Trial Thread - 9 May 2012 Judge to give Jury Instructions

[Kittymama]

- the fact that he fits the profile of a child sex killer to the letter
- the fact that he took an 8 year old blonde haired blue eyed girl to a rural field 1.5 hours from her home
- the fact that she was found naked from waste down
- THEN add in what TLM said about, masturbation, you know I am going to have sex with her.
- the fact that his own defense could not offer one bit of evidence to clear him such as the hammer or other things tossed away, or the car seat that could proove him innocent if he didn't do anything. It may not be defense responsibility to proove his innocence but I SURE WOULD DO IT if it would clear me.
-common sense (why DOES a 28 year old man have to explain why he had an 8 year old girl in his car, and took her to a rural field, who then ends up dead with no pants on) it is common sense to me why that is in light of the fact that the defendant can't offer up anything for a defense.

IMO it is a no brainer. MOO
MOO

OMG, how could I forget the part where she was found naked from the waist down!? And yeah, he did fit the profile of a child sex killer almost exactly. I totally agree with your additions.

 

[snoofer]

OMG, how could I forget the part where she was found naked from the waist down!? And yeah, he did fit the profile of a child sex killer almost exactly. I totally agree with your additions.

I cannot imagine that a murder trial if the defendant is innocent, did not have one word about what he did that day, where he went, what happened those hours in his car, what conversations took place, no piece of tangible evidence to hold in your hand...nota, zero, zilch! I have never followed a trial before so maybe this is par for the course. But to me it seems bizarre. It tells me that nothing could be offered during that time of the hours in the car that could help him show his innocence. IMO That is damning. Of course he does not have to proove his innocence but with the overwhelming evidence crown had to proove his guilt....the defense mighta wanted to get busy on getting evidence to show innocence if they had any. MOO

 

[Flowercb]

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
Gowdey tells jurors if they have any doubt that McClintic and #Rafferty were in it together he tells them to watch the video of them hugging


Steven D'Souza ‏ @cbcsteve
Crown wrapping up their closing arguments now. "Michael Rafferty did it, ladies and gentleman"

Yes, he did, ladies and gentlemen! MOO!

 

[KMouse]

Friday is FRY-day for MR.

 

[Heliotrope]

I cannot imagine that a murder trial if the defendant is innocent, did not have one word about what he did that day, where he went, what happened those hours in his car, what conversations took place, no piece of tangible evidence to hold in your hand...nota, zero, zilch! I have never followed a trial before so maybe this is par for the course. But to me it seems bizarre. It tells me that nothing could be offered during that time of the hours in the car that could help him show his innocence. IMO That is damning. Of course he does not have to proove his innocence but with the overwhelming evidence crown had to proove his guilt....the defense mighta wanted to get busy on getting evidence to show innocence if they had any. MOO

With 3 years to prepare. Three years. More than a third of Tori's time on earth. Not one single piece of evidence.

 

[matou]

Christie Blatchford: McClintic, Rafferty were a ‘terrible team, a murderous duo,’ jury at Stafford trial hears

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com...a-murderous-duo-jury-at-stafford-trial-hears/

 

[Flowercb]

IMO as stated, it was questioned here that a drug debt could even be a possible motive. Yes, it could have been. The "small amount" was questioned and it's nominal importance. It should not be. Your view of sexual fantasy is one option. Please know others can state their thoughts freely. It would be refreshing to be able to entertain options, rather than have to agree with the majority. Yes? MOO

This is about justice, not about entertaining options. Justice is coming Tori. Rodney and Tara, we are all thinking about you. MOO!!

 

[otto]

Many thanks to all for all the updates/tweets ... no time to catch up, but from reading the recent comments, it looks like it was a good day for the prosecution.

 

[otto]

He'll probably be speechless!! IMO he thinks he's getting off.

I hope he does ... I'd like him to experience the full, sudden shock realization that he'll sit in a cage for most of the rest of his life ... all of it, I hope. He'll probably cry. He seems the type to have no empathy for the suffering of others, but to also believe that he deserves special treatment when it comes to his feelings ... just an opinion.

 

[Alison]

I would venture to say this is a very safe statement. JMO

(I do not believe we have heard all the evidence via tweets)

Just a question about your view point (not an attack). Do you feel that MR should walk out of court this week (or next) a free man? Or do you feel he deserves some punishment?
Would you be okay if he got off being your neighbour?
Just curious about your POV.

