OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) #32

[Dudly]

He did not. I just checked again today. Sometimes the tone of a post gets lost when we type things so the best way I can describe my fascination is it’s a fascination that I’ve never known what to think. Does that make sense?

Yes, that makes your thoughts sound very different and a lot like mine...

 

[Betty P]

I'm only guessing here, but some of the evidence had to go to labs and took some time to get results. IMO friends and family are protecting the murders. There are locals that either know everything that happened, or by this time have enough "clues" to have some idea of who did this. The Wagner's were not on the radar of LE/BCI in the beginning, or had a very good lawyer who kept them out of the media/public. If they did have W's on radar, you would think they would be watching they closely. But apparently they didn't because they left town. I think "someone" let the authorities know that the W's were leaving, someone who wants to stay close to them for the children's sake? I also agree with your post Betty, yes I believe they "set" JM up, but why? I think they needed more info that they thought he had. They have believed the Manley's didn't tell them the truth from the beginning, or wouldn't have kept bringing them in for questioning.
What were they trying to get from JM? And did they get it?

I have to disagree that the surviving Rhoden and Manley family members are trying to protect the killers. What evidence have you seen that indicates they are protecting the killers? What possible motive would they have for doing that?

JMO, the deceased victims were the only ones who could have identified the killers. That's why so many of them were killed - so no surviving family member could know or guess who they are and come after them.

 

[amauet1]

If they were telling the truth about the red truck, they must have some information that leads them to think it was used in connection with "a murder" (note they never said it was the Rhoden/Gilley murders). If they had a witness statement, security video, etc., it should have been enough to get a search warrant for the truck. They were able to get a SW from a judge for the GPS, so....

Speaking of vehicles, while researching corruption in SE Ohio, I came across this article. Probably not relevant, but interesting. I don't think like a criminal and am always amazed at how creative people can be when it comes to "making money".

http://www.news-herald.com/general-...st-ohio-ex-sheriffs-appeal-in-corruption-case



This guy was selling county vehicles and forfeited vehicles (probably seized during drug arrests) to a salvage yard, then keeping the cash. I suppose someone could make good money doing this, if they kept "funny" books that weren't audited. Also wonder if other county officials use the same practice to raise "personal" cash - selling forfeited vehicles for salvage. Maybe selling them for a price, but listing a lower value on the books.

ETA: Apparently, former Athens County Sheriff Kelly claimed he used cash from the sale of forfeited vehicles to pay "confidential informants".

https://www.athensnews.com/news/loc...cle_0849f57c-d29f-11e6-a4bb-4fde907ad8b6.html

ETA2: This former Sheriff Kelly guy gets more interesting. He was called to testify in the trial of an elderly man he arrested for growing marijuana on his property. The defendant apparently served as his own attorney and questioned Kelly (who came from prison to testify in court) about how Kelly discovered he was growing MJ, whether the amount confiscated was weighed and about procedures for storing MJ in the evidence room. The implication seems to be that Kelly or officers misrepresented how much was seized and were possibly selling confiscated MJ.

https://www.athensnews.com/news/loc...cle_48230fc0-e8a8-11e6-8e86-ab04d6610dbb.html

Again, not saying Kelly was involved in the Rhoden murders, he was in jail at the time. But it makes you wonder if his activities and methods are similar to those of LE in other areas of SE Ohio. Wonder if some LE have been playing these games with MJ growers in SE Ohio for a long time. JMO.

I do know that most County LE contract out for towing services. You know, the cars you see along the road that have had some kind of mechanically problem were they won't start, flat tire, have been tagged. The towing service, tows the cars to the county compound/parking lot and after awhile, if no one claims them they are sold at a county action. I just assumed that the monies from the sales went back to the county.

 

[amauet1]

http://www.ohioattorneygeneral.gov/...BCI/Pike-County-Final-Autopsies-REDACTED.aspx

I’ve re-read it again. The only victim I see a fresh contusion on is CRjr, noted to the left elbow and left forearm.

Am I missing something? The redaction is significant and even redacts terms that are not abnormal.

I remember something about GR having busted knuckles and FR was not found at home as the rest were listed as found at home. There was something about CRsr and his spine and he had had some kind of surgery, which left stitches that desolve in the body.

 

[RichP]

The Manleys, esp. LM, have been so up front and open with the news media, I don't see them as suspects. They've been investigated inside and out for 2 yrs with nothing to show for it. There is also no motive.We've been over this dozens of times I'm really tired of talking about it and honestly think it distracts us from focusing on more likely suspects.

Nothing personal, no offense. I just refuse to discuss them any longer. Maybe it would work best if we avoid discussing the Manleys as suspects one way or another unless someone comes up with some new evidence related to them. How does that sound? Is that something we can all work with?

Betty,

A HUGE agree with.

It also applies to so many other people [such as the W's] and theories. We are chasing our tails. Unless there is something definitely new can we all agree to stop rehashing the same old tired theories and suspects [probably not].

