Found Deceased Australia - Gary Tweddle, 23, Blue Mountains NSW, 16 July 2013 - #3

[hwneyz]

Respectfully snipped by me ...


Dont quote me on this - I'm happy to be wrong ...
I think I spoke to one of the people in this photo during the search - they were not at the Fairmont on the night of the disappearance. So this photo looks to be another time. Also, that's not the shirt Gary was said to wearing when he disappeared.

Wait.....they weren't at the Fairmont Resort the night he went missing?

 

[SouthAussie]

Wait.....they weren't at the Fairmont Resort the night he went missing?

They were at the Fairmont, hwneyz, as far as we know from MSM reports.

I think FigTree means that all of the people in the photo weren't at the Fairmont that night, at least one of them wasn't, so the photo was probably not taken at the Fairmont (well, not during this trip to Leura anyway).

 

[YidArmyRach]

Ooohhhh good thinking. That would make sense.

A lot of little things are falling into place. Why didn't his friends ring the police, and told Annika to call them instead? Because nobody involved in a drug deal wants to be the one to ring police to say "hi, our friend is missing, he went to buy 2.5 grams of cocaine for us and hasn't come back".

I'm having a good time going back through the previous threads. There are a few 'aha' moments.

Yes, I had a 'aha' moment when they reported 5 packets of drugs ..... 4 people huddled round a phone + Gary = 5.

I really, really want to know what was said in that phone call! Did they hear a conversation between Gary and someone else - and is that why they called Annika?

 

[Lexis]

It was suggested by the taxi driver and staff at Silk's, that GT was quite possibly already on drugs around dinner time then, if so, where did he (and maybe others) obtain that round?

Would he/they have travelled by bus carrying drugs or is that too risky?

Do people prefer to source drugs at their destination in case they might be searched or found out through a circumstance when in transit?

 

[H A L 9 0 0 0]

Like other posters, I think there may be a bit more to Gary's dad's statement about loving him "unconditionally". I don't think a one-off, small quantity drug deal would quite warrant that level of expressiveness (if the drug angle was in fact what was being referenced there).

Bringing shame on the 'company' from a silly-minded party vibe that got out of control, generating negative publicity, maybe. But at 23, what level of maturity can seriously be expected from a bunch of young guys hanging out (and with someone else picking up the tab on the mini bar?)

What I'm leaning towards, as others here have suggested, is perhaps a deeper involvement or association with the drug world than just the occasional buy for he and his mates.

And aside from the possibilities of coming to harm at the hands of dodgy types (drug debt /ripoff etc) it also leads me to wonder that if Gary (hypothetically) did lead a bit of a secret life involved in criminal activity and suddenly feared some kind of exposure, punishment, public shaming etc- this in my opinion could also be motivation for taking his own life. In a moment of despair, a person could spontaneously head towards a cliff with the intention to jump, not realising that the point where it becomes sheer enough to do so may take some getting to. Though I do think that if this was the case here, surely it wouldn't have been reported that Gary was in "good spirits".

I still think accidental death (whether by a fatal drug reaction or other means) and a considered decision to hide the body remains a strong possibility now that a drug rendezvous seems likely to have taken place, despite the coke dealer's statement to the contrary.

All my opinion only, not to be taken as fact.

 

[FigTree]

They were at the Fairmont, hwneyz, as far as we know from MSM reports.

I think FigTree means that all of the people in the photo weren't at the Fairmont that night, at least one of them wasn't, so the photo was probably not taken at the Fairmont (well, not during this trip to Leura anyway).

Thanks SouthAussie.
Correct - sorry I didn't make that post clearer.
Hows your blood pressure hwneyz

Yes I spoke to one person - I dont know about the other people in the photo - but if that 'one' person wasnt at the Fairmont Resort Leura that night - Im assuming the photo was taken somewhere else at another time.

... and I could be wrong - no way to confirm it presently, msm didnt tag the photo with much else than pointing out Gary partying :facepalm:

.

 

[SouthAussie]

There is a case here on WS where an Aussie 'man' is suspected of killing his young wife and hiding the body so well that it still has not been located 10 months later, despite many searches.

So, the police have very cleverly been digging up info and have charged him with at least one other very serious offense, plus another offense. They are making his life as difficult as they can to encourage his cooperation, hopefully get his two young children out of his monster hands, stop him from fleeing the country (again), and get him locked up IMO.

I wonder if Pambos arrest practically right after Gary went missing is a similar police action?

