GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #61

[dixiegirl1035]

The interrogation videos are reasons one million and fifty to always shut up and ask for an attorney. . No way you can outsmart experienced detectives. Especially when you’re a guilty, family killing liar. And idiot to boot.

I think law enforcement in Colorado learned quite a bit with the JonBenet case.

 

[WhatDidYouDo]

I do think they were throwing theories at the wall hoping something would stick. I think the first and most important objective of that interview was to get him to tell them where the bodies are and it didn't really matter what manner of death he confessed to in that moment. If accident or SW being responsible is what would lead them to the bodies, they would run with that...for the moment. They even said they could talk more after they get the girls.

 

[mrjitty]

However, to be quite honest her “vocal fry” has nothing to do with the fact that she showed little emotion in the interview...which was more concerning to me.

I think she showed lots of emotion - but because we have no video we don't have all the cues

For me there was lots of anger and feeling sorry for herself.

I think its not surprising that her strongest emotions relate to herself and to SW as she did not directly know the victims.

Therefore her horror at the crime manifests in anger and disgust at Watts

 

[scdiv]

Geez. That is a really good catch. I don't know that I would have noticed that. "Did you tell mom yet?"

But maybe it was about something else?

I may be stretching. It just seems like one other unfathomable thing- that Ronnie knew they were all dead before the interview? Holy smoke.

One thing I was thinking is that Ronnie is used to bailing out his son. We know that what CW was saying to his dad was a lie. So he would have no reason to correct him when he supplied "facts." And maybe RW was just leading him.

At the least it seems he knew his son was lying.

But that one statement. It's hard to get past that. Combined with RW's
overall lack of strong reaction and supplying him with "facts"...Hmmm.

Who was it last thread who brought this all out? It does seem RW knew.

Agreed. In just reading the transcripts, I felt like CW was still going along with the charade of "they're missing" to his father on the drive to the airport. But I don't know, after watching the video and hearing his father, it does seem like they could be trying to get his story straight. Especially clarifying or correcting "choking" and "smothering."

Also @PommyMommy, I have listened so many times and I still can't figure out exactly what is being said at 41:10-ish. CW seemed to intentionally lower his voice around that point. It does sound like RW said, "So you really think this is going to work?" and then launches into trying to get the story straight again. I guess it could have been something about CW going to work, but that doesn't seem to fit.

 

[mrjitty]

I do think they were throwing theories at the wall hoping something would stick. I think the first and most important objective of that interview was to get him to tell them where the bodies are and it didn't really matter what manner of death he confessed to in that moment. If accident or SW being responsible is what would lead them to the bodies, they would run with that...for the moment. They even said they could talk more after they get the girls.

yep. Get him to confess to some felonies. Worry about the rest later.

In the end the confession is gold in any trial.

 

[gitana1]

About NK’s Vocal Fry:
Are we policing young women’s voices?
From Upspeak To Vocal Fry: Are We 'Policing' Young Women's Voices?
There are specific ways to make women shut up.
Stop telling women how they should talk
Ridiculing vocal fry is sexist.
This Is Why Ridiculing Vocal Fry Is Sexist

I know some REALLY want to make the disgust about NK about sexism. It's just not. IMO. People have been criticizing CW's speech from day one. Relentlessly. Is that because of sexism against him?

Men have vocal fry and upseak too and it drives me crazy.

But other than being annoyed, I don't give a damn about her voice. I give a damn about her inflection, arrogance, evasivessness, self-centeredness and overall lack of empathy in the context of a major crime investigation.

I wish people would please stop accusing others of being sexist because they do not like this woman or condone her actions. To me it's a disingenuous way of trying to undermine other's opinions of this woman. We disagree. That's okay. It's not like people are creating scenarios or making things up about this woman out of left field based on nothing but innuendo and rumor, like was done with Shannan. Then I might question the motives. But here I think there are solid bases for the disdain, even though people can have different views about it. No need to continually accuse people of sexism to prove their opinions are wrong here.

I find it offensive.

 

[mrjitty]

I may be stretching. It just seems like one other unfathomable thing- that Ronnie knew they were all dead before the interview? Holy smoke..

I would love to know what conversations happened between LE & Ronnie while he was waiting to come in?

 

[curiouschat]

I don't understand how blasting someone for a vocal fry is any different from say if someone had an English accent. No one just has the voice they were born with. Everyone has some kind of vocal affectation influenced by everyone they've been surrounded by all their lives and I'm pretty sure accents change through time (meaning I don't think someone from a given region 100 years ago is going to have the same accent of someone today).

 

[gitana1]

yep. Get him to confess to some felonies. Worry about the rest later.

In the end the confession is gold in any trial.

And they really wanted to find the bodies and ANY solid reason to keep him locked up.

 

[MollyDDD]

Did Chris and Ronnie discuss what happened on the ride from the airport?
Discovery pg 605 (pg 538)
Chris asked to speak with his dad, agents leave the room. Chris tells his story to his dad, agents come back in and discuss then leave again, Ronnie stays with Chris. At this point Chris asks his dad “Did you tell mom yet”. Ronnie answers no.
Ronnie has not left the room, when did he have a chance to tell Cindy if he didn’t know before he entered the room. I also think it is odd that when Chris said smothered twice Ronnie said “choke or smothered”, why would he question what Chris was saying, was Chris going off script? Maybe I am looking at it with bias but I don’t know why he wouldn’t just accept Chris saying they were smothered. Chris was very close to his father, it is hard to believe he would not confide and seek his advice.

