GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #70

[Steelhead]

Honestly, after being married for awhile, intimate life can get stale as all of us that have been married for a few years know. SW had some health issues, recently had a surgery, and dealt with chronic pain. Having health issues makes it hard to have sex at a moment's notice all of the time (I have chronic pain too). Chris was probably in shock that NK wanted to have so much sex. However, that is pretty common in brand new relationships when there is a lot of "romantic fireworks" and lust. I don't think NK wanting to have sex all of the time is abnormal for someone that's in a brand new relationship. Chris seems to emphasize how he felt like "himself", "in control", and with someone who wanted sex "all of the time". I think he liked how NK brought his ego up. He felt important. I don't blame NK because she didn't kill anyone. She's not all "roses" but she has not committed a crime and has had to suffer public and professional humiliation. I blame CW. CW did this to his family. CW could have stopped it and did not. CW could have chosen to get professional medical help for his problems. Chris is a very bad person.

I'm still listening to the audio and CW has not yet given a reason that makes anyone feel any sort of closure for why he annihilated his family. I am still confused. I have been actually more upset and baffled after finding out how Bella died. She suffered. She saw everything. She said "Daddy NO". I have never been this traumatized personally by a case as I have with this one. Chris is an evil man.

Chris attacked an murdered not only his wife but little children. This grown man attacked and murdered a toddler who begged him, "NO". That is on another level of evil to me.

I agree with you regarding NK. I would really like to see this thread stay focused on CW but for some reason it keeps veering back to bashing NK, as if she is to blame somehow. I don’t understand it.

 

[TheVic]

Thank you!

You are welcome. I figured you would like the summary version instead of the verbatim version so that you can miss out on his giggle and on his "like...like...like..."

 

[WhimsicalWillow]

I agree with you regarding NK. I would really like to see this thread stay focused on CW but for some reason it keeps veering back to bashing NK, as if she is to blame somehow. I don’t understand it.

Thank you. I agree... CW made his decision. CW was the married man. CW could have stopped this and should have.

Morally, NK should have stopped seeing CW until he got a divorce but we aren’t arguing this. NK did not commit a crime. NK had no idea Chris was going to kill Shanann and the kids to be with her.

Chris Watts is the criminal. I don’t see what bashing NK and talking about her has to do with anything because it won’t help anyone reach any sort of closure. Chris is to blame.

 

[MsBetsy]

Thank you. I agree... CW made his decision. CW was the married man. CW could have stopped this and should have.

Morally, NK should have stopped seeing CW until he got a divorce but we aren’t arguing this. NK did not commit a crime. NK had no idea Chris was going to kill Shanann and the kids to be with her.

Chris Watts is the criminal. I don’t see what bashing NK and talking about her has to do with anything because it won’t help anyone reach any sort of closure. Chris is to blame.

Yes, if we were to condemn every woman who had an affair with a married man, I think that would be an awful lot of women! It's a lot more common than people think.
I also don't think it's unusual for women to know the married man has a wife and children. It usually doesn't take long to find out, and many are in denial or are led to believe the man will leave them.
And then there are those who don't care if he leaves them or not. They consider married men to be "safe." They don't have to worry about the relationship getting serious, and feel free to date other men. I'm pretty sure NK did that very thing.
Morally, what she did was wrong. But she had no involvement in the murder, that's clear. Imo

 

[kaykay543]

<modsnip: rumor>

I will never believe that CW had a 20 min conversation with SW while straddling her. IMO that never happened. None of what he said is true about her coming home having sex etc. Its all BS. There is no possible way all of that happened in the limited amount of time there was. He just made all of this up so it wouldn't look premeditated.

For some reason he really does not want anyone (especially his family) to know that this was all planned out.

 

[LenaFromNola]

That is the best news I’ve had this week!!

Unfortunately, Kay’s group is now back under a different name. They have removed all the most egregious Shanann-bashing memes and posts, I’m guessing they were dinged because of all the reporting to Facebook that I, and I’m sure others, were doing. They also have a new group rule, “no name-calling or victim bashing” but we will see how much that is upheld. So far I’ve only seen them kick someone out for bashing CW, and the snide Shanann comments continue.

 

[mtnlites]

IMO, this is partly because he is the one telling the story and can frame it any way he likes, and partly because he may not have the insight into his marriage or his emotions to know exactly what made him so angry at her. Reading between the lines of what he’s then and now, and how he’s acted, speaks to a lot of resentment to me, even if he hadn’t explicitly expressed it.

And to me it sounded like he'd disconnected from his actions. I didn't get resentment. I can see how someone would, and I think he does hold quite a bit of anger, but I also think his nonchalance is partly due to the fact that he's created this persona, this "good guy" act that he, himself, has even started buying.

 

[mtnlites]

All h*** broke out at the prison when his interviews went public. CW is back to solitary for now as prisoners were wanting to kill him again. So I guess the new prison is not so great for CW anymore.

