Chase Merritt Charged W/Murder of Joseph, Summer, Gianni and Joe Jr McStay #4

[Lilibet]

What would Summer tell us about those last days, weeks and months leading up to the murders?

That is what was on my mind when I woke up this morning. You see, I experienced a similar dynamic where an abuser tried to dig into my life.

It's insidious, and here is what happens.

Joe, as the victim, is caught between his loyalty to his wife, and his loyalty to his "friend". He'll always be trying to make it right. Trying to mediate. Joe is confused by Summer's hostility to CM. Old "Chase" is a great guy. Everyone likes him but you. Why can't you get on? And to CM. Why wind Summer up like that? You get on with everyone else - you are earning me grief man!

None of this is accidental. The abuser intentionally seeks to damage Joey's relationship with Summer to increase his control over his victim. CM bad mouths Summer and the kids to Joey's family - indeed whenever he can. He poisons people against her.

Joe will begin to resent being piggy in the middle all the time and fight with Summer about Chase. That's what happens. You spend more and more time fighting about this poisonous person in your lives.

Summer doesn't get why Joe can't see it. But here is the truly evil part.

CM shows his real face to Summer. The one Joe never sees. It's not that Summer is way more perceptive than Joe. It is that Chase reveals himself to her. This is why Summer is isolated. Chase is charming to everyone except her. They all know the nice Chase who is down on his luck. She knows the evil guy under the skin.

Summer resents this person in her life. She resents Joe for bringing him into the home. She fights with Joe because he won't listen. Because he's similar to an abused wife. He blames himself. He believes Chase's sob stories. He always hopes for a resolution. A candle of loyalty still burns.

This is where the abuser cranks up the tension. He is always there - including unannounced. He is calling all the time.

He knows the precise grapple points to hook in. The things you share that can't be ignored. Maybe your house project. Maybe your business. Your money.

Always money. Oh how Summer resented the money as she saw Joe get used time and again. Remember its not just Joe's money. They are married. It's her money. It's her money that CM cons. So what better place to stoke up a new conflict than over money?

It can take years to dig out of this abusive cycle. And it is not a straight line process. You can have a year of seemingly better times, before a new crisis hits.

IMO Summer was winning but sadly we can never know what her and Joe decided about Chase. She was silenced. What we do know is that Joe had slashed Chase's role in 2009. What we do know is things were on the up for the McStays. New home, increasing sales, great clients ....

What we do know is the abuser became a heavy presence in their lives in the last weeks

What we do know is he then did something so outrageous that it was certain to cause a huge ruction between Summer and Joe ... Something that would make Summer wildly angry. Something Joe might have to hide from Summer.

What would Summer tell us about those last days and hours? What did she find out? What boundary did she finally draw?

My 02c

I think you have tapped into the truth. I have suspected that Summer told Joey “No more.” I think she knew about Chase’s past and didn’t want him dragging their family down. If Joey finally took a stand against Chase instead of Summer we know that Chase would be furious...mostly at Summer. And the rest is tragic history.

 

[mrjitty]

I think you have tapped into the truth. I have suspected that Summer told Joey “No more.” I think she knew about Chase’s past and didn’t want him dragging their family down. If Joey finally took a stand against Chase instead of Summer we know that Chase would be furious...mostly at Summer. And the rest is tragic history.

Yes.

There is a slip up in Chase's interview which I believe reveals Joey came not to Chick-Fil-A but to Chase's house. In my opinion they had a verbal fight. Joey went home and told Summer. Then he called Chase. Then Chase turned his phone off and drove over in a rage.

CM: Absolute the last time I talked to him, the last time I talked to him was, was on that, the last time I talked to him he left here, went home,

It's interesting he can't clearly say when was the last time but then (i believe) speaks from an experiential memory of the time before the last time, but accidentally reveals it was at his home and not CFA

I think like @Tortoise says, he was already contemplating the murders, but I believe that afternoon, while Joey was driving home he finally decided what he would do.

 

[Niner]

Back in the late 50s & early 60s my dad was a veterinarian (artifical insemination) for the cows at San Quentin (and all of Marin & Sonoma Counties). I remember I was about 7 or 8 and went with him on his rounds. They wouldn't let me in - I had to wait at the guards' gate...

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I, perhaps look at the death penalty option more simplistically.

I ask myself these simple questions.

1. Is Charles Merritt one of the worst among other CA murderers? YES!

2. Does Charles Merritt deserve the harshest punishment allowed under CA law? YES!

3. Why do I think he deserves the harshest punishment allowable?

*. Murdered multiple victims in mass.

* Two of his victims were tiny children way under the age of 12.

* The murders were brutal overkills which were extremely heinous, and cruel.

* Motive to murder was for financial greed/gain, and to eliminate all eye witnesses.

* His choice of murder weapon he used against all 4.

