GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #62

[Jessthinkin]

Yes, LE stated in the documents that his behavior and comments were innapropriate and that he lacked empathy. They said he kept crossing his arms, etc. I'm sure that they suspected him immediately.
Also you would think as soon as he entered the home he would call out, "hello? Shanann?! Girls? Are you here?" Instead he runs through the house in a panic like he wants to hide evidence before they see it. So painfully obvious. In that video he looks like a guilty high school kid who knows he got caught doing something very bad.
I remember the VI explained his behavior in the interviews as being nervous, and not guilty, because she had seen him like that before. Of course he was nervous. He had just killed his entire family. But in that video I think the guilt is all over his face. Imo

I also remember from one of his porch interviews that he said after he’d gotten the police call he sped home from work, running through red lights/stop signs, etc. I bet he did!!! Maybe he prioritized the damning evidence he’d have to get rid of immediately, so he ran down the stairs to the basement first, and then up to the master bedroom... Doh... I gotta believe at least a small part of him knew he was dead man walking at that point...

 

[molly1255]

In rewatching the discussion with RW and CW. The whole family lacks appropriate emotion and responses.

The picture of Bella and CeCe is right in front of RW. Why isn’t he screaming and pleading with Chris. Tell me where the babies are. Tell us the truth. We need to know! Etc.

But no. Nothing. I feel like the insane one.

JMO, I suspect RW has had a lot of experience handling CW when he was younger, making excuses for him and telling him "we love you no matter what, son".

 

[human]

I think because she was assertive, and very capable of directing him and doing things for him just like his parents probably did. She herself said she was the dominant one. I'm thinking he saw his mother as running his life for him too. Telling him what to do and making it known what she did or didn't want him to do. Imo

Apparently she was very needy when he met her, though.

People are saying that he wanted to ditch her when she became strong.

I do not see any consistent analysis on here.

 

[mrjitty]

No. This actually jibes with her account that he told her he was getting a divorce.

She claims that she was dating him because his marriage was over, this backs up her story.

She wasn’t concerned about a married man leaving his wife, as that was apparently a foregone conclusion.

Agreed

While speculation is fun, we now have so much on the table, it's time to follow the evidence.

Similarly it's unlikely she knew about the pregnancy. This is why Watts didn't mention it in his TV interview, then told her it was someone else's.

These things actually all fit together quite well, and reveal how Watt's had built a house of cards by lying to everyone.

 

[pinkie60]

We're only seeing what the media is editing and releasing. I imagine there is video of him actually being arrested before this clip. Maybe we will see it. I also know the pod people groups have submitted their own CORA requests, so we'll see if someone outside of MSM gets a hold of the materials and uploads them.

 

[The Farm]

Wow did Bella look just like him or what?

I am neither a psychologist or physiatrist but this has entered my mind because she did look so much like him. And Cece did too but not as much as Bella.
And this makes no sense but I wonder if he was able to do such an act because he really wanted to kill himself and it made it easier because they looked like him? We know he should have offed himself but he was to chicken to do that plus he had a new exciting life to go to.
But it makes me wonder how you can kill your children especially in such a personal way as he did.

 

[NuttMegg]

But that would require us to believe this was spontaneous, wouldn’t it? I think there is plenty of evidence to support that this was premeditated. IMO he made this decision on Friday, if not earlier when he did a 180 pretending he’d go away for the weekend with her and told her to wait until Monday to reveal Niko’s sex

I still think in the back of my brain that he was trying (at first) to get rid of her, but not necessarily the kids. I was thinking that strangling, because of the length of time it takes is therefore "premeditated"(?) As others have mentioned, I too have a hard time envisioning him doing something that I myself would not do, ie plan ahead of time to kill my family. I'm sure everyone will correct me, but I am under the impression that "premeditated" can really involve a pretty short amount of time.

 

[Mellowmelly]

Apparently she was very needy when he met her, though.

People are saying that he wanted to ditch her when she became strong.

I do not see any consistent analysis on here.

I didn’t interpret it as SW being needy, IMO she was vulnerable as she was ill, and not long divorced. She said herself in one of her videos that she pushed him away at first. She was vulnerable, the perfect target for a predator like him. How dare he do this to her after he’s the one who pursued her.

 

[Jessthinkin]

Did anyone see the "head of a rake" in the drone footage at this link?

Watts gave mistress cards, love letters in weeks leading up to murders

I also don’t see the sheet, so maybe time (before arrest) is inaccurate (?)