I will never believe that CW had a 20 min conversation with SW while straddling her. IMO that never happened. None of what he said is true about her coming home having sex etc. Its all BS. There is no possible way all of that happened in the limited amount of time there was. He just made all of this up so it wouldn't look premeditated.

For some reason he really does not want anyone (especially his family) to know that this was all planned out.

The one thing I kept thinking when he would reference the "20-minute convo" that he supposedly had with SW while straddling her is that, for me, at 15 weeks I couldn't even lie still for 20 minutes. That's around the time that everything started getting uncomfortable.

 

[LenaFromNola]

CW knew there were cameras at the neighbor's house. He certainly wouldn't want the camera picking up his daughters getting into the pickup. If they were already dead and he carried them into the pickup with a blanket, and the camera picked this up, he could claim he was loading a sleeping bag or something. I don't believe they were alive when they left the house. If they were alive, his killing them was premeditated. What was he going to do? Bury their mom and bring the girls back to the house????

Kind of interesting that he came around to the camera side and loaded a gas can. It was easier to load the gas can from the other side, but he wanted to be on camera loading his gas can.

From what I recall from the first document dump (which seems like a billion trillion years ago), the neighbor used to have his camera pointed more toward the street in front of their house. CW knew this because he had asked to look at the neighbor’s footage when someone broke into his truck parked on the street. Since that time, the neighbor repositioned the camera to monitor his entire driveway and therefore part of CW’s, but CW didn’t know that. Hence the extreme panic when he saw the neighbor’s cam had caught him loading the truck.

 

[MsBetsy]

<modsnip: rumor>

I will never believe that CW had a 20 min conversation with SW while straddling her. IMO that never happened. None of what he said is true about her coming home having sex etc. Its all BS. There is no possible way all of that happened in the limited amount of time there was. He just made all of this up so it wouldn't look premeditated.

For some reason he really does not want anyone (especially his family) to know that this was all planned out.

Yes, I wonder if he felt betrayed after the investigators led him to believe the interview was only between him and them. I hope so!
The master of deception gets deceived!
I hope he is feeling the effects and reactions from everyone.
I don't know about the whole having sex, sleeping, then having another conversation story but I do think he straddled her before he killed her to keep her defenseless. It was at that point in his story when he said maybe "it was implanted in my mind that I was going to do it." In other words, he knew exactly what he intended to do.
He obviously was trying very hard in the interview to avoid any accountability.
I think he has removed all doubt that his actions were well thought out and planned, as well as intentional.
I can't imagine there is anyone who believes he became enraged and lost control due to some trigger, except maybe his family. Imo

 

[borndem]

I don't think he cared about the whole power trip, or having the four of them together. He's not the sharpest tool in the shed. I think after he killed S he just wanted to get her out of the house as quickly as possible. I do wonder why though, once he was at the site, why did he kill Cece right in the back seat next to Bella? You would think he might have taken her out of the truck, more room, more convenient for him, wouldn't have any mess in the truck ( sucked just typing that!).
but poor Bella... Why did he make her watch her beloved baby sister die? It makes no sense, ( not that any of this does!), unless he planned to just kill them both in rapid succession, ( is the only thing I could come up with as a possibility), but for some reason he couldn't do both?

bbm
He simply did not give a damn.
IMO. SMH

 

[Sheenaisapunkrocker]

He was closer to a covert Narc, imo, an introverted narcissistic ...Here's a good article desribing those traits.
What Is an Inverted Narcissist and 7 Traits That Describe Their Behavior
"Below, there are some traits that explain the behaviour of an inverted narcissist:

• has major difficulties in making decisions on everyday issues and if s/he does not receive any advice and encouragement from others, may experience episodes of anxiety.
• s/he needs others to take responsibility for most of the important aspects of life.
• has difficulty expressing their disagreement with others due to the fear of losing the support and approval (not to mention the fear of punishment).
• he or she has difficulty in starting their own projects independently or in planning their own activities. This happens due to a lack of confidence in their abilities, not because of a lack of motivation or energy.
• excessive efforts to get support and protection from others, even going to the point where they volunteer for unpleasant activities.
• s/he feels uncomfortable or helpless when alone, because of the exaggerated fear that s/he is incapable of taking care of her/himself.
• as soon as s/he ends a relationship, s/he seeks to establish another relationship that could provide support and protection."

There's a lot more info at the link. Not every single trait fits CW but it's close.

I'll take a classic straight up Narc over a covert any time, any place. You don't know what a covert narc is really like until you see the patterns. By then, you're probably in a committed relation-shyte with them. And everyone thinks they're the best thing since sliced bread and you're the "crazy" one. Even now people are insisting CW was such a nice guy and Shannan was the villain. See how that works?
IMO

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

I think we also have to remember that in addition to CW's family trying to poison his mind against SW, NK was doing the same. Here she was creeping on SW's social media and using that information to plant seeds in his mind. An example is when she said their house was way too much house. She and CW could have a small ranch style house. She took the known stressors and masterfully made SW the source of all the problems while she (NK) would be the answer to all his problems. You know, CW's mom and NK were so much alike and they were both shouting in his ears.

