CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #16 *ARREST*

[cluciano63]

Jmo I would be surprised if PF is not listed as father on the BC. Kelsey moved to Co specifically to be with him, finding her job afterward. It is hard to imagine that she would not want the father listed. Name changes if any could be done at marriage. Jmo

 

[cluciano63]

Common law is strange and it is not recognized in my state but is in Colorado.

What I was told is the couple has to "present" themselves as married and I do not know if that includes actually living together.
It seems to be a gray area to me.

Maybe an attorney with knowledge of CO. law can weigh in.

The main requirement if unwed seems to be proof of paternity. Not living together, in CO.

 

[Dexxie8]

I have some questions about LE questioning PF in the beginning.

Once KB was determined as “missing” in the beginning of December did LE go to PF’s house and ask him some questions about her whereabouts and that’s when he agreed to the DNA swab and handed his cell over to LE?

At this point is it your understanding that he hired a lawyer and then refused to speak to LE? I’m just wondering because LE has stated that they just wanted to sit down with PF but it seems they must have had some type of conversation in the beginning, so why didn’t LE take him to the police station right then for more intense questioning?

Also, now that PF has been arrested and formally charged, does this mean that LE will now get the opportunity to talk to him (possibly to find the location of KB’s body) or is he allowed to just plead the 5th?

 

[mustloveco]

He is a local, but nobody knew him. Wondering if he went to Woodland Park HS or Lake George?! PF is my age , and I did not attend HS here, however I know people who did go to HS here and nobody knows him, even Trevor Phipps who writes for the TMJ and just 2 yrs older. TP graduated WPHS. I think Hank Fidels went to school in Lake George, and I saw him quoted in the newspaper.

Before arrest, neither, probably. Or like @MassGuy said, the benefit of a good advice. After - slight hindrance. They will distance from him, I expect.

Two things matter, how rich your parents are (his are not) and probably, the support of the local community. He is a local boy, and she was a stranger. However, the story is so ugly that the community would expel him, morally. Be ashamed of him.

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[1mtroyal]

There is an article from the media on the internet saying Kelsey's phone has been found, and then in the article it states that the authorities are "hinting" that the phone has been found, and "appears" to have been found. I could not find any mistakes in the article and it sounds legitimate except the title is a little misleading and should have said that the authorities are hinting that the phone has been found. Cell phone of Kelsey Berreth found as her fiance Patrick Frazee plans to fight murder charge | NewsJar

 

[CuriousCricket]

I’ve mentioned this before, but the Wagner family likely killed 8 people for the custody of a young child.

I wouldn’t be the least bit surprised if the motive was the same here.

ITA. Mainly because that is actually what his actions accomplished (in the short run, at least).

When you look to see what KB's disappearance actually accomplished -- PF had complete possession of the baby.

He was able to keep the child away from a grandparent. Since that's what his actions accomplished, I suspect that to be the motive as well.

 

[The Farm]

The main requirement if unwed seems to be proof of paternity. Not living together, in CO.

Yes but common law also applies also if there are no children involved. Such as a couple has "presented" themselves as married, no children and decide they are going to split but one of them owns the home or property or anything for that matter. The other spouse can petition the court for half of everything. So paternity does not come into play there. The couple might have even been living separately for some time. Like I said to me it is kind of gray.

I will have to check into it more when I have more time and see what I can come up with!

 

[1mtroyal]

I have an idea on why the police dug up a big hole near the house PF was living. I think the cadaver dogs pointed out this spot as to where Kelsey was buried, but PF moved the body when the police chief said that they might search PF's place. If you had buried a body on some land and the police announced that they might search that land, I think you would move the body (and dispose of it somewhere else, not on the property the police said they might search.) I don't think the body is in Idaho since it might have troublesome evidence on it and would need to be well-hidden, so might as well hide it as quick as possible.

 

[Charlot123]

He is a local, but nobody knew him. Wondering if he went to Woodland Park HS or Lake George?! PF is my age , and I did not attend HS here, however I know people who did go to HS here and nobody knows him, even Trevor Phipps who writes for the TMJ and just 2 yrs older. TP graduated WPHS. I think Hank Fidels went to school in Lake George, and I saw him quoted in the newspaper.


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I think to Woodland Park High, at least, graduated from it. I read it somewhere.

It would be interesting to know whether he was not popular, hence, not noticed (although he was tall enough to be seen, at least), or whether such is the life on farms that people don't see the neighbors much?

 

[Charlot123]

I have an idea on why the police dug up a big hole near the house PF was living. I think the cadaver dogs pointed out this spot as to where Kelsey was buried, but PF moved the body when the police chief said that they might search PF's place. If you had buried a body on some land and the police announced that they might search that land, I think you would move the body (and dispose of it somewhere else, not on the property the police said they might search.) I don't think the body is in Idaho since it might have troublesome evidence on it and would need to be well-hidden, so might as well hide it as quick as possible.