 

[Tortoise]

I think the evidence of him agreeing to be there for Bella's school registration and then texting his colleague to say he would be going straight out to the oil site and it wouldn't need two of them to go, is enough for me to conclude he premeditated all their deaths.

 

[Tuliptiptoe]

I still think in the back of my brain that he was trying to get rid of her, but not necessarily the kids. I was thinking that strangling, because of the length of time it takes is therefore "premeditated"(?) As others have mentioned, I too have a hard time envisioning him doing something that I myself would not do, ie plan ahead of time to kill my family. I'm sure everyone will correct me, but I am under the impression that "premeditated" can really involve a pretty short amount of time.

I think he absolutely had no love for his kids and planned to kill them.

If he'd only planned to kill SW, but found himself in a position where he "had" to kill his daughters we should see signs of remorse.

He was able to guzzle Gatorade and watch videos of his daughters playing knowing full well where they were.

He was able to describe dropping them in a tank by their wrists and then eat pizza.

His family members were objects to him, just like his fancy security system and favorite tshirt. He found a new shiny object and disposed of the old.

Moo

 

[Mentalheadslap2018]

Perhaps he brought the first girl in the basement so if there was any noise, it wouldn't arouse the other and then he would have to manage both girls awake.

Once one child was gone, it didn't matter if the other one made noise while struggling.

I think they were killed in their beds, but the dog alerting the basement does make it seem that something happened down there....so maybe it was one of the girls?

jmo

Yeah it just continues to boggle my mind. At first I did wonder if he went into some kind of steroids/super caffeine over dose rage but then watching his interview with police like damn I don't know /what/ is with that guy. I keep thinking he has some form of autism and I don't know what else. I feel like he must really compartmentalize and almost convince himself the lies are reality but I'm just grasping at straws because none of it makes sense to me. I would never, without knowing what happened and all the evidence and watching the interviews after the fact, peg him for a guy who might murder his whole family.

Earlier in the case, I did wonder if Shanann actually did snap and kill the kids but watching his interview and awkward covering, yeah I don't think so. I do wonder if he won't face that he "hurt" them from the way he phrased things -- like he wanted to believe he gave them a painless death somehow? Some of his denials seem to emphasize not "hurting" them. Again, I may be really stretching but its all so weird.

I can see how people are questioning if his dad is coaching him too but I just don't think so. Again maybe I'm trying to make as much slightly less horrifying sense of it as I can and not wanting to think even more people were involved in this, but I still think it's possible for them to have had their own reasons to be doubtful of Shanann and want to believe their son. She doesn't have to have always been perfect, chill and easy to live with angel to still be a tragic victim in this. Like others said, I'd love to read some kind of official psych evaluation of this dude and how a professional would describe him.

"Perhaps he brought the first girl in the basement so if there was any noise, it wouldn't arouse the other and then he would have to manage both girls awake."

I wondered this too. :-(

"I still think it's possible for them to have had their own reasons to be doubtful of Shanann and want to believe their son."

IMO there's a high probability that many of their perceptions regarding Shanann came from or were fed by CW himself, and he is a manipulative, malicious and murderous liar.

 

[ZsaZsa]

IIRC it was in the two hour interrogation video. Towards the end they started telling him they did not believe him and thought the girls were dead before she came home.

They were craftily leading him to admit that HE killed the girls by asking him a question that could only be answered 'before or after'.

 

[katie565]

I still think in the back of my brain that he was trying to get rid of her, but not necessarily the kids. I was thinking that strangling, because of the length of time it takes is therefore "premeditated"(?) As others have mentioned, I too have a hard time envisioning him doing something that I myself would not do, ie plan ahead of time to kill my family. I'm sure everyone will correct me, but I am under the impression that "premeditated" can really involve a pretty short amount of time.

You’re right about the short time needed for premeditation and I guess I expressed my thoughts in a disorganized way. I meant to say his actions on Friday show me he had a plan and it was premeditated at that time or earlier. I also think it would be impossible to play it so cool w/in a couple hours if he spontaneously had to kill his children a couple hours earlier. His coworkers describe him as completely normal, even laughing. The video from when the police show up that afternoon even has him showing duper’s delight. Along with you, I can’t envision planning ahead to kill my family but my interpretation of the evidence is that he did. JMO

 

[Herat]

After viewing his cards and notes to NK, I thought they were very immature. I agree it would have gotten old, and think that she would have dumped him. imo

I hope there aren’t too many of these people either but it is both fascinating and terrifying to imagine. What bothers me most is the thought that CW seemingly changed over the course of a few weeks. How is that possible? Are we all just sitting ducks at the mercy of our significant others’ potential psychosis?? Are any of us really safe from a change of heart by our loved ones??