 

[otto]

Respectfully snipped by me.
I see things differently, but I appreciate how you phrased and substantiated your POV. May I ask you a question? Okay, a few.
Do you not think that there is enough evidence to show that he participated in the kidnapping? Or, do you not think Tori was kidnapped?

I only ask because, in Canadian law, if a murder is committed during a kidnapping, it is first degree murder, which, as you know, is what he was charged with.

Thanks!

That would explain why his lawyer has done everything he can to distance MR from the kidnapping. If he was a dupe and didn't know that the child he drove to the middle of nowhere was kidnapped, and TLM admitted to the murder, then he is facing a much lighter sentence. Since he drove the child to the location where she was murdered and there's evidence of rape, it's going to be difficult for anyone to believe that he didn't know that he did not have permission to drive the child to where she was later found murdered.

 

[flipflop]

- the fact that he fits the profile of a child sex killer to the letter
- the fact that he took an 8 year old blonde haired blue eyed girl to a rural field 1.5 hours from her home
- the fact that she was found naked from waste down
- THEN add in what TLM said about, masturbation, you know I am going to have sex with her.
- the fact that his own defense could not offer one bit of evidence to clear him such as the hammer or other things tossed away, or the car seat that could proove him innocent if he didn't do anything. It may not be defense responsibility to proove his innocence but I SURE WOULD DO IT if it would clear me.
-common sense (why DOES a 28 year old man have to explain why he had an 8 year old girl in his car, and took her to a rural field, who then ends up dead with no pants on) it is common sense to me why that is in light of the fact that the defendant can't offer up anything for a defense.

IMO it is a no brainer. MOO
MOO

in addition to your post....

why does he throw his backseat out (to the curb as he was installing speakers in the backseat...if you believe that) and then go to the autowreckers and search for a new backseat for the car..........what innocent guy would do that....to me this proves why he needed to get rid of the back seat. JMO

 

[OhSoCurious]

I did insert my "JMO." But since you asked, the evidence that points to this being a sexual fantasy of MR's:

-no other theory with any proof (i.e. "drug debt"--no proof; "innocent dupe"--no proof)
-Tori's blood found in MR's car, mixed with MR's blood, on the gym bag. It was on the bottom of the gym bag, IIRC. If it was splatter from TLM wielding the hammer, how did it get on the bottom???
-Tori's blood found in the same spot as a sperm faction--now I know there are those who say maybe they got there at different times, but how likely is that, really? I don't think it's very likely. Especially considering it was such a tiny spot, and in such an out-of-the-way place in the car.
-MR's crazy sex drive--I mean, wow. Reminds me of Warren Jeffs.
-MR's lies to police
-MR covering up the murder, and, IMO, other things (such as the sexual assault)
-that MR was there at all--why WAS he there, if not to do what he did?
-the statistical likelihood of these kinds of crimes being sexual offences
-him driving by the school three times that day

I'm sure there's more, but that's all I can think of on the fly. Anyone, feel free to add to the list.

JMO

I've read all this before. I was requesting actual links to show he had sexual fantasies pre April 8th type thing. Know what I'm saying? Some sort of evidence to lead one to believe he had fantasies to premeditate and/or orchestrate this horrible outcome. After all, that's what the original post said that intrigued me. I thought I had missed something. MOO IMO

 

[robynhood]

Christie Blatchford: McClintic, Rafferty were a ‘terrible team, a murderous duo,’ jury at Stafford trial hears

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com...a-murderous-duo-jury-at-stafford-trial-hears/

I have the need to write this as I just read the article that matou posted the link here above! ....If ANYONE THinkS MICHAEL Rafferty is STILL INNOCENT....Please be so kind to read this article as It details way better than all my Tweets the exact picture that was PRODUCED BY the CROWN in detail with evidence far better than my tweetsas they were quotes from the court room LIVE from tweeter! It comes in disjointed as it is like a live prodcast of what is going on inside the London court room......I do need to carify as you are all free to have your own opinions as we live in a democratic society ....I just want you to see how the story enraveled not thru my disjointed often confusing tweets ...thanks for considering it!

....As you all know my heart is terribly broken as I love chidren and spent 20 years teaching kids like tori and as a mom this is MOST definitely ...The very worse NIGHTMARE a PARENT FACEs.!

..my whole heart is with Tara Macdonald as a mom I feel her heartache ....I send my sincere heart to her for comfort as this is an extremely anxious time !