I wonder how long CW and NK 's relationship would have lasted anyway before it burned itself out. Would CW have ended up killing her too? Hmmm.

 

[Sheenaisapunkrocker]

I wonder how long CW and NK 's relationship would have lasted anyway before it burned itself out. Would CW have ended up killing her too? Hmmm.

Interesting. Because NK was already picking out his food and finding apartments for him. Once the hot sex wore off, he surely would've been even more miserable. Especially if they had a few kids and he was back to diaper duty and nuking chicken nuggets for dinner.
So, if he was "lucky" enough to get away with it once, why not twice?

 

[Gardenista]

‘I Felt My Daughter’s Spirit The Moment She Died,’ Says Mom Of Colorado Murder Victim, Shan’ann Watts

https://www.drphil.com/videos/i-felt-my-daughters-spirit-the-moment-she-died-says-mom-of-colorado-murder-victim-shanann-watts/

 

[NuttMegg]

‘I Felt My Daughter’s Spirit The Moment She Died,’ Says Mom Of Colorado Murder Victim, Shan’ann Watts

https://www.drphil.com/videos/i-fel...-mom-of-colorado-murder-victim-shanann-watts/

IIRC Sandy was on his case first thing Monday morning, saying he put them in oil, generally freaking out for SW/kids safety before even knowing they weren't just visiting friends. Now we know she actually woke up Frank and Frankie to tell them something had happened to her daughter. Normally I'm not the spiritual kind, but I believe Sandy 100% and have so much respect for her.

 

[Gardenista]

IIRC Sandy was on his case first thing Monday morning, saying he put them in oil, generally freaking out for SW/kids safety before even knowing they weren't just visiting friends. Now we know she actually woke up Frank and Frankie to tell them something had happened to her daughter. Normally I'm not the spiritual kind, but I believe Sandy 100% and have so much respect for her.

Yes, she had a premonition they were in oil - she's very intuitive. It's too bad they taped Dr. Phil prior to them releasing the confession audio because I'd love to hear her take on it.

 

[LittleFleurDeLys]

‘I Felt My Daughter’s Spirit The Moment She Died,’ Says Mom Of Colorado Murder Victim, Shan’ann Watts

‘I Felt My Daughter’s Spirit The Moment She Died,’ Says Mom Of Colorado Murder Victim, Shan’ann Watts | Dr. Phil

I would love to read this article but I'm not allowed to, it says:

Access Denied
You don't have permission to access "‘I Felt My Daughter’s Spirit The Moment She Died,’ Says Mom Of Colorado Murder Victim, Shan’ann Watts | Dr. Phil" on this server.
Reference #18.cae17b5c.1552314584.c6edfa0

Is there any other way to reach it?

 

[margarita25]

Transcript

(Oh PTL there’s a transcript. Thank you)

—-

I would love to read this article but I'm not allowed to, it says:

Access Denied
You don't have permission to access "‘I Felt My Daughter’s Spirit The Moment She Died,’ Says Mom Of Colorado Murder Victim, Shan’ann Watts | Dr. Phil" on this server.
Reference #18.cae17b5c.1552314584.c6edfa0

Is there any other way to reach it?

““I felt my daughter’s spirit, the moment she died,” says Shan’ann’s mother, Sandy Rzucek, who lives in North Carolina. She describes waking up everyone in her house the morning her daughter and grandchildren were killed to tell family members that she felt something was wrong with Shan’ann.

“We didn’t even know she was missing yet,” says Shan’ann’s brother, Frankie, confirming his mother’s account.”

—-

This is by no means the first time I’ve heard about a mother getting a “feeling”. Makes you wonder...

 

[LittleFleurDeLys]

IIRC Sandy was on his case first thing Monday morning, saying he put them in oil, generally freaking out for SW/kids safety before even knowing they weren't just visiting friends. Now we know she actually woke up Frank and Frankie to tell them something had happened to her daughter. Normally I'm not the spiritual kind, but I believe Sandy 100% and have so much respect for her.

Although I could not read the article:
I think we are all in some way connected to each other. A few weeks before our father died (lung cancer - which we didn't know he was suffering from! He just described a "back pain" for several weeks which didn't get any better) my brother and I talked about a really "bad feeling" we both had at the same time. I told him, that I knew that something bad was going to happen to us - I just knew it through a deep and overwhelming feeling, which was bothering me, but I couldn't tell what it actually caused. It wasn't suppressable and wouldn't want to feel this anytime again in my life soon. My brother told me, he had the same or at least a similar feeling. Today I'm sure, that we felt, our father was going to die. I can totally relate to that!