 

[Xantara]

Thanks SouthAussie.
Correct - sorry I didn't make that post clearer.
Hows your blood pressure hwneyz

Yes I spoke to one person - I dont know about the other people in the photo - but if that 'one' person wasnt at the Fairmont Resort Leura that night - Im assuming the photo was taken somewhere else at another time.

... and I could be wrong - no way to confirm it presently, msm didnt tag the photo with much else than pointing out Gary partying :facepalm:

.

So FigTree, you recognise one of these people in this photo as someone you spoke to personally on the back of Gary going missing? In what context was that - were they a searcher, did they turn up door knocking, did you otherwise bump into them? What kind of vibe did you get from them?

I just watched an 8 minute youtube clip of Chris Pambos being interviewed by some other dude about marketing stuff in some very noisy coffee shop or bar... From a few years ago now, he looks very different to how he apparently is now as per that photo in the weekend papers.

 

[Xantara]

Like other posters, I think there may be a bit more to Gary's dad's statement about loving him "unconditionally". I don't think a one-off, small quantity drug deal would quite warrant that level of expressiveness (if the drug angle was in fact what was being referenced there).

Bringing shame on the 'company' from a silly-minded party vibe that got out of control, generating negative publicity, maybe. But at 23, what level of maturity can seriously be expected from a bunch of young guys hanging out (and with someone else picking up the tab on the mini bar?)

What I'm leaning towards, as others here have suggested, is perhaps a deeper involvement or association with the drug world than just the occasional buy for he and his mates.

And aside from the possibilities of coming to harm at the hands of dodgy types (drug debt /ripoff etc) it also leads me to wonder that if Gary (hypothetically) did lead a bit of a secret life involved in criminal activity and suddenly feared some kind of exposure, punishment, public shaming etc- this in my opinion could also be motivation for taking his own life. In a moment of despair, a person could spontaneously head towards a cliff with the intention to jump, not realising that the point where it becomes sheer enough to do so may take some getting to. Though I do think that if this was the case here, surely it wouldn't have been reported that Gary was in "good spirits".

I still think accidental death (whether by a fatal drug reaction or other means) and a considered decision to hide the body remains a strong possibility now that a drug rendezvous seems likely to have taken place, despite the coke dealer's statement to the contrary.

All my opinion only, not to be taken as fact.

The thing with 'accidental death' and a 'terrible, tragic accident' - that is what police have kept saying. I cant pull up a quote, because it's just from video footage of what was reported in the news. The Local Area Commander was heard to be saying he still thinks that what it is, but he won't speculate on what Garys state of mind was on that night, until all the toxicology results come back.
Not suggesting that I personally don't think it couldnt be more or that i disagree with what some others are posting here - just recalling what i've heard from the media but its difficult to reference it here, because it doesnt come from a printed report.

As for why Blue Mtns LAC arrested Pambos - that, to me, is fairly normal police practice. It is their case, their detectives and officers with all the knowledge, the brief of evidence etc. The LAC that takes control of the matter is the one in whose area the incident took place. Persons related to the case may subsequently appear in many different locations, but the case doesnt get delegated to a different LAC in each instance. I do note that Pambos is now required to report daily to Marrickville police station, because thats the closest station to Earlwood, where Pambos lives. That would be done for Pambos' convenience and, on that matter, there would be communication between Marrickville and Blue Mtns LAC.

 

[Xantara]

Checked shirts, short hair, and the clean-cut look are definitely the style.

Could have been a mix-up in identities. Could also have been someone else on Gary's phone on Watkins Road, if Gary left his phone behind because he knew the dealer was there and waiting, and he was coming right back.

Almost certain that Gary took his phone. His number would come up on the phone of the person he made the 17 min call too. Besides, if Gary's phone had been left at the resort, pretty sure it would have been found by now.

 

[SouthAussie]

Thanks Xantara .. my point was that perhaps someone else (like a colleague or Pambos) was using Gary's phone. And perhaps the phone wasn't intended to be found, due to something on it that could be incriminating to one of them.

JMO .. and pure speculation, as it would take a bit of a conspiracy to be true.

 

[LegallyBrunette]

So FigTree, you recognise one of these people in this photo as someone you spoke to personally on the back of Gary going missing? In what context was that - were they a searcher, did they turn up door knocking, did you otherwise bump into them? What kind of vibe did you get from them?

