Plane carrying 72 passengers and 9 crew has crashed in Colombia

[Blondie in Spokane]

This is just so terribly sad. Fox News just played a video of the team celebrating their recent victory and they all looked so joyous and happy....and now most of them are dead. I feel awful for all those who lost their lives at such a young age, in their prime, and for all their families and friends left behind.

Somewhere this morning I ran across a photo of the few players who were not on the flight - they were sitting in their locker room and looked absolutely stunned and so sorrowful. I'm so sorry this happened and pray for all involved in this sad, sad incident.

 

[Hatfield]

Thank you for posting this it is a lovely gesture. It has been great to see football clubs and fans around the world unite and offer their condolences.

Agree.

Prayers for all family and friends of the people on board.

 

[FindHG]

View attachment 105250

Anfield, for tonight's game

View attachment 105251

Heartbreaking, football family.

Chapecoense we mourn with you

#ForçaChape YNWA

Thank you, skibaboo, for this
#ForçaChape YNWA

from stream above: **** /messi10stats/status/803643940075409412 (21 mins ago)

 

[CARIIS]

I desire to be kind and empathetic.

This is a plane crash. The number of colomn inches devoted to the soocar team, is wrong.

moo

I felt the same way when the Voice lady was murdred. Pulse happened.

There are lot of people that are deceased today.

That desreves IMO, to be acknoledged and reported.

Each of them have loved ones that want answers.

That IMO is the ought to be the focus of this.

I am not being disresptful here.

For lack of a better word, there are lots of human being that are dead.

We are all humans- despite different skill sets.

I am finding this angering.

As most of you know, I want info- solely as it relates to a jetliner crashing.

WIth love and empathy for the team.

Others were on there - media IMO needs to be reporting, like any other aviation disaster on that

I hope I have not offended anyone.

This is in imo, a CFIT accident


-- "controlled flight into terrain"

That is what this is

We need to focus on what resulted in that occuring


moo

 

[CARIIS]

It's a miracle there were any survivors. The loss of life is horrendous. The crash site reminds me of the horrific Germanwings tragedy.

I wonder where the survivors were located on the plane. They say the back of a plane is safer in a crash but it looks as if the back has been totally destroyed. It's horrendous seeing the photos of the players on the plane and at the airport knowing nearly all the people are now dead just a few hours later.

There are really no "safe" seats. It depends on the accident sequence, g forces, and survivable space that occurs in the sequence.

Physics.

If you have a CFIT accident ( plane basically in control and nose hits- back of the plane ideally is best).

It depends honestly on what stuck what when the sequence started - and where.

How the G forces were distributed.

If the tail impacts first, those people will have a different out come.

In a fire sequence, those near the fuel tanks have a different outcome.

all of this is only my opinion



BUT it is a much poorer country , I think we , imo are going to end up with maintenance issues as it relates to $$

From this picture , it looks as if we had a reasonably intact aircraft that basically belly flopped into terrain.

That is typically associated with a stall- sorry it is not a pretty picture, think roller there is a awateness that you are falling.

There is inabilty to breath (g forces), the noise is incredible. Like a whizzing that increasing on the way down.

Ears are painful. You vomit . The seatbelts are diggin into your pelvis, it hurts.

It is a aweful last moments

You know.............................

Sorry just telling it as it is.

moo

just mo

 

[Indy Anna]

I desire to be kind and empathetic.

This is a plane crash. The number of colomn inches devoted to the soocar team, is wrong.

moo

I felt the same way when the Voice lady was murdred. Pulse happened.

There are lot of people that are deceased today.

That desreves IMO, to be acknoledged and reported.

Each of them have loved ones that want answers.

That IMO is the ought to be the focus of this.

I am not being disresptful here.

For lack of a better word, there are lots of human being that are dead.

We are all humans- despite different skill sets.

I am finding this angering.

As most of you know, I want info- solely as it relates to a jetliner crashing.

WIth love and empathy for the team.

Others were on there - media IMO needs to be reporting, like any other aviation disaster on that

I hope I have not offended anyone.

This is in imo, a CFIT accident


-- "controlled flight into terrain"

That is what this is

We need to focus on what resulted in that occuring


moo

I understand what you're saying, CARIIS, in re to the media's reporting. I had similar thoughts. I noticed in the selfie of the 2 soccer players an elderly woman sitting behind them. She is gone, too. So many have lost their lives and each one is important to someone. When a tragedy involves someone with celebrity status or of national/local significance, media focuses on that person/those people to draw interest by making the news more personal. In that respect, maybe it is a good thing. Condolences to all who have lost a loved one. May survivors heal quickly and completely.

 

[trigger]

Thank you, skibaboo, for this
#ForçaChape YNWA

View attachment 105257 from stream above: **** /messi10stats/status/803643940075409412 (21 mins ago)

I rather see the Walking Dead then see people happy one minute and the dead the next. Its so sad those players won for their country and now they are gone. And Im sure more pictures will come out of other families soon.

