Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #110

[TL4S]

Just my take on it. Maybe LE collected evidence from the crime scene that at the time seemed to contradict the witness for YBG sketch. Or the witness contradicted the video. Or the witness wasn't reliable. There could be a million reasons.

So they sat on it, not wanting to put something out that might be wrong.

Along comes witness number two, a few months later, with information that fit a little better. OBG sketch. After all, haven't many of us thought it looked more like the video? Plus they used various other information, maybe including the video, or the profile. We don't know that part.

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that neither witness description fits the evidence found at the CS perfectly, so while they have a composite, it's only one element of many that quantify a suspect. JMO

 

[sunshineray]

So why can't LE work out his real height with all this science? And a Parabon sketch with his DNA? Ignore the hat for two years now a hat is in the description. I can't make out what is going on here with LE.

"Have[ing] a very solid science element" and saying they have DNA sound promising within all the confusion.

 

[TL4S]

Well even that is not clear. A combination of the two sketches. So is the hat to be considered now or not, as before.

Also 5'6 -5'10". Surely they could get that much more accurate directly from the video?

ETA. I see the Suspect description does indeed include a hat.
"Images and video on Libby German’s cellphone show a man walking across Monon High Bridge that day, wearing blue jeans, a blue jacket and a hat."

So, what type of hat?

Maybe the hat is precisely why they can't determine an exact height, plus the downward angle of his head. Just guessing...

 

[TL4S]

"Have[ing] a very solid science element" and saying they have DNA sound promising within all the confusion.

What are the chances that if there was any kind of a struggle, BG's hat stayed on his head? If it fell off, I don't think he would have left it there, but seems likely some shed hair could be left behind. Reddish brown. I know I'm a broken record, but I feel strongly about hair evidence.

 

[watcher9]

The 15 minutes is based on the 2.30 BG on the bridge time which may not necessarily be correct. As several posters have said, that 2.30 time could be the beginning or the end of the recording. If BG appeared in the video shortly after the SC photo of Abbey (2.07) then the crime could have been within 30-35 minutes. (Remembering that BG is not in that SC photo ) Therefore it does depend on the accuracy of the 2.30 time on the bridge. It was quick, anyway.

ETA there are only 3 witnesses I believe, FSG, (two sightings) CME and the cemetery witness .

Sorry I can't keep up.
So has it now been confirmed that BG was not in the original SC photo and had not been cut out as previously speculated?

Trying to visualize within the time frame...
Was Libby off the bridge when she took the SC picture as shown on the GH video? Did the girls get back together on or off the bridge before BG got to them? Where would Libby be standing when she started the video on BG? I'm thinking she was back up on the bridge by then because the angle of the video clips were more straight than at an up angle?

 

[moonlessnight]

that tells me that he was definitely in significant disguise and was seen both with and without the disguise that day on or near the trails/parking lot. Maybe someone saw him putting part of the disguise on in the lot.

I C/P this from a @Jax49 Post in thread 108. (We went thru all this two threads ago.)

In this interview Indiana State Police Superintendent Carter clears up his opinion on the two sketches. About the 4:10 mark, he talks about when the perp is caught, he will be somewhere between the two sketches.

 

[tresir2012]

Maybe the hat is precisely why they can't determine an exact height, plus the downward angle of his head. Just guessing...

They have a pic of Abby on the bridge and she is 5'4". They can do it more accurately than within 4". They also have witnesses who will be able to guess his approx height. I really don't know what they are playing at. They wouldn't take questions at the PC and they asked to leave the family for two weeks. So now we are 4 months down the line, how about an update from them and questions now?

 

[moonlessnight]

thanks for putting this in one place. conflicting info from LE on the sketches. clear as mud.

Here's a few links to LE released information:

Indiana State Police releases clarification points on Delphi murder suspect
Their Multi-Agency Task Force provided the following points of clarification after Monday’s informational news conference:

• A car was parked in the abandoned CPS building parking lot between the hours of noon and 5:00 p.m. on February 13, 2017
  • We are looking for anyone who could give a description of vehicles that were in the parking lot during the time

Delphi murders: New suspect sketch not same man as in old sketch, ISP clarifies
In ISP’s attempt to clarify on Wednesday, Riley wrote that investigators’ initial belief that “a person in the age range of his 40s to 50s was a person of interest in this murder investigation.”

“Now, as the investigation has matured and past information has been reassessed,” ISP’s release said, “it is the belief of investigators with the Multi-Agency Task Force that the person depicted in the sketch released on April 22 more accurately represents the person wanted for the murders of Abigail Williams and Liberty German.”

The new sketch features what police called a man with “a youthful appearance, but could fall in the age range from his 20s to late-30s.”

► THE SUSPECT: Police continue to look for a white male between 5-foot-6 and 5-foot-10, weighing 180 to 200 pounds, with reddish brown hair. On Monday, Indiana State Police released a new composite photo of a new suspect, putting his age in his mid-20s to late-30s. Images and video on Libby German’s cellphone show a man walking across Monon High Bridge that day, wearing blue jeans, a blue jacket and a hat. Police also release a recording, taken from Libby’s phone, of a man saying, “Guys, down the hill.”