I just watched an 8 minute youtube clip of Chris Pambos being interviewed by some other dude about marketing stuff in some very noisy coffee shop or bar... From a few years ago now, he looks very different to how he apparently is now as per that photo in the weekend papers.

Well he's certainly been to the gym. Might have had a little help with the physique. Who knows, I don't care. Can't wait for the trial :twocents:

 

[LegallyBrunette]

Almost certain that Gary took his phone. His number would come up on the phone of the person he made the 17 min call too. Besides, if Gary's phone had been left at the resort, pretty sure it would have been found by now.

Agree. And I expect he was still on that phone when he went over the cliff. Hence it hasn't been found.
The call ended abruptly but the phone kept pinging for a few more hours.
Phone records will still show who called or texted who, so that doesn't absolve anyone with a guilty mind.
Can't remember now but wasn't he on the phone when he was waving at the car in Watkins road? Anyway the people in that car are independent witnesses.:twocents:

 

[CuriousGrace]

I have been off WS for a few months for personal reasons. I assumed drugs were involved. I haven't had a chance to read every post. The authorities choose not to release the drug deal information because they had obviously interviewed the dealer. I really don't think the dealer is involved in his final death. I mentioned unthread its bizarre for a Sydney dealer to drive up to mountains for such a small amount of cocaine. 2.5 grams is tiny for a drive!

But with anyone with a theory the dealer is involved, just no. When youre a drug dealer here you dont harm on the spot. Not here in Sydney. The dealer would be pissed off, no doubt. But he wouldn't harm him alone. They would have been friends, it would be death with. Ie. come back to resort for more money! The detectives interviewed the drug dealer 2 weeks after Gary went missing! They would have harrsessed him to the point where he would have given in, trust me. It's very scary to think about. Many work conferences do it in Sydney! They want drugs on the spot! And they get desperate after midnight! I don't think the dealer was involved. JMO

 

[LegallyBrunette]

The Pambos arrest article is another msm which needs some scrutiny ...

Next to the timeline is text from the Source of the article:

Pambos TimeLine - Annex.
15th July 2013: 10pm - Phone records indicate Mr Pambos arranged to drive from Sydney to the Blue Mountains to meet with the British-born computer sales representative on the night he went missing.
Court documents reveal the 26-year-old had planned to sell Tweddle 2.5 grams of cocaine in five small resealable plastic bags.

16th July 2013: (Gary Tweddle) - Security footage captures Tweddle running out of the Fairmont without his jacket or glasses. It is believed he wanted to meet Mr Pambos, who he had met on previous occasions in Sydney.

16th July: 2.00am: - Pambos -
He tried to meet Tweddle sometime between 10pm on July 15 and 2am on July 16 but the pair lost contact. They never met.

Phone records indicate Mr Pambos arranged to drive from Sydney to the Blue Mountains to meet with the British-born computer sales representative on the night he went missing.

30th July 2013:Approx
Police arrested Christopher Thomas Pambos, of Earlwood, two weeks after Tweddle vanished.

2nd August 2013:
Christopher Pambos is charged with attempting to supply cocaine to Tweddle on the night he disappeared.

23rd August 2013:
1) Blue Mountains police arrested Mr Pambos after he allegedly supplied more than $30,000 of cocaine and $800 worth of MDMA in Sydney on August 2.

2) He was charged with two counts of supplying a prohibited drug after he allegedly sold 128 grams of cocaine and 88 grams of the drug commonly known as ecstasy at Earlwood, in Sydney's inner west.

3) Police also charged him with dealing with the suspected proceeds of a crime after he was found with $5930.

23rd August:
Mr Pambos appears in court.
Mr Tweddle's body had yet to be found when Mr Pambos first appeared before Burwood Local Court on August 23

Ongoing -
OCTOBER: date not given
Mr Pambos has not yet entered a plea and is expected to face Burwood Local Court in October.

NOVEMBER: 22nd 2013: Gary Tweddle - Coroners Inquiry.

Are the 2 'red charges related?
I need some legal eyes here, as the msm report tells of 2 charges, but there looks to be 3 charges on the sheet.

And they definitely made a charge in relation to Gary.

.

