Found Deceased UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 #11 *ARREST*

[LastSeenWearing]

Yeah the CCTV seems like LE would be able to track his car movements unless PR knew certain streets to avoid the cameras.

If he managed to get out in the country then unfortunately she could be anywhere.

PR would know the roads to his workplace in Malton very well if he drove there every day, they could be cctv free, rural and very quiet in the early hours allowing plenty of time for him to hide Libbys body somewhere off the beaten track on a route he knows very well. For LE then it would be like searching for a needle in a haystack to find her somewhere between Hull and Malton

 

[Sillybilly]

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[kate2931]

<modsnip>

Any locals know if his commute to Malton would or could be ‘rural’ in parts ?
Perhaps he didn’t even need to go that far out of Hull. And I’m not sure he avoided CCTV purposely either, to have knowledge of every camera may be a little far fetched thus lending weight to the theory he panicked after the opportunity and ensuing assault, arose.

 

[Cherwell]

Emphasis has been on the park and playing fields. Private CCTV may not have been considered or looked at elsewhere. I doubt businesses and private CCTV owners look at the recordings unless they have an incident of their own or are asked.

That would have been included in the initial appeals for sightings of Libby. The spidercam footage is from private CCTV.

 

[LastSeenWearing]

I've not watched spidercam for a while now but I seem to remember a debate as to whether (the person thought to be) PR was wearing shorts or joggers etc. Could he have had spare clothes in the boot so as able to discard some of the eg maybe was wearing shorts but put joggers on over the top (in some of the footage we didn't see). These could then be removed and disposed of.

Must watch it again

He could have had spare clothes with him for the gym he went to. He could therefore have changed his clothes.

 

[AydaAnnaBaiting]

<modsnip>

Any locals know if his commute to Malton would or could be ‘rural’ in parts ?
Perhaps he didn’t even need to go that far out of Hull. And I’m not sure he avoided CCTV purposely either, to have knowledge of every camera may be a little far fetched thus lending weight to the theory he panicked after the opportunity and ensuing assault, arose.

Very much so, very rural en route, our hamlet doesn't have street lights, surrounded by woods and fields, I'm virtually feral!

 

[LastSeenWearing]

Very much so, very rural en route, our hamlet doesn't have street lights, surrounded by woods and fields, I'm virtually feral!

Between 12.09 and 3am PR had plenty of time to drive towards Malton and back on rural roads. Maybe the assault didn't actually take place in the park but in his car enroute to Malton. If he did murder her he could have done it in a quiet rural field or woods and disposed of her there then driven home with no scent in his vehicle for a cadaver dog to find and no sightings of his vehicle on cctv. Enough time for all this!

 

[porkypies]

I wonder why he added the stuff about her throwing herself at him. There must be a reason for that particular angle. Assuming this tale is true, of course. (Maybe she didn't seem to be drunk, so it didn't occur to him to use that as his excuse for having to touch her).

Because he thinks he has been seen or filmed holding onto her, and is covering himself, as is the rest of the statement (if he did say this).

 

[Happylappy101]

That's exactly what I saw in watching the video although I did slow it down (this has been debated here as whether it's a good idea to do that or not). I also thought the way the person entered the car did not seem normal.

Interesting, isn’t it? I haven’t slowed it down, but my immediate recognition when I first saw the video was legs and either a jacket or skirt sticking out at the back. If it’s a skirt sticking out at the back, it’s almost certainly Libby, as that night was freezing in Hull so it would’ve been someone in partying clothes. If it is a skirt we see, considering she was wearing a skirt, in conjunction with the timing and location, I would say it’s almost certainly her. If it’s a jacket we see in the video, it’s not quite so refined. Nevertheless, the style of the jacket is obviously short (somewhat cropped above the rear, as we can see when the legs are bent) and so I would identify it as a stiff fashion jacket; some might say a leather jacket.

 

[AydaAnnaBaiting]

Between 12.09 and 3am PR had plenty of time to drive towards Malton and back on rural roads. Maybe the assault didn't actually take place in the park but in his car enroute to Malton. If he did murder her he could have done it in a quiet rural field or woods and disposed of her there then driven home with no scent in his vehicle for a cadaver dog to find and no sightings of his vehicle on cctv. Enough time for all this!