ISP: We're 'one tip away' from solving Delphi murders
"When we decided that, through the information we received, that we were going to release the second sketch I don’t believe the individual knew we were going to do that. So it was really, really important. I think he was probably there and/or watching, simply because he thought we were on the wrong path," Carter said.

"The sketch isn’t a photograph. A sketch is a sketch and that’s really important for everybody to understand," Carter said. "I believe that the individual when we catch him, it will be a combination of those two.”

"Those two girls, once we tell you all we know about them you might understand a little bit more about why it’s so emotional, but I think of Abby and Libby all the time." - Carter

FBI Billboard about halfway down the page:
Found Deceased - IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, and Liberty (Libby) German, 14/The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #87

 

[Handsome Sailor]

wish I was there. i'd push him off the bridge. moo

 

[TL4S]

They have a pic of Abby on the bridge and she is 5'4". They can do it more accurately than within 4". They also have witnesses who will be able to guess his approx height. I really don't know what they are playing at. They wouldn't take questions at the PC and they asked to leave the family for two weeks. So now we are 4 months down the line, how about an update from them and questions now?

I may be by myself in this thought, but if LE has reason to think BG is feeding into the case coverage, maybe silence is their way of starving him. Also, a lot of innocent people get slandered online after every new bit of media news. JMO

Now I'll stop post hogging the thread. Sorry.

 

[FinePrint]

I may be by myself in this thought, but if LE has reason to think BG is feeding into the case coverage, maybe silence is their way of starving him. Also, a lot of innocent people get slandered online after every new bit of media news. JMO

Now I'll stop post hogging the thread. Sorry.

Don't stop, you are coming through with excellent thoughts!!

 

[HEY YOU!]

So who was the witness who said he saw BG near Freedom Bridge?

 

[tresir2012]

Maybe the hat is precisely why they can't determine an exact height, plus the downward angle of his head. Just guessing...

Oh like a top hat or Abraham Lincoln hat? ;-)

 

[TL4S]

Oh like a top hat or Abraham Lincoln hat? ;-)

That would narrow down the suspect pool, huh?

 

[Cutiekitty]

Authorities, family continue searching for missing Carroll County teens

I found this article describing what the girls were last seen wearing. Has anyone else seen any other official statement about what they were last seen wearing?

 

[tresir2012]

I may be by myself in this thought, but if LE has reason to think BG is feeding into the case coverage, maybe silence is their way of starving him. Also, a lot of innocent people get slandered online after every new bit of media news. JMO

Now I'll stop post hogging the thread. Sorry.

Generally LE will give the best description they have - which in this case is the video. They decided not to publish the video for more than two years. They withheld evidence in my opinion. What if this guy has offended again? They have also withheld more of his speech. So perhaps it would help to hear him cussing and shouting or whatever else he is saying. Also give more info on the vehicle or explain if that is no longer needed, at least.

 

[tresir2012]

Authorities, family continue searching for missing Carroll County teens

I found this article describing what the girls were last seen wearing. Has anyone else seen any other official statement about what they were last seen wearing?

Yes I have but I can't remember what thread - I did post it in the media thread too IIRC. Libby had black Nikes and her favourite tie die shirt and we can see what Abby was wearing in the SC.

 

[Cutiekitty]

Yes I have but I can't remember what thread - I did post it in the media thread too IIRC. Libby had black Nikes and her favourite tie die shirt and we can see what Abby was wearing in the SC.

I just don’t see a mention of LG’s sweatshirt. I thought KG said (Renner interview?) LG and AW borrowed her sweatshirts. KG said she didn’t have one to wear since she loaned hers to them.

The media tends to get things a little off at times and I’ve been wondering about this.

 

[Krwiley60]

that tells me that he was definitely in significant disguise and was seen both with and without the disguise that day on or near the trails/parking lot. Maybe someone saw him putting part of the disguise on in the lot.

What this tells me is that the witness(s) depiction of OBG was not accurate and LE relied more on the video and the forensic artists software. It is not a hand drawn sketch. I believe the difference in sketches is due to witness/LE error and not some elaborate plan by BG to throw off the investigation.

 

[Krwiley60]

There are a few things said at the April 2019 presser that have piqued my interest
- they say that they may have interviewed you
- they say that they may have interviewed someone close to you
- you never thought we would change our strategy

Those 3 statements always bring me to the thinking that they did interview him, that they interviewed someone close to him and that person gave him a alibi. That when interviewed, he threw them off into a different direction (away from him). That they went back to that interview and realized it but the alibi won’t budge. They want to put pressure on the alibi. They want him to know that they saw through the BS story he gave. They’re pressuring the alibi with the “conscience” issue while at the same time “daring” him to make a move. Maybe I’m reading too much into their words but I would hope the BAU put most of that presser together and they’re talking straight up to him. MOO

Then LE would know exactly who he is.