Makes sense to me!

 

[cluciano63]

ITA. Mainly because that is actually what his actions accomplished (in the short run, at least).

When you look to see what KB's disappearance actually accomplished -- PF had complete possession of the baby.

He was able to keep the child away from a grandparent. Since that's what his actions accomplished, I suspect that to be the motive as well.

Yes and since we now know this was not a “rage” or spur of the moment crime, it seems he made a point of taking and securing the baby, either before the murder if someone else actually did it, or at the time. So he had physical custody...whereas if Kelsey had been found in her home, with the child present, he likely would have had a much more difficult time in getting the baby from child services. Jmo

 

[Charlot123]

Yes but common law also applies also if there are no children involved. Such as a couple has "presented" themselves as married, no children and decide they are going to split but one of them owns the home or property or anything for that matter. The other spouse can petition the court for half of everything. So paternity does not come into play there. The couple might have even been living separately for some time. Like I said to me it is kind of gray.

I will have to check into it more when I have more time and see what I can come up with!

In WA, it applies too, but I think "certain time" is 12 years.

 

[Mimi in London]

I think to Woodland Park High, at least, graduated from it. I read it somewhere.

It would be interesting to know whether he was not popular, hence, not noticed (although he was tall enough to be seen, at least), or whether such is the life on farms that people don't see the neighbors much?

I think someone who knew him at school was quoted in the media as saying something like, ‘Patrick was Patrick, I don’t really want to get into that’.

 

[The Farm]

Colorado Common Law Marriage Requirements

I came up with this.

 

[The Night Watchman]

PF is charged with solicitation to commit murder (in addition to 1st degree murder). This requires involvement of one more additional players.

Who was it that PF solicited and potentially received help from?

Solicitation relates to activities planned prior to a murder. Taking a phone to Idaho after the murder on PF's behalf would not be solicitation, it would be obstruction or conspiracy.

At the very least, someone knew that KB was going to be murdered. And did nothing.

The person that PF solicited may not get charged if assistance was not actually provided for the murder. I'm not saying anything new here, as this has been preciously discussed. But when will we find out the identity of this person that was solicited, and potential additional charges?

Today? At PF's court appearance? Maybe at trial? Is LE still making a case against the second party(s)?

If PF pleads guilty and no charges are ever filed against this person, might we never find out? Would he plead guilty to avoid this disclosure?

We see murders everyday, so I would never say that I don't understand why murders occur.

What I can't get my head around is- how does anyone not take action when they know the mother of a one year old child is about to be murdered?

Did the person that PF solicited also want KB to disappear?

It is against the WS rules to speculate on who provided assistance to PF.

But I really hope the entire story gets told.

 

[K9Enzo]

I have an idea on why the police dug up a big hole near the house PF was living. I think the cadaver dogs pointed out this spot as to where Kelsey was buried, but PF moved the body when the police chief said that they might search PF's place. If you had buried a body on some land and the police announced that they might search that land, I think you would move the body (and dispose of it somewhere else, not on the property the police said they might search.) I don't think the body is in Idaho since it might have troublesome evidence on it and would need to be well-hidden, so might as well hide it as quick as possible.

This is a good theory.

A well trained HRD k9 can alert on human blood the size of a q-tip, spread out of a pretty large distance. They can also indicate on human bone, among other specific human remains. This might explain why they really excavated a large area.

I do think it would be odd to bury a body so close to the house but stranger things have happened...

All my opinion of course.

 

[Tippy Lynn]

November 22nd - Thursday
(Thanksgiving)

• KB last seen on video surveillance shopping in Safeway (noon hour)
• KB exchanged daughter with PF (fiancé)

November 25th - Sunday

• Text from KB’s phone to her employer
• KB's phone pinged in Gooding, ID (5:13 pm)
• PF received text from KB’s phone

December 2nd - Sunday

• KB's mom called PF on KB's whereabouts
• Missing person reported - KB's mom (12:37 pm)

December 10th - Monday

• Press Conference

Woodland Park Police Department​

December 12th - Wednesday

• PF Attorney releases statement - PF is cooperating with investigators

December 13th - Thursday

• Candlelight Vigil Held for KB

December 14th - Friday

• Search Warrant Franzee Property/Residence

December 15th - Saturday

• Twin Falls law enforcement was requested to help

December 16th - Sunday

• The search of Patrick Frazee's property concludes Sunday night

December 18th - Tuesday

• Five law enforcement vehicles seen leaving PF Property
• PF and 2 others made trip to Waste Management Landfill

