MO - Grief & protests follow shooting of teen Michael Brown #11

[gngr~snap]

That's why I wish we could see a drawing or photo that shows the scene where we knew we were definitely looking at OW's car and then measure that to MB's body using google earth. I think I'm clear on which car was OW's, but can't be 100% sure and the angles of the photos used don't let me get a good landmark to compare to the google map image.

I believe it's the one wrapped several times in police tape.

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[Linda7NJ]

I feel the same way about Michael Jackson and Woody Allen. And Roman Polanski. And probably a lot of other people. It's just icky the way we make allowances for celebrity. But I can't help kind of liking Snoop. I guess because his mess did not involve child molestation?

I really don't know, but that must be my "line". I did not realize it until just now.


Sorry for the semi-OT.

Ditto for me...!!!!


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[EvilSoup]

I kind of like Snoop because I watched a bit of his reality show and he seems like a good father and a very involved father. I dont care about people smoking pot. It is pretty much legal here in Cali, anyway. And I grew up in Berkeley in the 60's, so I can't point fingers at anyone. lol

Lol, preaching to the choir. I am pro-legalization.

But legally speaking, a felony record is a felony record (although, like I said, I don't agree all felonies are equal). I really think celebs get away with more than regular folks.

Did you see Snoop playing Huggy Bear in the Starsky and Hutch remake? Only good thing in the movie. :lol:

 

[Phoebeb]

Mark O'Mara George Zimmerman's defense atty was on CNN just now.
He said "police in MO not only have the right to use force when they are assaulted and may have well happened in this case, but they have the obligation to arrest when they see a felony occur. And that includes the one that may have occurred on them."
"So yes, they have very particular privileges, if you will, or protections because we give them the awesome responsibility of enforcing the law on the street and we tell them to arrest people that should be arrested. And in this case if in fact there was a tussle, an assault of some sort on the officer at the car, he not only has the right but the obligation to effectuate the arrest."
He reminds Sunny H that if there was strike to the face that is a felony. Class 1 felony in Mo.
Also reminds Sunny H. that eyewitness testimony can be unreliable especially if an emotional situation, unless every eyewitness says the same thing, then it can be compelling. Ex. If 5 people said the light was red, it was probably red.

 

[katydid23]

Lol, preaching to the choir. I am pro-legalization.

But legally speaking, a felony record is a felony record (although, like I said, I don't agree all felonies are equal). I really think celebs get away with more than regular folks.

Did you see Snoop playing Huggy Bear in the Starsky and Hutch remake? Only good thing in the movie. :lol:

Oh yes, celebs absolutely do. It sucks. And I have lived in /around the Hollywood scene for 30 yrs as my hubby is in 'the business' as they call it here.

As for Snoop, he has a great reputation among those working in Hollywood because he is really easy going, shows up on time and does a good job. He does bring a long his entourage, but they are pretty cool overall.

 

[jggordo]

I find the MO law concerning this very interesting. It has a lot of helpful information about how the GJ works also.

So lets say for argument sake that MB did assault Officer Wilson. Officer Wilson would absolutely know that MB had just committed a class A felony because he was the one being attacked. If this is true and I believe that it is.....when MB assaulted OW he became a suspect in a Class A Felony.

So when DW tried to stop MB when he tried to escape he knew he had just committed a felony. At that time MB had turned into a suspect, imo. He was no longer just someone walking in the middle of the street but his actions were felonious toward DW.

If the jury follows the law... as they will take an oath to do... by the MO law they will find the deadly force reasonable, imo. DW knew that he had already been attacked by MB and it is reasonable to believe he could go on to attack others or MB could even return to attack him.

Even if DW didn't know about the strong armed robbery, which I am not convinced he didn't know by that time, then it does show that MB seem to have a big chip on his shoulder that day and was aggressive toward others. Anyone that assaults a police officer must be apprehended and that is what DW was trying to do. IMO

What does Missouri law provide on police use of deadly force?
Missouri law gives police officers broad power to use force to make an arrest or prevent a felon’s escape. It states: “A law enforcement officer in effecting an arrest or in preventing an escape from custody is justified in using deadly force only …. when he reasonably believes that such use of deadly force is immediately necessary to effect the arrest and also reasonably believes that the person to be arrested (a) has committed or attempted to commit a felony; or (b) is attempting to escape by use of a deadly weapon; or (c) may otherwise endanger life or inflict serious physical injury unless arrested without delay.”

http://news.stlpublicradio.org/post/whats-grand-jury-how-will-it-work-ferguson-case

So MB fits the law both in A and B.