Goodbye 2016

 

[gregjrichards]

Thankfully the flight data recorders aka black boxes were found a few hours ago. Hopefully a cause for the crash will become clear.

https://mobile.twitter.com/AerocivilCol/status/803680399893393408

 

[CARIIS]

ugly little thing!!

hit the ground in an area near Rionegro, Colombia, about a 45-minute drive from Medellin, the plane's destination.

"mayday" had been declared,

If crew members became distracted during an emergency, perhaps as they completed a required checklist, they may have lost their situational awareness and allowed the airplane to descend too low for the terrain

may also have been attempting to divert to the Rionegro airport as a result of their (as yet unknown) emergency situation but became overwhelmed

the weather itself could have caused problems with controlling the aircraft if the flight was flown into an area of severe turbulence from thunderstorms.
Another possible factor: Pilots flying for charter operations are sometimes lower on the experience scale .

the less experienced pilot often accepts employment with a lower-paying operation as a pseudo-internship to log flight hours and climb the stairs up to a job with the major airlines.

large pieces of the airplane are visible, it appears the impact with the ground may have been at a lower speed

survivors were found among the wreckage is further evidence the airplane may have been flying slower

]http://www.cnn.com/2016/11/29/opinions/colombia-plane-crash-cause-abend/index.html[/video]

Lack of fire meaningful.

Def looks like a nose up belly flop

short take-off and landing capability

engines lack thrust reversers due to their perceived reduced effectiveness in anticipated conditions. Instead, the BAe 146 features a large airbrake with two petals below the tail rudder at the rear of the fuselage

renowned for its relatively quiet operation,

undercarriage of the aircraft is toughened to resist damage and stability is maximised by the placement of landing gear, of particular value when operating from rough airstrips.[SUP][1]

[/SUP]. Deliveries of the RJ85 began in April 1993. The RJ85 seats up to 112 passengers

Firefighting air tanker versions of both the BAe 146 and the Avro RJ85 have been manufactured via the conversion of aircraft previously operated by airlines.[SUP][

[/SUP]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Aerospace_146

google images

 

[CARIIS]

[FONT=&quot]lost radar contact just before 10 p.m. Monday (

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Colombian officials initially said the plane suffered an electrical failure but there was also heavy rainfall at the time of the crash. Authorities also said they were not ruling out the possibility, relayed to rescuers by a surviving flight attendant, that the plane ran out of fuel minutes before its scheduled landing at Jose Maria Cordova airport outside Medellin.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot] bodies scattered across a muddy mountainside were collected into white bags. They were then loaded onto several Black Hawk helicopters that had to perform a tricky maneuver to land on the crest of the Andes mountains.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]owned by LaMia, a charter company that started off in Venezuela but later relocated to Bolivia, where it was certified to operate last January.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Before being taken offline, LaMia’s website said it operated three 146 Avro short-haul jets

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]He noted that the air distance between cities is usually measured by the shortest route but planes rarely fly in a straight line — pilots may steer around turbulence or change course for other reasons.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Given the model of the plane and that it was flying close to capacity, “I would be concerned that the pilots may have been cutting it too close,”

[/FONT]http://www.denverpost.com/2016/11/28/colombia-plane-crash-chapecoense-soccer-brazil/


An image released by the

[FONT=&quot] bodies scattered across a muddy mountainside were collected into white bags. They were then loaded onto several Black Hawk helicopters that had to perform a tricky maneuver to land on the crest of the Andes mountains.


Colombian police of the crash site.[/FONT] Colombian police.

 

[Meryl12]

Post #10 by gregrichards stated that the distance was 1605nm (2975 Km) and the fuel range of the aircraft was 1600 nm (2965 Km).
These figures speak for themselves.
This is the link to the article gregrichards posted.
Ref: http://www.jacdec.de/2016/11/29/2016-11-28-lamia-avro-rj-85-crashed-near-medellin-with-81-on-board/

 

[AlwaysShocked]

Hard to believe but there have been a few crashes in the past that I've read about where the plane was out of fuel. And not from deliberately dumping it.

Of the many theories about Amelia Earhart's disappearance, her plane running out of fuel and her attempting to land into the ocean is one of the top theories.

 

[Snoods]

So very sorry for the many lives lost and for their families.

I can't imagine the emotions of finding out your loved one was one of only six who survived. The incredible relief and joy they feel, yet also guilt as so many others close to them are suffering such painful losses.

Survivors from left: Flight technichian Erwin Tumiri, journalist Rafael Henzel, team reserve goalkeeper Jackson Follmann. Erwin Tumiri is listed in stable condition. Rafael Henzel is reported to be doing fine. Jackson Follmann has had a leg amputated.

Flight attendant Ximena Suarez Otterburg, team defender Alan Ruschel. Alan Ruschel has suffered a spinal fracture. Ximena Otterburg is listed in stable condition.

Helio Zampier Neto, team defender. He is listed in stable condition with chest and skull injuries.

