AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #13

[cluciano63]

LE won't classify something based on an assumption. Many child abductions are witnessed - someone sees a child pulled into a car, off a bike, out of a bed. When LE has no witnesses and no physical evidence as to what happens, they keep it open to the known facts: she is missing. Jayme was supposed to be in her house under her parents care and she wasn't when they arrived.

Kidnapping is a crime so once LE feels they have evidence that establishes that the elements of the crime of kidnapping have been met, they may feel comfortable calling it a kidnapping. But until then they generally don't make proclamations based on their assumptions or instincts.

There is already a double murder...I can’t see hedging over the word “abducted” when a child is missing from the crime scene.

 

[kirkassoc]

I've noticed in all photos of the crime scene that have been released, that both garage doors were open. Did LE open those or were they opened (as we know the front door was ajar) when LE arrived? I was wondering if it was possible one perp went through the garage and upstairs while another covered (kicked in) the front door. I remember seeing a crime photo where the front porch light was still burning, but have never seen it stated that LE turned that on when they arrived (as it was dark outside). Anyone?

 

[Jaded_musician]

I only wanted to say if one of them was with Jayme that much this must be double the pain. Family means so very much to us but being with somebody in the family several days a week would make this sooo much harder.
Both of those ladies lost their sister and niece. Sad times.
Tomorrow is the funeral service. Sigh.

Would a family typically have a funeral service for murdered parents while the daughter is still missing? It's all just so sad, I can't imagine being the family and trying to deal with both the loss of the parents and the ongoing search for the daughter.

 

[Gardener1850]

No what I am saying is she could have gone out after the family party and arrived home anytime before the 911 call. She may very well have walked into a horror scene in progress. Police have said they don’t know how long parents were dead before they arrived. Multiple rounds spent. Maybe Jayme was our with her aunts or stayed longer at the party to be dropped home later on? Maybe she hid a long time before someone even realized they weren’t alone with two deceased adults in the home?

No. The sheriff said the last time Jayme was seen alive by anyone was at the family gathering on Sunday afternoon. Had she been out with someone and dropped off the sheriff would have said that instead of mentioning the family gathering at all. And if someone dropped her off they would have noticed something like the open front door or a strange car. JMO. It was a school night and she is 13, not 18. If for some unusual reason they had kept her out that late and then were taking her home after midnight, a responsible adult wouldn't just let her out at the street and zoom off without making sure she got inside the house ok. There are wild animals and there are no streetlights in front of their house. I believe they would have made sure she got inside and possibly gone into talk to her parents. But I don't think it happened. JMO.

 

[MsBetsy]

Maybe someone knocked and James went to open and someone from a distance shot? Scope on a gun maybe? The second shot may seem louder cause it’s closer?

I don't know, but I would think if he answered the door it makes sense that he would be where they found him. But if the door was kicked in and the killer opened the door and stepped inside to shoot him, his feet wouldn't be partially outside. It only makes sense if he was standing at the door. Wouldn't the force of the gunshot also knock him back a little?

 

[Amonet]

There is already a double murder...I can’t see hedging over the word “abducted” when a child is missing from the crime scene.

I think other than cases that are parental-type abductions or clearly observed abductions that LE seem to usually focus on the word 'missing' in regard to the child/victim.

I think in this case (and possibly with others, too) that there might also be some psychological reasoning. LE haven't really discussed a perp/abductor, yet they're acting as if there is one. They just talk as if 100% of their focus is on Jayme and finding Jayme and reuniting her with her family. I think it's probably part of the tactics nowadays, especially where the FBI or state investigative teams are brought in. I think it's probably less threatening to an abductor who's watching the news. They aren't even talking about finding a murderer, they're just talking about finding Jayme.

Also you need the public to call in any potential sightings, not to just assume that J is locked up in someone's basement. In some of the longer-term captivity cases the victims have been allowed outside and the chains holding them have become psychological as much or more than physical chains. People have to know to call in those sightings of girls who look like Jayme even if they're not behaving exactly how people might assume that a kidnap victim would be acting.

 

[MadCityNative]

The more I think about this, I think the perp is from outside the area...when I was in Barron, albeit almost 20 years ago, it took me less than an hour to get to the Minnesota state line, and that was after a detour to Dallas (Dallas, WI)...I hope they are diligently checking plates in MN.

 

[sun16]

First time poster, but I've been watching this thread for a few days now.

The thing I can't make any sense of is the violent nature of the killing of the parents. It just seems really different to have done that if the goal was abducting Jayme.

The flip side of that is if the goal was revenge on the parent(s), taking Jayme still makes very little sense and doesn't seem like other cases I've heard before.

