Shannan Gilbert's 23 Minute 911 Call #2

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CNYDarkStar said:
Is every man on Oak Beach single? I find it hard to believe this would go on and the wives go along with it when they could get rid of their disgusting husband, and take everything as he goes to prison.
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Like Rex H, they probably wait until their spouses are out of town. Some of these were also beach houses back then, not a primary residence. Perhaps different now.
 
CNYDarkStar said:
I never indicated he was a one-man show nor can I figure out/remember when names and accusations are allowed. Further, I need no convincing. This thread is about the 911 call not the guy you're talking about.
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Shannan's case is more than just a 911 call. Thus, the reason I mentioned him. (imo)
 
LongIsland731 said:
I also don't beleive The theory that pak made the appointment with brewer. Go on your local sex worker listings and call them all. Why would a man answered the phone? It's bad for business to have a man answering the calls of horny men looking for sex. I would hang up right away and call someone else. The girls with security might mention a driver or boy friend on the phone so the client knows ahead of time not to mess around.
Brewer knew she had a driver outside.
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Interestingly, Brewer did not go local. It has never been explained why he chose a worker advertising in NYC, or why Shannan (if you think she made the "date," which I don't) agreed to go so far out of NYC.
 
Ruminations said:
Interestingly, Brewer did not go local. It has never been explained why he chose a worker advertising in NYC, or why Shannan (if you think she made the "date," which I don't) agreed to go so far out of NYC.
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According to MP in Lost Girls, it was because nobody else was responding to shannan’s ads and she was desperate for money. I agree that it’s very strange and one of the biggest inconsistencies in the entire story.
 
Kitsey said:
According to MP in Lost Girls, it was because nobody else was responding to shannan’s ads and she was desperate for money. I agree that it’s very strange and one of the biggest inconsistencies in the entire story.
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Yeah, not buying that. I wonder if LE ever checked into his financials to see if any bribes were paid, etc.

John Ray is in the news again, talking of how poorly the first team at SCPD ran their search and investigation.

www.the-sun.com

'Pink Panther' probe by Gilgo Beach killer cops has crucial flaw, lawyer says

THE family lawyer of a sex worker who was found dead in a Long Island marsh has revealed a key flaw in the police investigation of her death. Shannan Gilbert, 23, disappeared from Oak Beach, New Yo…
www.the-sun.com www.the-sun.com

However, Ray disputes this reasoning saying that when he went into the marsh in May 2012 on the same day and time Shannan went missing with the weather being similar, the conditions were not nearly as harsh as police claimed them to be.
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He recalled calling the Suffolk County Police Department's probe "a Pink Panther investigation" and referred to former commissioner Richard Dormer, who led the Gilgo Beach murders investigation, as Inspector Clouseau, the bumbling detective of The Pink Panther series.
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Ray says the SCPD didn't provide enough evidence for their claim that her death was "accidental".
 
LongIsland731 said:
Shannon also paused when asked her age and never answered. If she couldn't state her age at one point what makes you think she remembers an adress she heard 6 hours earlier?
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You are assuming that Shannan could not remember her age. There are a lot of reasons people do not tell their age. Maybe she did not hear or understand the question. She could have been distracted by something or someone in the house.
She might have thought the age question was irrelevant or inappropriate.

Or she could be so drug addled she really could not remember. However to imply she knew Brewer's address at some point is too great of supposition for me.
 
LongIsland731 said:
I also don't beleive The theory that pak made the appointment with brewer. Go on your local sex worker listings and call them all. Why would a man answered the phone? It's bad for business to have a man answering the calls of horny men looking for sex. I would hang up right away and call someone else. The girls with security might mention a driver or boy friend on the phone so the client knows ahead of time not to mess around.
Brewer knew she had a driver outside.
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I cannot recall where it was discussed, and I may be misremembering. Maybe it was in Pak's deposition.
However no evidence has been produced that Brewer made the date directly with Shannan. IMO

If Brewer did, I would think he would have publicly disclosed that fact. Again I cannot recall such a statement by Brewer, maybe he addressed the issue in his deposition.
 
LongIsland731 said:
In my opinion a lot of people are stuck in 2011 still buying into Ray's unproven claims. The second autopsy lean towards but never concluded that she was strangled. In my opinion, at this point, even if Ray was convinced it was an accident he would never admit it. He has too much invested into Shannon being a victim of murder. If he were to come out and say it was the cops are right then thr family no longer needs his representation. The media no longer need to interview him or give him attention.