I’ve commented before about the agents technique, how masterful they were. Watching how child like Chris is is both sad and disturbing. The agents knew to approach him as if speaking to a child, soft spoken voices, rubbing his back, constant reassurances.

They are some smooth operators...(enters Sade).

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

I’m still somewhat surprised he didn’t ask for an attorney. I’m glad he didn’t, but still surprised.
jmo

I saw an FBI profiler discuss Chris’s porch interviews, she was very good. As far as his mannerisms she said they were a defensive posture but you would have to see if he had those same mannerisms every day to really know. She seemed objective so I tend to believe her when she said him giving the interviews is unusual and it takes quite a bit of confidence and seeing your self as smarter than everyone else to do that. I wonder if that played into not getting an attorney or trying to act innocent so he does not need one.

 

[MollyDDD]

I would love to know what conversations happened between LE & Ronnie while he was waiting to come in?

Do you think LE has that interrogation room bugged?

 

[MollyDDD]

I saw an FBI profiler discuss Chris’s porch interviews, she was very good. As far as his mannerisms she said they were a defensive posture but you would have to see if he had those same mannerisms every day to really know. She seemed objective so I tend to believe her when she said him giving the interviews is unusual and it takes quite a bit of confidence and seeing your self as smarter than everyone else to do that. I wonder if that played into not getting an attorney or trying to act innocent so he does not need one.

I think Chris was just being Chris, the actor. He certainly fooled a lot of people, especially Shanann.

 

[mrjitty]

The interrogation videos are reasons one million and fifty to always shut up and ask for an attorney. . No way you can outsmart experienced detectives. Especially when you’re a guilty, family killing liar. And idiot to boot.

This is the problem though if you choose the missing person scam. You can't play sad, mystified dad/husband but also refuse to assist the police!

Since the McCann fiasco I know the UK police are all over this, usually embedding a "support team"

They did this in the Becky Watts case - though in that case her parents were innocent, but certainly initially suspects.

Basically it gives you a way of observing the suspects and asking lots of questions without doing a formal interview at the station

Obviously though, if you really did the murder, then you should just get an attorney and say nothing.

 

[AnyaB]

Slightly off topic but the delay in the video made it look like there was a stare down between CW and the female interviewer. (Frequently). Im not sure that was really the case though.

My take is that he believes that looking in people’s eyes is a sign of truthfulness. He may be also be trying to assess if she believes him or not. He mimics human behaviour but it’s clear he’s far from skilled as evidenced by his sniffle when she points out that she finds it weird that he hasn’t cried in two days. He truly has no clue how to ‘act’.

 

[mrjitty]

And they really wanted to find the bodies and ANY solid reason to keep him locked up.

Yes. Clock is ticking.

I think it is completely understandable that you take any confession you can get before he lawyers up.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

I saw an FBI profiler discuss Chris’s porch interviews, she was very good. As far as his mannerisms she said they were a defensive posture but you would have to see if he had those same mannerisms every day to really know. She seemed objective so I tend to believe her when she said him giving the interviews is unusual and it takes quite a bit of confidence and seeing your self as smarter than everyone else to do that. I wonder if that played into not getting an attorney or trying to act innocent so he does not need one.

He was so trapped in *walking to the end of the hall* as did FCA, that he could not process how to change a story.

 

[Bravo]

My take is that he believes that looking in people’s eyes is a sign of truthfulness. He may be also be trying to assess if she believes him or not. He mimics human behaviour but it’s clear he’s far from skilled as evidenced by his sniffle when she points out that she finds it weird that he hasn’t cried in two days. He truly has no clue how to ‘act’.

Welcome to WS

 

[WhatDidYouDo]

The porch interview scenario is so weird. I was convinced Elizabeth Smart's Dad was guilty from his pleas. I'm not sure they're helpful at all.

 

[opalonyx]

Killers definitely don't think like the rest of us. I get the sense from CW objecting the girls were alive in the tanks, that he somehow views smothering as more humane? Like people taking a sick dog to the vet to "put it out of its misery". And when they described Bella fighting back, he seemed somewhat affected.

Maybe in his mind, killing them wasn't heinous if it was done in their sleep and he's just bothered by Bella having been more aware. That, or he just was affected by how it looks to the world that he's a lying, cheating baby killer. Someone said he looked like a little boy at the principal's office, embarrassed that he humiliated himself and his parents. I agree.

In any case, the perplexity of CW's thought process reminded me of BTK killer. When BTK had slaughtered almost an entire family, the little girl still alive, asked him what will happen to her and he said "you'll soon be in heaven with the others". Before that, he claims he propped up the father victim's head with a pillow because he had recently been in a car accident. Soon after, he killed him. There's just no logic. Then again, maybe he lied. But it doesn't make sense to rational, empathetic people in any case.