I think this is one of two possible scenarios:
1.) Random sociopath/killer who would indiscriminately kill anyone they felt like and for some reason chose this poor unsuspecting family to kill/abduct.
2.) Someone known to the family or where they worked, who is still in the area and trying to blend in as if nothing happened.

Seems like #1 to me, because these are the types of people who do things like this and, afterwards, we just can’t put order and sense to it. They just wanted to do something really horrrible, because.

 

[MsBetsy]

Would a family typically have a funeral service for murdered parents while the daughter is still missing? It's all just so sad, I can't imagine being the family and trying to deal with both the loss of the parents and the ongoing search for the daughter.

I think they can only wait so long. They did say they will have a burial service at a later date. Or something like that. Some kind of service, probably more for family and close friends. They are probably hoping to include Jayme, and will wait a certain amount of time. It's not uncommon. Jmo

 

[Amonet]

Would a family typically have a funeral service for murdered parents while the daughter is still missing? It's all just so sad, I can't imagine being the family and trying to deal with both the loss of the parents and the ongoing search for the daughter.

They can't hold the bodies for burial indefinitely. I think it's the wisest thing to have the funeral now and then when Jayme's back the family can hold a private memorial service when J is ready for it.

I totally agree it's a horrific situation for the family to be in. It's extremely cruel to everyone involved, including Jayme's dog who doesn't understand even as much as the humans do.

 

[Jaded_musician]

I think they can only wait so long. They did say they will have a burial service at a later date. Or something like that. Some kind of service, probably more for family and close friends. They are probably hoping to include Jayme, and will wait a certain amount of time. It's not uncommon. Jmo

Seems there's also information about the community that can be gained by who attends and who doesn't.

 

[Randazzo]

They aren't even talking about finding a murderer, they're just talking about finding Jayme.

That right there makes me think they have some idea who did it. They might even be in custody. If even one murderer is on the loose, you'd think there would be more warnings to stay alert and lock your doors.

 

[EJB123456]

First time poster, but I've been watching this thread for a few days now.

The thing I can't make any sense of is the violent nature of the killing of the parents. It just seems really different to have done that if the goal was abducting Jayme.

The flip side of that is if the goal was revenge on the parent(s), taking Jayme still makes very little sense and doesn't seem like other cases I've heard before.

I think this is one of two possible scenarios:
1.) Random sociopath/killer who would indiscriminately kill anyone they felt like and for some reason chose this poor unsuspecting family to kill/abduct.
2.) Someone known to the family or where they worked, who is still in the area and trying to blend in as if nothing happened.

I love picking apart theories. I’ve got nothing on yours. I could see either of these as plausible scenarios.

Sadly I'm leaning towards #1. We can't find any rhyme or reason in this crime because...there might not have been any.

 

[cluciano63]

But if they are addressing Jayme...they should be telling her that they know she wants to be with her family and her dog, that they are doing everything possible to get her back safely...let her know that they know she is not gone by choice. It has all been very ambiguous imo thus far.

 

[photographer4]

No. The sheriff said the last time Jayme was seen alive by anyone was at the family gathering on Sunday afternoon. Had she been out with someone and dropped off the sheriff would have said that instead of mentioning the family gathering at all. And if someone dropped her off they would have noticed something like the open front door or a strange car. JMO. It was a school night and she is 13, not 18. If for some unusual reason they had kept her out that late and then were taking her home after midnight, a responsible adult wouldn't just let her out at the street and zoom off without making sure she got inside the house ok. There are wild animals and there are no streetlights in front of their house. I believe they would have made sure she got inside and possibly gone into talk to her parents. But I don't think it happened. JMO.

I hadn’t seen that the police said she was last seen at the party somehow so thanks for this info! I do agree it would be unlikely just threw it out there for consideration

 

[Scrapper18]

Has anyone considered the possibility that Jayme came in and interrupted someone? Maybe she was out somewhere for the evening? Came in via the garage expecting to say goodnight to her parents and ended up walking into to a horror scene? Maybe she vanished bc someone didn’t expect her to be there and she showed up at the wrong time? When she shows up mom has a surge of strength enough to make the 911 call and someone makes off with Jayme!?

A have a couple problems with this theory.

1. If LE could see James’ feet in the doorway while approaching the house, wouldn’t Jayme, or more importantly, the adult driver notice this as well?

2. As an adult, if I’m dropping a 13 year old off, I stick around to make sure she got in ok. If she went in the front door, she sees dad, freaks out and runs; I see and hear her. If I dropped her off at the garage, I’ve got a little ways to get back to the street. If there is commotion, I both hear and see this.

