Trial Discussion Thread #4 - 14.03.10, Day 6

[Cherwell]

While many here will probably be sceptical that they are scratch marks, it is quite possible that they had a fist fight while they were arguing and Reeva stuck her long nails into him. It will be interesting if they bring these up in court as if they really are scratch marks, it could help to prove that they were fighting unless OP has a more credible explanation.

If she did scratch him, scrapings from under her fingernails would prove it beyond doubt.

 

[AlwaysShocked]

I have been "sleuthing".

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...e-before-to-deal-with-domestic-incidents.html

In a Police Press Conference on the day OP was arrested - which was the day after the murder - the Spokesperson answers a question about if OP had any history of violence by stating that yes, there had indeed been prior domestic "incidents" in which allegations were made. She used the plural, not the singular.

I also read an interview where a guy who was OP's roommate during the 2012 Olympics said he had to change rooms because he could not stand OP yelling at people on the telephone all the time.

And OP admitted to Piers Morgan - off air - that he was having anger management issues. That was a few moths before the shooting.

So OP has anger issues. OP has an exaggerated sense of entitlement. And OP is a gun nut.

<modsnip>

 

[Pisto_lius]

OP knew exactly what kind of ammunition he used !

This ammunition is made for killing - not for defense.

He fired four shots with this ammunition through a closed door into a very small room....

This means: he intended to kill the person behind this door - whether this was an intruder or not....

 

[jilly]

I believe that was the same tank Reeva was wearing when she arrived at the home earlier - meaning she slept in the top she had been wearing all day, I guess...

That's what I think too. It could easily have been one of those sport's tops which has the bra built in. As we know, Reeva was also found with her Nike sport shorts on.

 

[Estelle]

For Carol or anyone in SA....I simply don't understand this going to balcony to get "fans". This was no doubt a very expensive home ....don't people have air conditioning?? And also sleeping with the windows open is not something I do here in Minnesota in a suburb with very little crime. I know there is security but why sleep with windows open. I would like to know if I am crazy or what?

The climate of South Africa is similar to where I live in Sydney, Australia and few people have air conditioning in their homes. We mainly have air conditioning at work and in shopping malls, etc. At most, we use either ceiling fans or table fans. However, even though I have a fan, I rarely ever put it on. We usually prefer fresh air. As I live near the CBD, I have bars on my downstairs windows and leave them open all the time.

As I am a frequent traveller around the world, I rarely ever put the air conditioning on in an hotel. If I do, it is only for an hour before I go to bed but it would have to be very hot for me to do that. The noise of them keeps me awake and I often think I will get a chill from them.

I had Americans staying here once who insisted on having their fan on in their bedroom 24/7 even when they were not there! It was only September so it was only warm weather here. I used to slip into their bedroom to turn the fan off as we consider that to be a waste of electricity.

I asked Carol that question once and she said few people in South Africa have air conditioning. Like you, I had expected Pistorius to have it.

The interesting thing is that IIRC the only people who heard the gunshots and screams on February 14, seem to have been people who do not have air conditioning, namely Michelle Burger and Charl Johnson who live 170 metres away from OP. Their neighbours did not hear anything as they have air conditioning. I am not sure about Dr Stipp but he was much closer.

As for Pistorius, I read somewhere (but cannot find it now) that he could use the argument that he likes to ventilate his prosthetic legs with the fans.

 

[MeeBee]

The climate of South Africa is similar to where I live in Sydney, Australia and few people have air conditioning in their homes. We mainly have air conditioning at work and in shopping malls, etc. At most, we use either ceiling fans or table fans. However, even though I have a fan, I rarely ever put it on. We usually prefer fresh air. As I live near the CBD, I have bars on my downstairs windows and leave them open all the time.

As I am a frequent traveller around the world, I rarely ever put the air conditioning on in an hotel. If I do, it is only for an hour before I go to bed but it would have to be very hot for me to do that. The noise of them keeps me awake and I often think I will get a chill from them.

I had Americans staying here once who insisted on having their fan on in their bedroom 24/7 even when they were not there! It was only September so it was only warm weather here. I used to slip into their bedroom to turn the fan off as we consider that to be a waste of electricity.

I asked Carol that question once and she said few people in South Africa have air conditioning. Like you, I had expected Pistorius to have it.

The interesting thing is that IIRC the only people who heard the gunshots and screams on February 14, seem to have been people who do not have air conditioning, namely Michelle Burger and Charl Johnson who live 770 metres away from OP. Their neighbours did not hear anything as they have air conditioning. I am not sure about Dr Stipp but he was much closer.

As for Pistorius, I read somewhere (but cannot find it now) that he could use the argument that he likes to ventilate his prosthetic legs with the fans.

That would definitely be me, lol. I think it's an acclimation thing. I go to Canada or Poland in summer or in warm weather where they have NO AC and feel like I'm dying!

 

[lisasalinger]

I am beginning to think Reeva could see the gun aimed at her head, and put her arm up to protect herself. Also, those bruises on the back of the knee and back of the shin - wouldn't they line up with someone's leg being forced back against a ceramic toilet, or maybe a bed frame?