I know ALL of you care very deeply about this case and you should be commended for that because LE sure as heck doesn't. If we could do as suggested it sure would clean up a lot of "clutter".

Now you can beat me to death.

You are all good people,

Rich

 

[Bootsctr]

I'll start with FR and CR2, then maybe tackle the big guys after. Any volunteers for those? Maybe we could make CR1, GR and KR a team project.

Also, feel free to add photos, maps, etc. that may be of help.

I can do FR if you like Betty. I already started a document for him.

 

[amauet1]

IANAL, but an option the surviving family members could eventually pursue is hiring a good attorney to file a civil lawsuit against the Wagner family, specifically JW, charging them with wrongful death. It worked in the case of Rebecca Zahau, in that if compelled LE to release their files and testify under oath in depositions. Good way to finally learn the details. It's civil, not criminal, but it's a way to break open a case and get outside experts to review it.

Worked in the OJ Simpson trial also, remember the "ugly shoes" he would never have worn? And bam, they had a picture of him wearing them.

 

[Betty P]

I do know that most County LE contract out for towing services. You know, the cars you see along the road that have had some kind of mechanically problem were they won't start, flat tire, have been tagged. The towing service, tows the cars to the county compound/parking lot and after awhile, if no one claims them they are sold at a county action. I just assumed that the monies from the sales went back to the county.

The article also refers to "seized" cars, so possibly some that were confiscated in drug related arrests. Ohio has changed their laws to make seizure by LE more difficult, but that sheriff's crimes went back several years.

The whole thing seemed interesting because of the relationships of local LE with people who buy salvage cars and fix them up. Just wondered if, among other things, CR1 noticed something irregular if he ever bought cars from any LE in local counties. Maybe he had information on people that they didn't want him to know. Also interesting in the other article were implications that Kelly was shaking down local MJ growers and re-selling the MJ they confiscated.

 

[Bootsctr]

I remember something about GR having busted knuckles and FR was not found at home as the rest were listed as found at home. There was something about CRsr and his spine and he had had some kind of surgery, which left stitches that desolve in the body.

I had not heard this about FR. I'm scouring the media thread though.

 

[Betty P]

I can do FR if you like Betty. I already started a document for him.

Thanks! I'll do CR2 then and maybe GR. I would offer to do DR, but I know she had a lot of stuff on Facebook and other social media and I'm always a little reluctant to do much of sleuthing about people I don't know on Facebook. Some of our members here have probably done more searches on the FB posts of DR, poor woman. Some of her posts people have quoted make me so sad.

 

[amauet1]

It is important to protect innocent victims who don’t have the money to fight, I agree with that 100%.

When it comes to the Manley’s, I do not believe they are involved in the murders of their family.

But I do feel like something is askew between text messages, a truck, and another vehicle that can be seen in pics on both W property and the property of LM. I don’t think that’s the M’s fault. I think that’s the W’s doing. I’ve seen that with my own eyes and it’s JMO.

When things don’t add up over and over again, it’s not the adding that’s wrong, it means there’s a factor missing. It makes us talk in circles because none of us can make complete sense of it.

It doesn’t help in any way that LE has released next to nothing. There’s a difference between protecting the integrity of an investigation and creating an illusion to put a smokescreen in the faces of the public.

Example 1- the redacted autopsies. The media reports there’s bruising to some victims. When you look at the autopsies, there’s only one victim with noted bruising outside of the redactions. Then look at the redacted areas-all of the areas where gunshot wounds are located are heavily redacted and I’d guarantee there would be bruising in those areas.

The media has done fabulous reporting, however there are several instances where the media has misconstrued the words in order to get a better story and people have ran it with it.

Maybe you or someone else on here knows the answer to this one because I’ve been wondering this for quite a while. Reader said in the beginning that the families of the victims needed to be concerned for their safety and should arm themselves.

But 911 calls were released not protecting the identity of those who found the victims. Why in the world would those calls have been released with BJM and DS’ names when the sheriff said the surviving family was in danger?

Other car, orange cadi?

 

[MittenScarpetta]

BTW, if you can find and share a photo of the red truck at the W farm, that would be great. I'm pretty sure we've already posted photos of the truck parked at JM's place.

Snipped by me for brevity

It’s not the truck. It’s another vehicle. It can be found on DF social media page, dated 4/11/2016. A second picture that I cannot link because of TOS. However, the same vehicle pictured on 4/11/2016 at Peterson road, is in LM’s driveway parked behind JM’s truck.

What does that mean? I don’t know. It probably means nothing. It’s just another oddity. Especially because that red truck was not in JMs possession until 3/2017. Same vehicle. Two opposing places. At least a year apart.

All are just things I’ve noticed and JMO.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

Other car, orange cadi?

That’s it.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

Thanks! I'll do CR2 then and maybe GR. I would offer to do DR, but I know she had a lot of stuff on Facebook and other social media and I'm always a little reluctant to do much of sleuthing about people I don't know on Facebook. Some of our members here have probably done more searches on the FB posts of DR, poor woman. Some of her posts people have quoted make me so sad.