Also, many are thinking about this as if it was them or if this happened at a backyard summer BBQ. Of course if it was you or I we would call the police or try to get shannon medical attention. Because I would hope for the most part we are law abiding citizens and have nothing to hide. We are also not in that life.

This is not the case for pak, brewer , and shannon. Brewer was breaking the law and lived in a private tight community. At most he tried to push shannon for extra favors after he figured she was vulnerable enough. Ask any sex worker they get tested and pushed by clients daily. Having the cops there would be an embarrassment and make him the talk of the town. Shannon gave details, and was not concise at all In her call.

Pak =convicted felon, illegal gun, still committing crimes that night.

People have shot at and ran from the cops for a speeding ticket warrants. Pak could have gotten years if caught as a felon with an illegal, likely stolen gun

Eveyone from the city knows you don't mess with the cops out on the island. You don't get caught in the suburbs. What could get you a court summons in NYC can get you sent upstate to prison in suffolk. The DA and cops here got time and aren't as overwhelmed as the city.
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I've noticed you mention this "illegal gun" that Pak had on his person a number of times in posts to explain Pak's actions.
Would you mind directing me to the source of that information?
 
Kitsey said:
According to MP in Lost Girls, it was because nobody else was responding to shannan’s ads and she was desperate for money. I agree that it’s very strange and one of the biggest inconsistencies in the entire story.
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I believe that was the info the author got from Pak. I don't believe it; I di believe that is what Kolker was told.
 
ArianeEmory said:
I didn’t know until today about Shannan’s bipolar diagnosis, or what happened with her mother and sister. I’m still leaning towards bad reaction to drugs (regarding the paranoid 911 call), but it seems she might have been more vulnerable than some to that bad reaction. JMO.

(Shoutout to the Criminology podcast, I believe the host is a verified member here, and their recent episode (along with a podcast that just seems to be called “LISK: Long Island Serial Killer”) helped me unpack the 911 call and Shannan’s background. FWIW, none of these folks, or the people they interview, seem terribly convinced Shannan was a victim of RH. The second podcast I mention, though, does point out repeatedly that Shannan’s case was instrumental in uncovering the other bodies.)
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weird that her body winds up somewhat near the others
 
Ruminations said:
I believe that was the info the author got from Pak. I don't believe it; I di believe that is what Kolker was told.
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Sorry to reply to myself. But I want to add that in the same Kolker work, Pak was said to be working for the same little (compared to Lace Party girls) escort agency as Shannan. Was it Fallen Angels? But...unlike Shannan he worked for several agencies. And it was said (probably by Pak to Kolker) that in that evening because they allegedly were not getting calls...allegedly because Shannan was new to them...they decided that night for the first time to go solo and find their own customer and split the agency share.

And, somehow that ended up being in Suffolk. Somehow Pak had Brewers numbers. Somehow, Shannan did not know where she was.

MOO.
 
acutename said:
weird that her body winds up somewhat near the others
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It’s not really “near” if you consider how closely the Gilgo four were grouped. Coincidence does happen.

I’m still working my way through the LISK: The Long Island Serial Killer podcast (which has lots of interviews with all the principals, some family, Kolker, LE, former LE, etc), and as of where I’m at in season 2 they’re only at about a 50/50 sense that her death was even a homicide.

My initial impression of the 911 call, as someone newish to the case, still stands (and is bolstered the more info I get), which is that she was having a paranoid crisis during the call and peripheral events. (I know there’s a theme here: “it’s about more than a 911 call”, but I just don’t see the conspiracy. I do know about the corruption in the SCPD and how much they obstructed the LISK investigation … I just don’t think it was because they were running a murder ring.)
 
Girlinterrupted said:
I've noticed you mention this "illegal gun" that Pak had on his person a number of times in posts to explain Pak's actions.
Would you mind directing me to the source of that information?
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He says in the 911 call that he has a gun at 13:09. The drivers often double as security. Hes useless as secuirty against say 3 or 4 men without a weapon. Prior to that he doesn't think it's 911 she's on the phone with. When She said "these poeple are plotting to kill me" Pak chuckled and in my opinion jokingly said "shut up" in a what are u talking about manner. Pak was already a convicted felon. Meaning he can not own let alone carry a gun in NY (possibly the strictest gun laws in the country) He's a prohibited possessor of whats likely a stolen gun. He's looking at real time if the cops catch me him with it.


 
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