If she had fallen backwards in the toilet, I would expect her to have injured herself on the tile floor/wall....but I guess if Reeva died before bruising could form, perhaps that tissue damage wouldn't show?....yet bruising had time to form on her upper eyelids, from the brain bleed.

I really do not know what a pathologist who has 'ethical issues' about testifying in public, is doing acting as a public/state pathologist. Or is he a private one?

BBM

It certainly seems that way (in response to the bolded sentence). Why does somebody shield themselves? Because they know the other person has a weapon. We know the bullet entered the right arm above the elbow and bullet/bullet fragments entered the head behind the right ear at the base of the skull. Cross your arms in front of your head, across your forehead and that seems to give you that trajectory.

 

[Estelle]

I have been "sleuthing".

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...e-before-to-deal-with-domestic-incidents.html

In a Police Press Conference on the day OP was arrested - which was the day after the murder - the Spokesperson answers a question about if OP had any history of violence by stating that yes, there had indeed been prior domestic "incidents" in which allegations were made. She used the plural, not the singular.

I also read an interview where a guy who was OP's roommate during the 2012 Olympics said he had to change rooms because he could not stand OP yelling at people on the telephone all the time.

And OP admitted to Piers Morgan - off air - that he was having anger management issues. That was a few moths before the shooting.

So OP has anger issues. OP has an exaggerated sense of entitlement. And OP is a gun nut.

<modsnip>

Another thing to add to this list is a remark made by Trish Taylor, Samantha's mother. Apparently, Pistorius often used to stay at their house and when she observed his behaviour, she advised Pistorius to have counselling but he never did.

<modsnip>

 

[kittychi]

GOOD POSTS. I think you are very observant in noticing these scratch marks on your previous post and this one of Pistorius which occurred days later. It's a wonder that the MSM did not pick this up before as I have not seen it in the MSM.

While many here will probably be sceptical that they are scratch marks, it is quite possible that they had a fist fight while they were arguing and Reeva stuck her long nails into him. It will be interesting if they bring these up in court as if they really are scratch marks, it could help to prove that they were fighting unless OP has a more credible explanation.

Would the pathologist have possibly taken DNA samples from Reeva's fingernails to check for OP's flesh?

:waitasec:

 

[jilly]

Feynman, in Post #502 on this very page, I posted the link to one of the many articles on OP's watching of X-rated *advertiser censored*. SO IT IS NOT SPECULATION.



Here is one of the many MSM articles on the subject of OP's watching of X-rated *advertiser censored* posted on 24 February, 2014:


Quote:
The paralympian was looking at X-rated material on his phone shortly before model Reeva Steenkamp was shot, according to reports in South Africa.

Court documents allege Pistorius was browsing *advertiser censored* websites while Reeva was at his home in Pretoria.

Experts say prosecutors could use the evidence to challenge whether the pair were a "loving couple".

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/late...hot-lover-dead

Well...maybe he was looking a *advertiser censored* that nite and Reeva just wasn't interested in having sex, hence, he blew up which scared Reeva and she ran into the toilet stall. Just too bad she didn't run down the stairs and out the door. Obviously, she didn't think he was going to shoot her.

 

[lisasalinger]

Three bullets is correct, I believe. One to the head, one to the right arm , and one to the right hip/groin. (Stipp's testimony)

What I'm questioning is the fractured left arm. The way I understand it, a bullet went through one arm, entered her head, and exited leaving a second head wound. I believe the left arm must have been the one struck by the bullet that passed through the head, but I'm not sure and would like to confirm.

This is the problem with blacking out key testimony. Instead of an accurate graphic account, we now have questionable graphic reports.

BBM

In response to the bold... now this would definitely mean she had her arms folded around her head. See my post above and it makes perfect sense.

Enters the right arm above elbow, goes thru to the head at the base of the skull, exits the left side out thru the left arm.

There's no reason to be shielding your head in the bathroom like that on a simple pee trip (unless you're raging hungover.. which she was not)

 

[Estelle]

OP knew exactly what kind of ammunition he used !

This ammunition is made for killing - not for defense.

He fired four shots with this ammunition through a closed door into a very small room....

This means: he intended to kill the person behind this door - whether this was an intruder or not....

This is very telling, isn't it? I now can't wait to listen to the evidence of the ballistics experts.

 

[aa9511]

The video analysis recorded the sounds at 170 meters. They were both clearly audible and sounded similar. I thought the cricket bat sound was not quite as loud as the gunshots, but still very loud and the quality or tone of the sound was the same

I just can't imagine cricket bad sounds reverberating through the air all the way to Burger's house like gunshots would.

There is no way they mistook the cricket bat for the gunshots at that distance. NO WAY.

JMO.

 

[lisasalinger]

Would the pathologist have possibly taken DNA samples from Reeva's fingernails to check for OP's flesh?

:waitasec:

Good question... I would be hugely surprised if he didn't. Anytime somebody is murdered, that is a very common thing to do. Including swabs of their private parts, so I'm guessing we may hear about their sexual relations that night too.