And if it is true that MB attempted to escape but turned around and came back toward OW then IMO he had every right to shoot him. He had already been attacked by MB once so he knew he was dangerous.

Good evening Ocean. Good to see you on again.

I think it worthy to note that OW was attacked within his vehicle and did not have a chance to frisk him or know if or what weapons he may have had on him. For all he knew MB could have had a knife or have pulled a gun while facing the other way. When MB turned back around he only knew he was an imminent threat due to his actions prior to.

JMO's

 

[DebinGA]

What if they were for assaulting a police officer? I don't know what they are for certain and don't mean to imply otherwise, but something like that might be relevant.

http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-Ferguson-Missouri.html

Murders/rape rates are relatively low in Ferguson, but thefts/robberies are sky high. Maybe locals don't even think of stealing from a business as a crime.

 

[EvilSoup]

I for one have never been told to go vote at a funeral. Sure seemed more like a political function to me.
I have never been to a funeral for a person who was murdered where victims of other crimes were brought up either.
I also would never attend a funeral when I didn't know the victim/deceased.
A funeral should be about that person only.
I am a little sad for MB about that.

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I probably would not attend a funeral of someone with whom I was not personally acquainted.
However, a friend of mine went to the funeral of Dale Earnhardt. He was a huge race fan and traveled 4 hours to attend.

Somehow, he unknowingly ended up in the receiving line, and could not figure out why so many people were shaking his hand and offering condolences.


He figured it out much later and was mortified. :what:

 

[gngr~snap]

police said there was a shooting inside the car from the get go. I missed this.

"CHIEF JON BELMAR, ST. LOUIS COUNTY POLICE: Yesterday, about noon, in the 2900 block of Canfield, a Ferguson police officer had an encounter with two individuals on the street.
In fact, one of those individuals at the time came in -- as the officer was exiting his police car, allegedly pushed the police officer back into the car, where he physically assaulted the police officer.

It is our understanding at this point in the investigation that within the police car there was a struggle over the officer's weapon. There was at least one shot fired within the car."

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1408/12/lvab.02.html

All posts are MOO

 

[bettybaby00]

Mark O'Mara George Zimmerman's defense atty was on CNN just now.
He said "police in MO not only have the right to use force when they are assaulted and may have well happened in this case, but they have the obligation to arrest when they see a felony occur. And that includes the one that may have occurred on them."
"So yes, they have very particular privileges, if you will, or protections because we give them the awesome responsibility of enforcing the law on the street and we tell them to arrest people that should be arrested. And in this case if in fact there was a tussle, an assault of some sort on the officer at the car, he not only has the right but the obligation to effectuate the arrest."
He reminds Sunny H that if there was strike to the face that is a felony. Class 1 felony in Mo.
Also reminds Sunny H. that eyewitness testimony can be unreliable especially if an emotional situation, unless every eyewitness says the same thing, then it can be compelling. Ex. If 5 people said the light was red, it was probably red.

I always appreciate his perspective, Sonny H. not so much.

 

[RANCH]

That's why I wish we could see a drawing or photo that shows the scene where we knew we were definitely looking at OW's car and then measure that to MB's body using google earth. I think I'm clear on which car was OW's, but can't be 100% sure and the angles of the photos used don't let me get a good landmark to compare to the google map image.

I'd like to see that information as well. Like I said, the distance between the two is only part of the equation. If MB was in fact "rushing" at a good speed towards officer Wilson, it will make a difference in whether this was a justifiable police shooting to me.

If MB was walking back towards at a slow pace it could mean that Wilson could have used other tactics. JMO.

 

[DebinGA]

When I found out Baden was going to do the family's autopsy, I was pretty confident that he would be objective.

By now, after seeing him say some of the things he's said, most notably, his statements about Wilson, I've completely lost trust in him. It makes me sad and a little angry.

Baden lost me long ago when testifying for OJ about multiple killers with multiple knives, and more recently that gun psycho Phil Spector's victim, who'd just met him that night, could have put a pistol in her mouth and committed suicide in his foyer with him looking on.

 

[CARIIS]

I had a lot misperceptions about a grand jury.We here together learned about it. The media obviously has not, nor do the residents of Fersusion.


The media keeps messing this up. We have to wait for G/J before we know the facts.



Grand Juries are done in total complete secrecy. When done they release nothing.

There will be two utterances at its occlusion - indict (alright three utterances!) do not indict. Period.



No information will be released, nothing more than we know now.



The notion of "expectations" in this suturation, is huge.


If do not indict is the answer, with that being the only information provided we are right back (as far as belief systems go) we have been the last three weeks--except with more vigor (scary). It will, reinforce the notion that "whites' have rigged everything /


Another thing I learned today (CNN) is it takes 9 people to go one or other ---great there are 9 whites, and three AA.