....3 years of waiting for a verdict ...and I am sure their heart will never be the SAME as they lost their beloved daughter ...again RIP our angel who was so full or "UP " beat life ....I think I need to listen to SHania Twain 's song on you tube ...."UP "...we love you TORI forever in Ontario's heart GOD bless...robynhood!<3

 

[robynhood]

Tori and Us
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3z0fruRx"]YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.[/ame]...


For those of you who want to see what this trial was about ...Tori! ...get a box of kleenex...robynhood

 

[OhSoCurious]

I have the need to write this as I just read the article that matou posted the link here above! ....If ANYONE THinkS MICHAEL Rafferty is STILL INNOCENT....Please be so kind to read this article as It details way better than all my Tweets the exact picture that was PRODUCED BY the CROWN in detail with evidence far better than my tweetsas they were quotes from the court room LIVE from tweeter! It comes in disjointed as it is like a live prodcast of what is going on inside the London court room......I do need to carify as you are all free to have your own opinions as we live in a democratic society ....I just want you to see how the story enraveled not thru my disjointed often confusing tweets ...thanks for considering it!

....As you all know my heart is terribly broken as I love chidren and spent 20 years teaching kids like tori and as a mom this is MOST definitely ...The very worse NIGHTMARE a PARENT FACEs.!

..my whole heart is with Tara Macdonald as a mom I feel her heartache ....I send my sincere heart to her for comfort as this is an extremely anxious time !

....3 years of waiting for a verdict ...and I am sure their heart will never be the SAME as they lost their beloved daughter ...again RIP our angel who was so full or "UP " beat life ....I think I need to listen to SHania Twain 's song on you tube ...."UP "...we love you TORI forever in Ontario's heart GOD bless...robynhood!<3

Please keep in mind Blatchford is known for her biased writing. Please keep in mind this recap is solely through the eyes of the Crown and not necessarily how things unfolded that day. JMO IMO MOO

 

[Mystic]

Gowdey notes it was 8 minutes and 30 seconds of time with McClintic in the Home Depot. Reminds the jury Tori had to wait all that time...

RaffertyLFP: Gowdey said Tori was probably hungry and terrified when she siting in that parking lot

...wondering what would happen to her. Having to watch that video in silence was the "least we can do for Victoria" Gowdey says.

Going on break for 20 minutes.

you know i haven't been able to get that out of my mind since he mentioned that yesterday, her having not ate dinner; i know that seems odd but it really adds to the pathetic unconsciousableness (if thats a word) of them; they didn't even get her something to eat from the timmy's; he didn't even let her get dressed; 10 life sentences isn't enough time

 

[Kittymama]

I've read all this before. I was requesting actual links to show he had sexual fantasies pre April 8th type thing. Know what I'm saying? Some sort of evidence to lead one to believe he had fantasies to premeditate and/or orchestrate this horrible outcome. After all, that's what the original post said that intrigued me. I thought I had missed something. MOO IMO

How would there be links to show he had sexual fantasies? What would that look like? How can anyone prove what goes on in another's mind? We have only the evidence that's tangible. There's a lot of it. JMO

Don't forget, there also could be evidence that we weren't allowed to hear. If there is, we will likely hear it in the next few days. Hypothetically speaking, I am curious as to what you would think if there was information released that showed he did have a predilection for the sort of thing he's accused of.

I'm also curious as to what your theory of this crime is, and how you interpret the evidence we've all seen.

 

[OhSoCurious]

This is about justice, not about entertaining options. Justice is coming Tori. Rodney and Tara, we are all thinking about you. MOO!!

Okay but I will copy & paste what it say in the top left of our screens:

Victoria Stafford discuss all aspects of this case!

It does not say discuss only what the Crown says.

MOO IMO JMO

 

[otto]

I've read all this before. I was requesting actual links to show he had sexual fantasies pre April 8th type thing. Know what I'm saying? Some sort of evidence to lead one to believe he had fantasies to premeditate and/or orchestrate this horrible outcome. After all, that's what the original post said that intrigued me. I thought I had missed something. MOO IMO

Regarding sexual fantasies that MR may have had ... what sort of evidence would there be? Fantasies are imaginings ... nothing more.

When someone commits their first criminal offence and gets caught, there's no way to say ... hey, we always knew that guy was a murderer because, well, just because. Same with MR. People that know MR probably mentally reviewed all the times they allowed him around young children. Perhaps some thought that he did do some things that weren't normal.