3. Yes, Perp could have heard her coming, been ready and subdued her as soon as she entered the house. If so, why did 911 hear a struggle and someone crying help?

I really think Jayme was there from the beginning.

I don't know that we have established he was face up but the sheriff revealed on Ashley Banfield's show that his feet were visible and the door was ajar as the first LEO on scene approached the house. Multiple spent rounds were also observed and the door had been kicked in. I speculated previously that James may have been face up because the LEO's first impression on the dispatch log was suicide and then after seeing the rounds his second impression was that James had "answered the door" and he noted that the door had been kicked in. James being face up with his feet in the door way is just what makes the most sense to me with what we know so far, but I could be wrong. Some might be recalling my speculation and thought it was established he was face up? Sorry if that is where it came from. I try to be clear about what I'm speculating and what is fact.

Facts we know:
1. James' feet were visible in doorway on approaching the house
2. Door was ajar/open
3. First impression of LEO was suicide
4. Door was kicked in/damaged
5. LEO observed multiple spent rounds/casings at the scene
6. LEO's second impression was that James had "answered the door"
7. No gun found near body
8. Classification was quickly changed to homicide
9. Family members said someone "shot in" the door (they may be mistaken but this was their statement/belief)
10. The wooden door had a small window in it.

My Opinions Only:
1. Perhaps James had a head wound which would look like suicide at first glance.
2. Suicidal persons choosing to shoot at their head usually shoot themselves in the front forehead, side or mouth, not in the back of the head. Ergo, I reasoned he may have been found face up with a visible head wound.
3. If James was shot while facing the door, as if answering it, the force of the gunshot would push his body backwards and he may have landed face up with his feet in the door way.
4. James may have looked out the small window in the wooden door to see who was outside.
5. The perp may have shot James in the head through the window prior to breaking in the door (hence the door both being kicked in and looking "shot in" according to family).

I hope this helps explain why I think he was face up. It's only my opinion. Subject to change.

You have some good points and thoughts. Question, if James was shot through the door, then the door was kicked open, how did his feet get in the doorway? JMO, but if someone is shot through a door, their body is now behind that door. When the Perp kicks it in, the body goes between the door and wall.

 

[Mom24]

So the Smrekar home is 300 feet from the Closs home. That's not very far, and they heard a couple of rapid shots. But LE used the word "riddled" when describing the victims, did I read that correctly somewhere? How did they only hear 2 shots?

 

[Le Singe]

So the Smrekar home is 300 feet from the Closs home. That's not very far, and they heard a couple of rapid shots. But LE used the word "riddled" when describing the victims, did I read that correctly somewhere? How did they only hear 2 shots?

I think its more like 300 (250) yards. Also i have not heard the riddled part before if you find where its from LMK.

 

[SandyQLS]

BBM.

Nor kicking down doors! THAT part really gets me. Break a window and climb in... though also noisy. But the sheer effort/strength needed, even if the door was old and possibly a bit split. If I'm interpreting a blurry still correctly from one of the videos that showed it up close, it looked like one of those raised panel doors that isn't one piece of solid wood, but rather, several sections joined together. Easier to kick in than a solid 2" thick door, but still would require quite a bit of strength. As someone said earlier, makes it seem like he felt that the parents would know immediately who kidnapped her, if she was the goal, so he had to remove them from the equation.

I think JC was immediately shot at the door, then he fell blocking the door. That's why the gunman resorted to kicking the door open with parts of it likely landing on JC's body.

If the storm door is not damaged, then either JC or the gunman opened it, and JC opened the wood door.

At that hour, if there were noises outside or a knock on the door, wouldn't JC have looked out the window first? Wouldn't he have seen the person, seen the storm door open?

I didn't really think the gunman was known to JC, but who do you open your door to at 12:30AM? A stranger who opens your storm or screen door is rude - they should wait for you to open it even if it's unlocked.

I have to rethink this more about JC opening the door for anyone at that hour being someone he knows, someone who could open the storm door and not seem like a threat... It's the difference in what response JC would make to a stranger on Hwy 8 knocking because of car trouble versus the same excuse from someone he knows.

 

[Songbird1973]

Would a family typically have a funeral service for murdered parents while the daughter is still missing? It's all just so sad, I can't imagine being the family and trying to deal with both the loss of the parents and the ongoing search for the daughter.

I don't think the family has a lot of other options than to go ahead with the funeral. I think a week is about the maximum time a normally embalmed body will last without cold storage, which a small town morgue isn't going to have.

And I'm sure LE will be monitoring who attends for anything suspicious.