Yes, as per the Valentines Day murder a fair few years back. The guy murdered his girlfriend in Hull, dumped her near a wood near Malton. Took a fair few weeks to find her, the boyfriend had given a description where she was, still took some finding. CCTV will be better now tho of course, but not a lot once you get on the country roads.

 

[Happylappy101]

Because he thinks he has been seen or filmed holding onto her, and is covering himself, as is the rest of the statement (if he did say this).

(Re him saying she came onto him)

Perhaps to cover his tracks, should her body be found. I’m going out on a limb here.
In a court, if you remain silent at interview but later seek to rely on something which you did not mention in the interview, the jury may be allowed to draw inferences from the silence.
All arrestees are given a copy of the Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984 Codes of Practice when they reach the station, which details a defendant’s right to be silent, amongst other things e.g. a right to a period of 8 hours rest, right to a translator etc). He would have also had access to legal advice (idk if he took it, but it wouldn’t have been denied). He would’ve been aware he didn’t need to say anything.

Assuming he knew that it would harm his defence IF the body was found with evidence of sexual trauma, and he needed to explain it, he may seek to rely on self defence for the murder; or loss of control (and argue he was provoked); or consent for the sexual trauma which would presumably come under a separate charge.

Either way, if he was scared about the body being found, and he had a good lawyer, he would mention in police interview something about her coming onto him to explain the injuries etc. to rely on later without the prosecution alleging he has fabricated his defence.

Am I making sense to anyone?

 

[LastSeenWearing]

Iesting, isn’t it? I haven’t slowed it down, but my immediate recognition when I first saw the video was legs and either a jacket or skirt sticking out at the back. If it’s a skirt sticking out at the back, it’s almost certainly Libby, as that night was freezing in Hull so it would’ve been someone in partying clothes. If it is a skirt we see, considering she was wearing a skirt, in conjunction with the timing and location, I would say it’s almost certainly her. If it’s a jacket we see in the video, it’s not quite so refined. Nevertheless, the style of the jacket is obviously short (somewhat cropped above the rear, as we can see when the legs are bent) and so I would identify it as a stiff fashion jacket; some might say a leather jacket.

That sounds rather like the Libby replica clothes featured in MSM of a short black denim skirt, faux leather jacket and Vans trainers loaned to the police by Topshop!!

 

[lo so]

(Re him saying she came onto him)

Perhaps to cover his tracks, should her body be found. I’m going out on a limb here.
In a court, if you remain silent at interview but later seek to rely on something which you did not mention in the interview, the jury may be allowed to draw inferences from the silence.
All arrestees are given a copy of the Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984 Codes of Practice when they reach the station, which details a defendant’s right to be silent, amongst other things e.g. a right to a period of 8 hours rest, right to a translator etc). He would have also had access to legal advice (idk if he took it, but it wouldn’t have been denied). He would’ve been aware he didn’t need to say anything.

Assuming he knew that it would harm his defence IF the body was found with evidence of sexual trauma, and he needed to explain it, he may seek to rely on self defence for the murder; or loss of control (and argue he was provoked); or consent for the sexual trauma which would presumably come under a separate charge.

Either way, if he was scared about the body being found, and he had a good lawyer, he would mention in police interview something about her coming onto him to explain the injuries etc. to rely on later without the prosecution alleging he has fabricated his defence.

Am I making sense to anyone?

But we don't know what he told LE. He appears to have told his wife/family that she came onto him, but he could just as easily have told LE they had consensual sex in the park (used the excuse that she was upset but didn't seem that drunk to him, or something along those lines) and he left her sitting in the park.

 

[Plod]

That is food for thought ..why say she made a pass at him if he knew she was not alive to tell the tale[/
Deleted

 

[Eleanor Rigby]

If PR's English isn't that great (translator in court - but then again I'm English and don't understand half of the legal terms) how would a LS, drunk, understand him?

Maybe the whole night was a massive misunderstanding...

Most young adults learn simple conversational English in a year to a year-and-a-half when they're living in an English-speaking country and interacting with English speakers. That's sufficient to talk about getting a ride, going for a drink, flirting, etc. Understanding legal language, as you rightly point out, is at the complete opposite end of the language proficiency spectrum. Of course, he would need an interpreter for that, and even then, if he isn't well educated in Polish, he's going to have a hard time comprehending the meaning of the Polish translation if it's strictly the legal terminology. To actually comprehend the legal charges, he would need to have them explained in Polish, not just translated. I'm not at all surprised he had a blank expression if the charges were not explained in Polish before his court appearance. Hopefully, he will have gotten an explanation in Polish, outside of the court appearance. For example, I remember (what appeared to be) native English speakers here asking if "outraging public decency" meant public intoxication. So if you don't understand the legal term in your native language, having it translated from English to your native language doesn't really help. MOO.