December 19th - Wednesday

• LE at Kelsey’s Residence

December 20th - Thursday

• LE at Kelsey’s Residence

December 21st - Friday

• Arrested- 1st Degree murder and Solicitation of Murder

Inmate #: 2018001543
Booking #: 18-02029
Case #: D602018CR330
Archonix XJail Public​

• Press Conference 10am MST

Woodland Park Police Department​

• LE at Kelsey’s Residence
• PF - Hearing on Advisement - 3:30pm

Inmate #: 2018001543
Booking #: 18-02029
Case #: D602018CR330​

• Vigil held for KB in Moses Lake, WA

December 22nd - Saturday

• Twin Falls, ID Police Department issued statement they are working with CBI and FBI to prepare and serve several search warrants, including processing items of possible evidence with the assistance of the Twin Falls County and Twin Falls Evidence Technicians.

December 27th - Thursday

• Temporary Custody Hearing - 1pm

Case #: D602018JV26​

December 31st - Monday

• PF - First Appearance - 9am

Inmate #: 2018001543
Booking #: 18-02029
Case #: D602018CR330​

 

[NanZDrew]

T

November 22nd - Thursday
(Thanksgiving)

• KB last seen on video surveillance shopping in Safeway (noon hour)
• KB exchanged daughter with PF (fiancé)

November 25th - Sunday

• Text from KB’s phone to her employer
• KB's phone pinged in Gooding, ID (5:13 pm)
• PF received text from KB’s phone

December 2nd - Sunday

• KB's mom called PF on KB's whereabouts
• Missing person reported - KB's mom (12:37 pm)

December 10th - Monday

• Press Conference

Woodland Park Police Department​

December 12th - Wednesday

• PF Attorney releases statement - PF is cooperating with investigators

December 13th - Thursday

• Candlelight Vigil Held for KB

December 14th - Friday

• Search Warrant Franzee Property/Residence

December 15th - Saturday

• Twin Falls law enforcement was requested to help

December 16th - Sunday

• The search of Patrick Frazee's property concludes Sunday night

December 18th - Tuesday

• Five law enforcement vehicles seen leaving PF Property
• PF and 2 others made trip to Waste Management Landfill

December 19th - Wednesday

• LE at Kelsey’s Residence

December 20th - Thursday

• LE at Kelsey’s Residence

December 21st - Friday

• Arrested- 1st Degree murder and Solicitation of Murder

Inmate #: 2018001543
Booking #: 18-02029
Case #: D602018CR330
Archonix XJail Public​

• Press Conference 10am MST

Woodland Park Police Department​

• LE at Kelsey’s Residence
• PF - Hearing on Advisement - 3:30pm

Inmate #: 2018001543
Booking #: 18-02029
Case #: D602018CR330​

• Vigil held for KB in Moses Lake, WA

December 22nd - Saturday

• Twin Falls, ID Police Department issued statement they are working with CBI and FBI to prepare and serve several search warrants, including processing items of possible evidence with the assistance of the Twin Falls County and Twin Falls Evidence Technicians.

December 27th - Thursday

• Temporary Custody Hearing - 1pm

Case #: D602018JV26​

December 31st - Monday

• PF - First Appearance - 9am

Inmate #: 2018001543
Booking #: 18-02029
Case #: D602018CR330​

Thanks for this.

 

[Tippy Lynn]

T

Thanks for this.

Welcome

 

[Gardener1850]

I have some questions about LE questioning PF in the beginning.

Once KB was determined as “missing” in the beginning of December did LE go to PF’s house and ask him some questions about her whereabouts and that’s when he agreed to the DNA swab and handed his cell over to LE?

At this point is it your understanding that he hired a lawyer and then refused to speak to LE? I’m just wondering because LE has stated that they just wanted to sit down with PF but it seems they must have had some type of conversation in the beginning, so why didn’t LE take him to the police station right then for more intense questioning?

Also, now that PF has been arrested and formally charged, does this mean that LE will now get the opportunity to talk to him (possibly to find the location of KB’s body) or is he allowed to just plead the 5th?

If the police come to your house to ask you questions, they cannot just take you to police station "for more intense questioning". They can ask you to come to the police station and you can go voluntarily, but you are within your rights to refuse to go to the station for questioning. The police in America can only forcibly take you to the police station if you are under arrest. Once under arrest they can try to question you but if you ask for a lawyer then they are not allowed to question you anymore without your attorney present. So, no, they cannot question PF while he is in jail (unless they first ask his lawyer and the lawyer agrees to let him be questioned-- which hardly ever happens). Hope this helps-- I am not a lawyer but we have many members here that are and have explained this previously.