 

[kittychi]

Yes - and Dr. Stipp testified that he observed OP promising God that if Reeva lived, OP would dedicate his life and Reeva's life to God.

He claimed ownership of Reeva when he made that declaration. This, to me, demonstrates his mindset. IMO, he did not perceive Reeva as an autonomous person, but as an object of which he possessed ultimate control.

This is a very common attribute of perpetrators of domestic violence assaults and domestic violence homicides.

Yes...this proclamation by OP at the scene has baffled me! Who is he to think he can dedicate someone else's life to God or anything else??? Or did he say that purposely for the audience that was there? Wow.

Could they have been arguing about God?

(We do know that OP has done lots of Bible reading over the last year :floorlaugh

 

[aa9511]

This article may be right about the psyche of OP that fatal night:

"Oscar did feel vulnerable, despite his long list of awe-inspiring athletic accomplishments, not just because of his physical congenital disability, but, because of psychological childhood traumas.

Oscar was traumatized at age six by his parents’ divorce, his subsequent estrangement from his father, and at age 15, his mother’s death. She’d been a cheerleader for him, encouraging him not to let his disability define him. Her passing would have been experienced as a profound abandonment to a teen boy who was so dependent upon her love.

In Oscar’s adult life, reports of a darker side surfaced, including a hair-trigger temper, drinking, and a reckless boating accident. There are even reports of the police coming out on domestic altercations between Oscar and Reeva before the shooting. So, there was already trouble in paradise, precisely because Oscar did feel vulnerable. He’d fallen in love with the angelic Reeva – a law school graduate, beautiful model and soon to be TV reality star. Unconsciously, he was terrified she would abandon him, just like the first love of his life - his mother – had done."

http://thecelebritycafe.com/feature/2014/02/hollywood-couch-what-made-oscar-pistorius-run-afoul-law

bbm

This is almost exactly what I posted earlier upthread.

He was afraid of losing her (hence the jealousy), and I also said kind of a "too good to be true" thing that he probably saw in the whole situation of him dating Reeva.

JMO.

 

[Estelle]

I am mortified to read this part of the testimony.

http://www.smh.com.au/world/oscar-p...s-presented-20140310-hvh5j.html#ixzz2vbeLxRvz

This male, Oscar Leonard Carl Pistorius disgusts me by his behaviour. I refuse to refer to him as a man.

On twitter, many are now referring to Pistorius as a woman as he supposedly screams like one and is a Drama Queen!! LOL

 

[Interested Bystander]

The climate of South Africa is similar to where I live in Sydney, Australia and few people have air conditioning in their homes. We mainly have air conditioning at work and in shopping malls, etc. At most, we use either ceiling fans or table fans. However, even though I have a fan, I rarely ever put it on. We usually prefer fresh air. As I live near the CBD, I have bars on my downstairs windows and leave them open all the time.

As I am a frequent traveller around the world, I rarely ever put the air conditioning on in an hotel. If I do, it is only for an hour before I go to bed but it would have to be very hot for me to do that. The noise of them keeps me awake and I often think I will get a chill from them.

I had Americans staying here once who insisted on having their fan on in their bedroom 24/7 even when they were not there! It was only September so it was only warm weather here. I used to slip into their bedroom to turn the fan off as we consider that to be a waste of electricity.

I asked Carol that question once and she said few people in South Africa have air conditioning. Like you, I had expected Pistorius to have it.

The interesting thing is that IIRC the only people who heard the gunshots and screams on February 14, seem to have been people who do not have air conditioning, namely Michelle Burger and Charl Johnson who live 170 metres away from OP. Their neighbours did not hear anything as they have air conditioning. I am not sure about Dr Stipp but he was much closer.

As for Pistorius, I read somewhere (but cannot find it now) that he could use the argument that he likes to ventilate his prosthetic legs with the fans.

Estelle, I think you meant 170 metres.

Roux brought up OP ventilating his legs with fans during Samantha Taylor's testimony. She denied she had ever seen him do it.

 

[aa9511]

Thank you.
Kindly use my #s in your reply, because I cant be sure which points you refer to.
But please do not ask me to merely provide the answers, it was posed for sleuthing by y'all.

Update: Nothing sexual I think in all my answers awaiting

Sigh. Ok.

btw I was referring to all of your points - my point was I still don't get it.

The one about Oscar vomiting and holding his heads, I wrote out what it was.

 

[Simply Caustic]

Perhaps it's a generational thing. My husband watches it and I can assure you we have a very healthy and wonderful relationship. It's not something that has ever bothered me and it still doesn't. It's not about shunning your partner. It's just something different. Perhaps they'd already fooled around and he was feeling frisky. Like I said, I never knew a single man who doesn't watch it though I'm young and things may have changed. I think it's kind of naive to think not one man you've ever known has watched or looked at *advertiser censored*. I think that's almost impossible, given the statistics.

I agree wholeheartedly. I'm a practicing Catholic, 33, in a committed, healthy relationship, and I know he watches *advertiser censored*...sparingly, but it occurs nevertheless.

I've got many a gripe with Oscar, but his pornographic predilections don't bother me.

Imo

Sent from my KFTHWI