Imo, it's just a no brainer for me when determining which sentence should be imposed fitting the crimes committed by CM.

Imo, for the jury to not hand down a recommendation of death, and instead go will a lower sentence than death, and recommend LWOP means they have given this hideous creature a break.. by not deeming him as one of the very worst... when there is no question he IS one of the worst.

The crimes he has done deserves the very harshest punishment allowed under CA law.

Only the punishment of death fits the 4 murders he did against all 4 of his victims...how he did them, why he did them, and what he used to end all of the beautiful lives taken by him.

Jmho

 

[MissJames]

CM will ALWAYS need to be protected by the State, IMO. The State will accomplish this by housing him with either 1 inmate or alone these days. He will always be shackled everytime he leaves his cell. The guards will have to make sure the hallway(s) are clear everytime he has to have med call/visit/etc. His LIFE will depend upon the security he receives as a DP inmate, IMO.

No doubt . I was replying to a post about Chris Watts being moved to a prison out of state to lessen the threat .
CW & CM will always need protection ...until they don’t ; )

 

[MsBetsy]

I recall in the Watt's case that "street justice" guy (he has a forum on the homepage) went on some of those crime shows raving on about how Chris Watts would be murdered in prison. A poster called him out on that not being supported by facts from the relevant state prison system.

There must be a lot of kid killers in US prisons who aren't dead yet

He also commented on the thread that it's very rare for murders to occur in prisons.
Someone had commented that child murderers get killed "all the time" in prison, but apparently it happens very rarely because prisons don't want to risk a lawsuit against them, so they take precautions to prevent it.
Assault in prisons, however, has been increasing. Or at least the number of allegations have increased drastically.
Apparently most of them have proved to be inconclusive.
Probably because they can't find witnesses since nobody in prison is willing to talk. Just a guess. Imo

 

[Hatfield]

Yes.

There is a slip up in Chase's interview which I believe reveals Joey came not to Chick-Fil-A but to Chase's house. In my opinion they had a verbal fight. Joey went home and told Summer. Then he called Chase. Then Chase turned his phone off and drove over in a rage.

"CM: Absolute the last time I talked to him, the last time I talked to him was, was on that, the last time I talked to him he left here, went home,"

It's interesting he can't clearly say when was the last time but then (i believe) speaks from an experiential memory of the time before the last time, but accidentally reveals it was at his home and not CFA

I think like @Tortoise says, he was already contemplating the murders, but I believe that afternoon, while Joey was driving home he finally decided what he would do.

Great observations.

I think he had trouble answering because he was thinking to himself about the "real actual last time he saw him" which would have been burying him in desert with rest of family, and he was struggling because he could not give that answer.
Then the 2nd to last time he saw him was probably when he was in the act of killing him and he could not give that answer either.
So the 3rd to last time he saw him when they were discussing (or arguing) about whatever news Joey was giving him was probably ok to use that answer and just leave out any arguing or yelling parts to make it seem like a normal business meeting.

I can see where that question stumped him.
Its a great observation that he had major trouble with that question.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

He won't make it in GP or anywhere else except PC/SC. He has a target on his back. He's a little fish in a big pond, and the sharks smell blood.

Perhaps, but I have read many articles over the years about prison inmates. It's actually very rare for any inmate to be killed in GP.

As far as having a target in his back because he is a baby killer no longer makes him among the few who murdered children. He is only one among many.

Tragically our prisons have become filled more, and more ..with inmates who have murdered children, even those who raped children before murdering them, but rarely does any harm come nor are they often killed in GP.

If put in GP I think CM will fit right in. He has been in prison GP before.

Imoo

 

[Longtimenoc]

Yes.

There is a slip up in Chase's interview which I believe reveals Joey came not to Chick-Fil-A but to Chase's house. In my opinion they had a verbal fight. Joey went home and told Summer. Then he called Chase. Then Chase turned his phone off and drove over in a rage.



It's interesting he can't clearly say when was the last time but then (i believe) speaks from an experiential memory of the time before the last time, but accidentally reveals it was at his home and not CFA

I think like @Tortoise says, he was already contemplating the murders, but I believe that afternoon, while Joey was driving home he finally decided what he would do.

I agree with you and Tortoise that there was advanced planning. Tortoise posted once that cell pings from Merritts phone were near the McStay home I think on the 2nd. It appears that he was looking for opportunity.

Does anyone recall why he said he dropped in and found MacGyver helping out with the painting? Wish I knew how many times he was near or at the residence days prior to the murders. I think MacGyver was very very fortunate that he escaped with his life.

 

[Tortoise]

I agree with you and Tortoise that there was advanced planning. Tortoise posted once that cell pings from Merritts phone were near the McStay home I think on the 2nd. It appears that he was looking for opportunity.