 

[Newthoughts]

I expect we've all watched the HS cctv, aware of timings stated and seen/told the length of time this male was present, the same male we likely believe was driving a car that Libby got in. Personally, I feel there was time to "show" himself at the bench and there was time for thought. You could possibly say he was worried, but, didn't dare approach her initially incase he would be incriminated, it's possible. It's possible he just wished to know where she lived, so he could stand in the vicinity holding his penis in his right hand. However, in my opinion if you feel his intentions were to do more than "show" himself, how could he do this and be sure that it, whatever it was, remained a secret. That is relying upon a vulnerable young lady, presumably as a stranger, to either consent or not. Either way, is a risk to a married man with, it will seem, incriminating things to keep well hidden. Would a flash or a fumble be worth that risk, or was there more thought involved?

More thought or flash and fumble is a difficult one. If you examine a degree of premeditation looking at where he's parked in the spidercam footage is a good starting point. And when.

It's looks quiet. Dark. Residential enough to hope there is no CCTV. It's close to home.

It's off Cottingham Road where the uni is. There is campus accommodation and student houses on Cottingham road and all around that location. There is a bus stop near the bench area where Libby was last seen.

I can imagine it's a regular short cut for the Cottingham road students and it's close to observe students going elsewhere from the bus.

There are student nights at local clubs. Piper's is on Newlands Ave. Lots of studenty nights out there. Lots of them would pass Haworth road .

There was a student night at the Welly that night. There is a late bus from the Welly at weekendd. It wasn't running hat night but it's possible Libby and PR thought it was. Either way there would be soon be an influx of students

His forays to the Ella street area are 26th December and people have mentioned other possible sightings there but they are in summer. When there are no students about

Haworth is a good location to park for his Wellesley wank and observing Ventnor street residents (last burglary).

It hinges on whether he parked there randomly after spotting Libby or whether he's parked there before. Whether he randomly whips his knob out when seeeing young females or plans to wait in places where they're likely to be. If he waits he might think about a next step and plan. It might get more exciting for him.

We don't really know tho. Without more info

 

[Newthoughts]

That is food for thought ..why say she made a pass at him if he knew she was not alive to tell the tale

To explain scratches? Blood stains? Items of clothing even? It's an odd comment to make. There are lots of better excuses for getting Libby out of the car before she got home. Fear she'd be sick being a good one

I hadn't heard there were visible scratches

 

[bos]

JMO
Here is a scenario I have been wondering about which could explain why her body has not been found near the park.

If we assume the video shows PR putting LS inside his car and heading towards the park, what if they parked near the park but neither of them ever left the car. Suppose by the time PR had parked, LS had passed out and so PR decides to get in his perverted flashy mode while she is sleeping, and he gets half undressed. He then has to wake her to get his thrill and she of course wakes up and sees what he is doing and starts screaming and since this is the first close encounter he has had in a tight enclosed place where he cannot just run away himself, he then strangles her right in the car.

Then he proceeds to drive to the Humber river where that rumored cell phone signal may have placed him.

Just been thinking of this today as up until now I always assumed LS had gotten out of the car at some point, but maybe she never did until a deep river deposit by PR.

Why the forensic inspection of the park bench in the dark after he was arrested? How does that fit? Not being aggressively dismissive btw, just wonder what you think provoked that?

 

[jamjim]

What gets me about the 'inside' knowledge that people post on the Hull Live FB page, is that it's normally come from someone's wife's brother's cousin's sister's friend.

 

[Inspecthernightly]

This maybe wrong but did I read where they have him back home around 3am ish? And if that time is right and he picked her up after 12:30 ish? Then how far could he travel to and back in 2 1/2 hours.

That seems like an awful long time to be just at the park. If those times are about right, it does indicate some traveling doesnt it?

If were going by spidercam PR picked up libby around 12 08ish didnt he? Left howarth/cott rd ju ction at 12 10 then 4 min journey to park or thats my understanding