I’ll do DR. Just a note, her fb is not as open as it once was.

Speaking of her social media, one thing I’ve noticed is the picture of the living room at her new house. Look at the door, when it opens, it would open so the door opens to the right, blocking that hallway or bedroom when the doors open.

When JM opened the door, he would not have been able to see that area of the house to the right (imagine him standing there facing the outside of the door, the door handle would be on his left hand side, swinging to his right when opened) So, IMO wherever he saw Dana’s legs was in the living room/kitchen area. JMO

 

[Betty P]

Snipped by me for brevity

It’s not the truck. It’s another vehicle. It can be found on DF social media page, dated 4/11/2016. A second picture that I cannot link because of TOS. However, the same vehicle pictured on 4/11/2016 at Peterson road, is in LM’s driveway parked behind JM’s truck.

What does that mean? I don’t know. It probably means nothing. It’s just another oddity. Especially because that red truck was not in JMs possession until 3/2017. Same vehicle. Two opposing places. At least a year apart.

All are just things I’ve noticed and JMO.

Ok, I'm still confused. I do wish we knew who owned the red truck before JM. If LE is accurate in their implication that it was used in these crimes (I know, they just made a generic reference), that's very important information.

I also need to go back to my research from last summer on the individuals who were busted after the W farm raids who resided on the elder W families properties.

LE has revealed next to nothing about this case, but there's still a lot we can find on our own. We have to just look at the big picture, so to speak.

 

[Betty P]

I’ll do DR. Just a note, her fb is not as open as it once was.

Speaking of her social media, one thing I’ve noticed is the picture of the living room at her new house. Look at the door, when it opens, it would open so the door opens to the right, blocking that hallway or bedroom when the doors open.

When JM opened the door, he would not have been able to see that area of the house to the right (imagine him standing there facing the outside of the door, the door handle would be on his left hand side, swinging to his right when opened) So, IMO wherever he saw Dana’s legs was in the living room/kitchen area. JMO

Thanks, that's very helpful information. Would it be ok to post the photo here, I wonder?

Bless her heart, I still feel so sad for her. She tried so hard, had just gotten her new home, new grandbaby. She worked so hard for her family. How could those monsters do what they did?

 

[MittenScarpetta]

I remember something about GR having busted knuckles and FR was not found at home as the rest were listed as found at home. There was something about CRsr and his spine and he had had some kind of surgery, which left stitches that desolve in the body.

FR’s location of being found is there but redacted I believe. I’ve never seen such odd things blacked out on autopsies. Honestly, some of the stuff that’s blacked out just makes those who feed off of gossip run rampant on other forums.

It’s often assumed because things are redacted, there must be something there. In all honestly, the redaction appear random and meant to cause confusion. (besides the gunshot wound redactions)

CR1 had mention of a vertebrae fracture on his. Working in the medical field for as long as I have, I see a fracture vertebrae and the fact he was shot in the torso, and come to the conclusion that his spine was fractured from bullets entering his thorax.

He also had skull fractures-consistent with bullet wounds to the head, IMO.

 

[amauet1]

All of this story from DS has never seemed right. No one seems to know KR was taking the day off from his regular job to work on cars except DS. Even his daughter who talked to him regularly thought he was at work. DS bringing someone with him that afternoon could make a great excuse and witness as to why his fresh finger prints and DNA was there. I truly believe he was there earlier and came back. Maybe he helped himself to some things he knew no one would miss. I don't know if it was the night before or that morning, but I think he knew KR was dead when they pulled in to check on him. After he knows KR is murdered, he takes the time to wonder around the property before calling 911? He had no concern that the murder(s) could still be there? Did he know they were not?
I've wondered from early on that KR's death was a separate crime from the other seven.

As far as motives go, could CR1 have borrowed money from a shady lender and used it to buy DR's home instead of what he was supposed to use it for?

Didn't I read somewhere or maybe on one of the video's that, Stacie Rigsby, ( KR's ex and Luke's mother) sent DS and Luke and a driver to go check on KR? Why would a mother send her son to find his father possibly dead? Why didn't she go with him?

 

[amauet1]

I have to disagree that the surviving Rhoden and Manley family members are trying to protect the killers. What evidence have you seen that indicates they are protecting the killers? What possible motive would they have for doing that?

JMO, the deceased victims were the only ones who could have identified the killers. That's why so many of them were killed - so no surviving family member could know or guess who they are and come after them.

Betty please stop this. I said family and friends are protecting the murderers. I did not mention any names.​ Thank you.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

Thanks, that's very helpful information. Would it be ok to post the photo here, I wonder?

Bless her heart, I still feel so sad for her. She tried so hard, had just gotten her new home, new grandbaby. She worked so hard for her family. How could those monsters do what they did?

I was wondering if I could post it. I can’t link it because it’s a ss and 95% of her fb is locked down now. I’ll post, mods if not allowed, please delete. The first one is from DR’s sm, the 2nd One is from her flipagram.