The body of the article- your point (1) doesn't correlate with the article timeline. Journo didn't proof read properly.
However, the possible third charge would explain the involvement of Blue Mountains LAC in the arrest. Will keep an eye on the court lists.
Don't think the two charges in red are related. JMO

 

[FigTree]

The body of the article- your point (1) doesn't correlate with the article timeline. Journo didn't proof read properly.
However, the possible third charge would explain the involvement of Blue Mountains LAC in the arrest. Will keep an eye on the court lists.
Don't think the two charges in red are related. JMO

Thanks so much for looking over that LB!
Yes, the article is a bit 'spaghetti' (all over the place) - Im still trying to understand the exact timeline and which charge goes with what date ...

but interesting about the BMLAC and their involvement.
Thanks for keeping an eye on things.

 

[FigTree]

I cant pull up a quote, because it's just from video footage of what was reported in the news. The Local Area Commander was heard to be saying he still thinks that what it is, but he won't speculate on what Garys state of mind was on that night, until all the toxicology results come back.

Here is the quote from the media Xantara:

Police insist it was an accidental death but would not speculate on Mr Tweddle's state of mind until results of a post-mortem and toxicology report were received.
"Until we get all the results of the post mortem and the toxicology report, we can't speculate on what his state of mind was," a senior police source said.

 

[Mountain Misst]

The body of the article- your point (1) doesn't correlate with the article timeline. Journo didn't proof read properly.
However, the possible third charge would explain the involvement of Blue Mountains LAC in the arrest. Will keep an eye on the court lists.
Don't think the two charges in red are related. JMO

With three weeks between the two events i.e. the deal gone wrong in Leura and his arrest some time later, I have to agree LB.

The money would have been poured back into his you-beaut 'marketing venture' no doubt.

I've had another thought now we know more about things. The rather unusual term - looking "in" letter boxes has obviously been snagged by a lot of us. I wonder if Gary's mates were referring to a possible "letter box drop" that might have been made by Pambos.
Gary may have been looking for the drugs and the dolts back in the warmth of the Fairmont were offering suggestions. I know, I know he supposedly said he was lost, but that could have just been a cover up story after the event.
After all, we don't know the real content of that phone conversation. One lie leads to another lie...

 

[SouthAussie]

Read this article more closely today, and noticed that (re: Pambos) ...

"Mr Tweddle's body had yet to be found when Mr Pambos first appeared before Burwood Local Court on August 23.

Magistrate Christopher Longley granted him bail on the condition he surrender his passport and report daily to Marrickville police station."

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/cocaine-a...s-fatal-end-20130928-2ul59.html#ixzz2gVVo2cjS


So they are making sure Pambos doesn't flee the country.

Emma Partridge has also added to her timeline at the bottom of the article to include relevant Pambos activities.

I wonder if there can be a charge if Pambos is proved to have sold drugs to an already-off-his-face Gary, and Gary went on to suffer cardiac arrest due to drug overdose. (Bit like a pub can be held liable for selling alcohol to an already-drunk person, and something bad happens.)

There must be some reason why Blue Mountains LAC were the arresting officers when Pambos went down for drug sales in Sydney. Maybe they lumped the charge for selling to Gary in with the big drug charge, and that is why? Just seems that the charge for sales to Gary should be the minor charge, with the charge for $30,000+ sales should be the major charge with arrest by the police officers in that jurisdiction.

 

[SouthAussie]

I have been off WS for a few months for personal reasons. I assumed drugs were involved. I haven't had a chance to read every post. The authorities choose not to release the drug deal information because they had obviously interviewed the dealer. I really don't think the dealer is involved in his final death. I mentioned unthread its bizarre for a Sydney dealer to drive up to mountains for such a small amount of cocaine. 2.5 grams is tiny for a drive!

But with anyone with a theory the dealer is involved, just no. When youre a drug dealer here you dont harm on the spot. Not here in Sydney. The dealer would be pissed off, no doubt. But he wouldn't harm him alone. They would have been friends, it would be death with. Ie. come back to resort for more money! The detectives interviewed the drug dealer 2 weeks after Gary went missing! They would have harrsessed him to the point where he would have given in, trust me. It's very scary to think about. Many work conferences do it in Sydney! They want drugs on the spot! And they get desperate after midnight! I don't think the dealer was involved. JMO

Thanks CuriousGrace ... I think the speculation is based on why Blue Mountains LAC did the arrest of Pambos for the $30,000+ dollar sales in inner Sydney (as indigo7 linked earlier), when it is not their jurisdiction and Pambos doesn't live in the Blue Mountains either.

Speculating whether the drugs themselves came from the Blue Mountains area, or was there more to Gary's death, or .... ? (Because, I agree, 2.5g is a very small deal for a much-bigger dealer - or anyone - to make a 3-hour round trip drive to sell.)