It is a bright group I need say no more



Big trouble


An in relfelcection in thinking back when asked about arrest history intially the answer was none..As time passed the answer to that question changed to juv records are sealed hummm

 

[Linda7NJ]

I probably would not attend a funeral of someone with whom I was not personally acquainted.
However, a friend of mine went to the funeral of Dale Earnhardt. He was a huge race fan and traveled 4 hours to attend.

Somehow, he unknowingly ended up in the receiving line, and could not figure out why so many people were shaking his hand and offering condolences.


He figured it out much later and was mortified. :what:

I only go to people that I know, if I know and care about their loved ones....If I do go...I never approach the casket. I'm there solely for those left behind.


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[oceanblueeyes]

Good evening Ocean. Good to see you on again.

I think it worthy to note that OW was attacked within his vehicle and did not have a chance to frisk him or know if or what weapons he may have had on him. For all he knew MB could have had a knife or have pulled a gun while facing the other way. When MB turned back around he only knew he was an imminent threat due to his actions prior to.

JMO's

Imo, you are totally correct...my friend.

And if it turns out that a shot was fired from inside the patrol car due to OW having to tussle with MB in order to keep his weapon then that is deadly serious and could have wound up getting OW killed. Thank goodness he was able to keep his weapon in the struggle.

 

[TheDuchess]

I probably would not attend a funeral of someone with whom I was not personally acquainted.
However, a friend of mine went to the funeral of Dale Earnhardt. He was a huge race fan and traveled 4 hours to attend.

Somehow, he unknowingly ended up in the receiving line, and could not figure out why so many people were shaking his hand and offering condolences.


He figured it out much later and was mortified. :what:

OMG that was about the funniest thing I've heard in a long while!!! Thanks so much for sharing, as I think I really needed that laugh!!! :laughing:

 

[bettybaby00]

police said there was a shooting inside the car from the get go. I missed this.

"CHIEF JON BELMAR, ST. LOUIS COUNTY POLICE: Yesterday, about noon, in the 2900 block of Canfield, a Ferguson police officer had an encounter with two individuals on the street.
In fact, one of those individuals at the time came in -- as the officer was exiting his police car, allegedly pushed the police officer back into the car, where he physically assaulted the police officer.

It is our understanding at this point in the investigation that within the police car there was a struggle over the officer's weapon. There was at least one shot fired within the car."

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1408/12/lvab.02.html

All posts are MOO

BBM

If true, this is the piece that is going to make this shooting justifiable. As has been cited, assaulting an officer is felony, add in trying to grab their gun, and a shot is discharged/fired and it becomes a "point of no return scenario."

Someone commits these act is going to be considered an extreme threat, and the officer can't decide to just "let him go," b/c he's fleeing.

The assault and trying to get his gun, and the subsequent shooting can't be considered as two separate events. As much as Crump, Parks, and DJs lawyers try to argue that what happened at the car "isn't what got him killed," the reality is, it's exactly what got him killed.

JMO

 

[UdbCrzy2]

Terrible message for the youth coming up.Instead of making him out to be amartyr, they should be addressing how MB bad choices led to his death.How will things like this ever stop if being a thief and assaulting a police officer turns him into a hero. I also think fund raising beyond the cost of a funeral and a few weeks pay sends an equally bad message.Parents lose children in many ways and they are not given hundreds of thousands of dollars especially when they die committing a crime.Very bad message they are sending out to the youth.Crime does pay it seems.

The family attorney would not want that to be said with the pending lawsuits. They are looking for a settlement and will continue with what they are saying about their 'view' of what happened.

 

[Phoebeb]

Yes, if he was walking back slowly with his hands in the air, I would think DW would say to stop moving, get down on knees, hands behind head, etc. If MB wanted to surrender, I don't get why he wouldn't just stop in his tracks with his hands up and not turn around. Just "freeze" is what I would do I think.

I'd like to see that information as well. Like I said, the distance between the two is only part of the equation. If MB was in fact "rushing" at a good speed towards officer Wilson, it will make a difference in whether this was a justifiable police shooting to me.

If MB was walking back towards at a slow pace it could mean that Wilson could have used other tactics. JMO.

 

[SStarr33]

JMO Somebody said OW is communicating? With whom? STARR you usually are up on this stuff do you know anything about it? Also, any more about "Josie" aka Jill?? Thanks. JMO

Nope, only thing new I haven't shared is that Daryl Parks picked up a new eyewitness today at the funeral. He said it on CNN this evening--no links out yet.