Does anyone recall why he said he dropped in and found MacGyver helping out with the painting? Wish I knew how many times he was near or at the residence days prior to the murders. I think MacGyver was very very fortunate that he escaped with his life.

McGyver said he saw Merritt there on Sunday 31st, and Tuesday 2nd. McGyver was also there on the 3rd but didn't see Merritt that time.

I haven't seen Merritt's cell phone records for the 31st but his phone was pinging off towers near the residence on Tuesday 2nd and Wednesday the 3rd. His phone was also off grid Thursday 4th until 9.36 am (later than usual for his phone) and when it connected he was travelling north on the i15 away from the residence. Potentially he could have been there 31st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th.

 

[Tortoise]

I think there is much to be learned from what the killer knew but never said to the detectives when he had the opportunity and was asked about Joey's illness, when it was important to him that they think the family left of their own free will, Joey was probably just sick from stress, and had no enemies -

Merritt, who worked with McStay in his water features business, was arrested in 2014. Merritt had been working on a book about the McStay family murders when he was taken into custody, CBS News reported at the time.

In the book, titled "Afraid of the Light," Merrick claimed Joseph McStay had been concerned his wife may have been poisoning him.

California man guilty of killing family of 4 found in desert graves

JMO

 

[Longtimenoc]

McGyver said he saw Merritt there on Sunday 31st, and Tuesday 2nd. McGyver was also there on the 3rd but didn't see Merritt that time.

I haven't seen Merritt's cell phone records for the 31st but his phone was pinging off towers near the residence on Tuesday 2nd and Wednesday the 3rd. His phone was also off grid Thursday 4th until 9.36 am (later than usual for his phone) and when it connected he was travelling north on the i15 away from the residence. Potentially he could have been there 31st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th.

Thank you so much. I wonder if the PT will use this evidence of premeditation in final arguments. They should. It's horrible.

 

[Longtimenoc]

Thank you so much. I wonder if the PT will use this evidence of premeditation in final arguments. They should. It's horrible.

I always thought that Joseph was suffering from a bad case of premonition. Like he had a vague sense of unease, kind of like mothers intuition. The unspeakable yet to come made him physically ill perhaps.

 

[Tortoise]

I always thought that Joseph was suffering from a bad case of premonition. Like he had a vague sense of unease, kind of like mothers intuition. The unspeakable yet to come made him physically ill perhaps.

I think Merritt was poisoning him, not to kill him but to make him weak.

JMO

 

[Longtimenoc]

Makes sense. At some point he began to realize he needed to rid himself of Summer also since she would uncover the thefts and prevent him from having any access to the business.

 

[Hatfield]

I think there is much to be learned from what the killer knew but never said to the detectives when he had the opportunity and was asked about Joey's illness, when it was important to him that they think the family left of their own free will, Joey was probably just sick from stress, and had no enemies -

Merritt, who worked with McStay in his water features business, was arrested in 2014. Merritt had been working on a book about the McStay family murders when he was taken into custody, CBS News reported at the time.

In the book, titled "Afraid of the Light," Merrick claimed Joseph McStay had been concerned his wife may have been poisoning him.

California man guilty of killing family of 4 found in desert graves

JMO

Interesting. I wonder if M first attempted a poisoning of him and it didnt work. Maybe he was driving around his house to see if the affects of a poison worked on him.

 

[mrjitty]

McGyver said he saw Merritt there on Sunday 31st, and Tuesday 2nd. McGyver was also there on the 3rd but didn't see Merritt that time.

I haven't seen Merritt's cell phone records for the 31st but his phone was pinging off towers near the residence on Tuesday 2nd and Wednesday the 3rd. His phone was also off grid Thursday 4th until 9.36 am (later than usual for his phone) and when it connected he was travelling north on the i15 away from the residence. Potentially he could have been there 31st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th.

Now that the conviction is in, I find this stuff by far the most fascinating.

IMO you picked up on a major clue here. Wonder if the detectives were on to this?

 

[mrjitty]

Interesting. I wonder if M first attempted a poisoning of him and it didnt work. Maybe he was driving around his house to see if the affects of a poison worked on him.

Like @Tortoise I suspect he was poisoning him for a long time.

Same as the Helen Bailey case

 

[fridaybaker]

I believe this to be a guarantee you can honor. Chris Watts--another baby killer--is housed in an out of state prison solely for his own protection and even with that he will never rest easy.

Okay, if this is true, can we expect the same for Chase? Housed out of state?

 

[Tortoise]

Interesting. I wonder if M first attempted a poisoning of him and it didnt work. Maybe he was driving around his house to see if the affects of a poison worked on him.

I think he'd been monitoring that for quite a while. He knew Joey was having problems playing soccer and paintball.

The symptoms I read about (can't remember where now) were nausea, vertigo, pains and weakness in his limbs. Those can all be symptoms of poisoning.