to be leary of this breed. I think you should fight to get this person banned from owning ANY of these animals! Maybe others in your neighborhood would be willing to help get the ball rolling. You shouldn't have to live in fear when you already know that this owner is IRRESPONSIBLE. Bless you.

 

[Filly]

I am sorry to hear about your brother, filly. I have had dogs my whole life. I love dogs; they are such great companions, small or large. The children who survive dog attacks will likely always be fearful of dogs, and never grow to love dogs which is a huge shame for both dogs and humans.

My significant other's ex-wife is now married to a man whose 3 year old granddaughter was attacked last year by the family pit bull that lived with the child and her parents. She was in critical condition, fighting for her life, but was slowly recovering last I heard, some months back.

The problem with legislating the owners of pits or any other breed well known for its potential for aggressiveness is that irresponsible owners will be non compliant with the laws, and the only way problems will be addressed is after an attack. After the attack is not good enough. Bans haven't been all that successful either. I guess when enough of the irresponsible owners have been bitten themselves is when we will see a decline in the popularity of aggressive breeds.

Thank you so much for your kindness, Just. My brother was an adult when he was mauled. He too is an animal lover. He owns a sheltie (sp) and a Gemrman Shephard. We grew up with German Shephards.

In this case he said he knew from day one when he started that mail route that dog had his eye on him. My bro told the owner if the dog was outside on the lead he would put his mail in the neighbors box. That was no problem with the owner although he assured my brother his dog was a "sweetheart". Maybe the dog was. However, it was instinct told the dog to protect his space. The day of the mauling my brother saw the dog was not out. He went up the step to the mailbox and all the sudden had the feeling that was a big mistake. Here the dog was so smart he hid behind a bush. BAM he got my brother from behind on his butt and thigh.

Neighbors were screaming. People were hitting the dog with all kinds of stuff. They were screaming for the owner. FINALLY said owner emerged from the house and saw what was going on. He came out with a big board and was whacking the dog as he commanded he stop.

That's just nuts. From experience living in an urban area I see it all the time. Thugs walking these dogs with heavy *advertiser censored*s chains weighing them down. Lots of times they are used for when cops come in on drug busts. They're also bred to fight them so when they allow them easy access to the public on a walk what the heck is the dog going to do?

Sorry for the rant. It just floors me that everybody stands for dogs. Stands up for specific breeds, but not many people have said "That's a da*n shame Christine Staab is dead. It's a da*n shame that little boy is laying in a hospital and may lose a limb. It's a da*n shame entire family's are going through he*l right now because of a dog". Just my take on it.

 

[pooky169]

Thanks for the kind replies. The guy who owned the dog that bit me finally moved a few months later and I found out his new address. I am planning on taking him to court at least for my medical bills when I get some extra money. I have been laid off and so has my husband so money is tight with us both being on unemployment with the bills and such I don't have the extra 100 dollars to take him to small claims. But there is a 6yr statue of limitations on it and it hasn't quite been a year yet.
When i sent him a letter saying I wanted him to take care of my bills he came by my house when I was outdoors and told me to give him copies, So when i copied them from my dads house I gave them to him and his girlfriend took them and told me they would consult their lawyer. Like why did they need to consult their lawyer when they were negligent and at fault and it was a open and shut case because I had 2 witnesses I had the tow truck driver and my husbands friend who was at the house waiting for my husband and his other friend to return from getting gas in our truck. So we could take my husbands scooter out to go pay some bills and save gas in his truck for work.
The other guy with the pits still lives there and I am still cautious when I go near the house cause he sometimes has them in his front yard unleashed. Even though he has a fenced in area in his backyard.
I have a fairly decent size bite mark on my leg and ankle from the bite that will never go away. It was warm out when it happened and I had capri pants on so I didn't have anything to help protect my leg from being directly attacked.
Like i said I don't blame the dogs I blame the owners for not being in control of their dogs and showing responsibility in taking care of them. Our dogs never leave our fenced in yard unless it's to go to the vet for their shots and other illnesses.
When something happens to my husbands dog he would like a boxer. They are pretty dogs and I like them too and I want another pug when something happens to mine I am addicted to the pugs cute faces and think they are adorable.
I wish this never happened to me but you never know what is gonna happen from one day to the next I just thank god it didn't happen to a small child or the elderly lady that lived next door to this man with the aggressive dogs.
He still has pits and I see him and his girlfriend walk them by my house occasionally to go to the family dollar store near my house.
So I guess only time will tell if I get any money to take him to court and get my bills taken care of.

 

[impatientredhead]

Thank you so much for your kindness, Just. My brother was an adult when he was mauled. He too is an animal lover. He owns a sheltie (sp) and a Gemrman Shephard. We grew up with German Shephards.

In this case he said he knew from day one when he started that mail route that dog had his eye on him. My bro told the owner if the dog was outside on the lead he would put his mail in the neighbors box. That was no problem with the owner although he assured my brother his dog was a "sweetheart". Maybe the dog was. However, it was instinct told the dog to protect his space. The day of the mauling my brother saw the dog was not out. He went up the step to the mailbox and all the sudden had the feeling that was a big mistake. Here the dog was so smart he hid behind a bush. BAM he got my brother from behind on his butt and thigh.

Neighbors were screaming. People were hitting the dog with all kinds of stuff. They were screaming for the owner. FINALLY said owner emerged from the house and saw what was going on. He came out with a big board and was whacking the dog as he commanded he stop.

That's just nuts. From experience living in an urban area I see it all the time. Thugs walking these dogs with heavy *advertiser censored*s chains weighing them down. Lots of times they are used for when cops come in on drug busts. They're also bred to fight them so when they allow them easy access to the public on a walk what the heck is the dog going to do?

Sorry for the rant. It just floors me that everybody stands for dogs. Stands up for specific breeds, but not many people have said "That's a da*n shame Christine Staab is dead. It's a da*n shame that little boy is laying in a hospital and may lose a limb. It's a da*n shame entire family's are going through he*l right now because of a dog". Just my take on it.

Everyone has expressed sympathy for the victims.
No one has said these dogs should not be destroyed.
Many have said the entire breed should be euthanized and removed from the planet.