Team goalkeeper Marcos Danilo Padilha, 31, pictured with his wife, initially survived the crash. He spoke to his wife by phone from his hospital bed, only to die from his injuries a short time later.


http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/brazilian-...ash-six-survivors-found-amid-wreckage-1593943
http://www.ole.com.ar/futbol-internacional/sacaron-Neto_0_1696030545.html
https://au.news.yahoo.com/a/3336075...al-call-to-wife-moments-before-he-died/#page1
http://www.ksfy.com/content/news/76-people-killed-in-Colombian-plane-crash-403541916.html

 

[CARIIS]

goalkeeper Jakson Follmann's leg amputated - AP

How sad

[h=2]20 journalists among those killed in plane crash near Medellin - AP


[/h][h=2]4 listed in manifest did not travel - @Policiantioquia
[/h]

 

[Snoods]

I'm also curious about where the survivors were seated. Marcos and Alan were seated together in gray seats. The seats to the left and right of them are blue, as seen on video taken on the flight. Marcos survived the crash but later died in the hospital. Alan survived with a spinal fracture. I would be willing to bet they were seated near the wings.

The two crew members and the journalist survived with the least amount of injuries. I would imagine the crew members were seated in the rear of the plane as they were landing, but from media reports the tail was destroyed. Odd. Perhaps they were in the cockpit (Edwin was a flight tech)?

Marcos Padilha, left, and Alan Ruschel.

Blue seats to the left (from video).

Blue seats to the right (from video).

Reported last picture of the soccer team and support staff before takeoff. Where are the gray seats? Am I crazy?


https://au.news.yahoo.com/a/3336075...al-call-to-wife-moments-before-he-died/#page1
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...l-declares-three-days-of-mourning-chapecoense
http://hollywoodlife.com/2016/11/29/chapecoense-final-video-brazilian-soccer-team-plane-crash-watch/

 

[emirates1957]

View attachment 105239

http://www.jacdec.de/2016/11/29/2016-11-28-lamia-avro-rj-85-crashed-near-medellin-with-81-on-board/

There is discussion online that the plane would not have been able to complete its journey with the number of passengers on the flight and would have run out of fuel.

Thanks Greg.....noticed this last night and was waiting for something to appear on WB's. However looking at a brief picture of the cabin prior to take off it appears to be predominately male. Certainly hope their weight and balance was correct. This could have been a quite heavy aircraft combine that with minimum fuel, terrain and night flying could end in disaster. I have problems copy and pasting .... is there any way a copy of the trim sheet could be obtained (I know that's a long shot)???

 

[Snoods]

goalkeeper Jakson Follmann's leg amputated - AP

How sad

[h=2]20 journalists among those killed in plane crash near Medellin - AP


[/h][h=2]4 listed in manifest did not travel - @Policiantioquia
[/h]

I believe one of the four was the coach's son, who wasn't able to board the plane because he forgot his passport. His father, Caio Junior, was killed.

The son of Chapecoense coach Caio Junior escaped death after forgetting his passport for the doomed flight LMI2933.

Matheus Saroli, 25, was supposed to be on the plane carrying the Brazilian football team, which crashed on its way from Sao Paulo to Medellin in Colombia via Bolivia.

Matheus with his father, Caio.


https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/foot...nior-escapes-death-after-forgetting-passport/


@emirates1957 :seeya: I was hoping to see you here, looking forward to your input.

 

[emirates1957]

Hi Tulessa this was mentioned earlier but the pilots reported electrical failure on board to the airport not long before the crash. Other more recent reports are saying the plane was dumping fuel to make an emergency landing. So the cause of the crash will need to be thoroughly investigated to be certain of what happened. Nobody knows for sure yet. There was adverse weather terrible thunderstorms nearby too at the time of the crash which won't have helped matters. At least terrorism has been ruled extremely unlikely by officials.

Still catching up on this so exuse my ignorance if this has already been covered. Headlines never cease to amaze me, they can't have it both ways, lack of fuel and or electrical problem. If they were so close to the airport and had thunderies in the area you would want sufficient fuel in order to go around, or return to an alternate....no reason do dump as you would have already used your max fuel in order for a min fuel landing. If they had taken off had let's say had a severe electrical failure they would need to dump fuel and return to the originating airport. It would be interesting to get a dummy Trim Sheet to be able to ascertain the weights of an high male pax count on board this type of equipment.

 

[Tulessa]

Hi Tulessa this was mentioned earlier but the pilots reported electrical failure on board to the airport not long before the crash. Other more recent reports are saying the plane was dumping fuel to make an emergency landing. So the cause of the crash will need to be thoroughly investigated to be certain of what happened. Nobody knows for sure yet. There was adverse weather terrible thunderstorms nearby too at the time of the crash which won't have helped matters. At least terrorism has been ruled extremely unlikely by officials.

Thank you Greg.

 

[Snoods]

Marcos and Alan

Alan and Jakson

So apparently survivor Jakson Follmann was seated next to survivor Alan Ruschel, who was seated next to Marcos, who died at the hospital.