I realize this sounds neurotic on my part, but I can’t help but wonder about the men I know who share similar traits to CW: quiet, introverted, inexpressive and with domineering mothers. It’s enough to make you sleep with one eye open...or with plenty of Xanax.

It's best to know these kind of people exist and to understand what certain kind of red flags mean:
Love-bombing
Gaslighting
Hoovering
Narcissistic Fuel
Devaluation

When you realize something isn't right, believe your gut and take action to get away

 

[Jessthinkin]

How come we never see letters like this to CW (instead of those bizarre love letters from disturbed individuals):

"Was it worth it, buddy? All that freedom. The sun. Good food. Family. Choice. Nice showers. Soft sheets. Nice toilet paper. Nature. Space. Don't you regret your evil decision? Knowing your life is totally over? Knowing the world is horrified by the ghoul you've become?"

I mean there are solutions to everything. Why couldn't he have gone to a psychologist and said, "I met a woman and I'm obsessed. Addicted. The problem is I'm married with two kids and one on the way. I like my family but I feel empty inside. I need to get out but I don't see a way without bringing shame on my head. What can I do?"

Why wouldn't a person seek help with the problem. Seek a way to work through whatever they're feeling, and find a way out f they need to, before taking such an irreversible step?

It's like these annihilators get on this runaway train of madness. Single minded in their determination that death is the only way out. They seem to lose any ability to reason.

It's endlessly horrifying and fascinating to me.

There was one pretty hateful letter in the document dump calling him Christeen, taunting and vilifying him... not undeservedly.

And I think CW has at least one personality disorder (and seemingly limited IQ) that have the effect of severely limiting his ability to develop coping skills.... IMO

 

[opalonyx]

Apparently she was very needy when he met her, though.

People are saying that he wanted to ditch her when she became strong.

I do not see any consistent analysis on here.

I think part of it is living together as a couple is much different than dating. I think living with her and her making more demands reminded him of being hen-pecked by his mom. When you date, especially when you have an affair, everything is sunshine and daisies. Children, bills, marriage are reality and reality isn't as fun.

Edit: also, NK was bossy about his dreams and goals. He mentioned SW not supporting his fitness stuff . Of course she isn't going to act like NK. She has kids and things to do. She's doesn't have the free time to spend hours on Google and she has lupus. Of course she won't go running with you, imbecile.

 

[NuttMegg]

You’re right about the short time needed for premeditation and I guess I expressed my thoughts in a disorganized way. I meant to say his actions on Friday show me he had a plan and it was premeditated at that time or earlier. I also think it would be impossible to play it so cool w/in a couple hours if he spontaneously had to kill his children a couple hours earlier. His coworkers describe him as completely normal, even laughing. The video from when the police show up that afternoon even has him showing duper’s delight. Along with you, I can’t envision planning ahead to kill my family but my interpretation of the evidence is that he did. JMO

No you didn't expressed your thoughts in a disorganized way, I am just baffled over this case. I am sure he's guilty of killing them all.

 

[MsBetsy]

Apparently she was very needy when he met her, though.

People are saying that he wanted to ditch her when she became strong.

I do not see any consistent analysis on here.

I think he saw her vulnerability as his chance to sweep in, for sure. I don't think it's as simple as him wanting to "ditch her when she became strong." She was always strong. She was just at her most vulnerable when he met her, and he knew it. He enjoyed feeling like the hero.
Over time he likely felt that he wasn't looked at as quite the hero. He said at one time the relationship went down hill as soon as the children were born. He may have felt less important and less loved as her attention would be more directed at the kids. Either way, it's apparent that he wasn't satisfied with the marriage. But he didn't have the skills to communicate that. He just kind of went with the flow. He was always compliant. Never complained.
Then along comes the love of his life. Maybe it was the first time he felt appreciated in a long time.

I think many people have had similar theories and of course there is so much more to it. So I'm not sure what you mean by inconsistent. The same general theory with some variations have been consistent throughout the whole case. Only now that the documents are out, psychologists are talking about it in the news. And they are basically saying everything that we have been saying from the beginning.
Imo

 

[Mellowmelly]

I think the evidence of him agreeing to be there for Bella's school registration and then texting his colleague to say he would be going straight out to the oil site and it wouldn't need two of them to go, is enough for me to conclude he premeditated all their deaths.

I agree, the timing of the text to his colleague tells me he was planning it and that he murdered the girls before SW got home.