Malaysia Flight MH17 shot down in Ukraine. 298 aboard. 7/17/2014 - #1

[zwiebel]

I hadn't seen this FB post from Dmitry Medvedev, prime minister of Russia before. The English version is underneath the Russian one. It's been edited now and I never saw the original version. It basically says any economic sanctions against Russia are evil and illegitimate and will not help Ukraine. "Not at all."

It seems to me he is referencing the plane crash without actually mentioning it, and it seems a rather cold and strange statement. Even ominous? He has linked it via his twitter, which has a condolence tweet on the crash.

https://www.facebook.com/Dmitry.Medvedev/posts/10152163640331851?notif_t=notify_me

 

[Steely Dan]

Yes, why is Abbott voicing such strong words against Russia? He started it yesterday and it didn't seem in keeping with the more measured tone of the other world leaders. Julie Bishop was exasperated that she couldn't speak to anyone in the Russian Foreign Ministry. Um, I would suggest that's because our government was the pointing the finger at them. We are not a big or powerful country. I don't like that Abbott is making these remarks on the world stage on our behalf.

I think Abbott is the first one. Obama had some strong words today too. I wouldn't be surprised if David Cameron has strong words soon as well as Angela Merkel and even Shinzo Abe might come out with words.

Now that Japan has changed it's military rules and can go after other countries that pose a threat this could be the first test of that power through the bully pulpit. JMO

BTW, here's an article on Japan's recent change in foreign policy; http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/02/world/asia/japan-moves-to-permit-greater-use-of-its-military.html

 

[Trident]

Yes dear Steely you have met older than dirt...... I agree this is an opportunity for good people to confront the bad boy (Putin) by showing up in white hats
but let's outclass him

I no longer believe any hat is pure white. There is enough dirt, one way or another, to besmirch them all.

 

[ZaZara]

The missile that brought down MH17 was produced by a company named ROSTEC.
Headquarters of ROSTEC are in AMSTERDAM, ZUIDAS-location.
Distance to SCHIPHOL AMSTERDAM AIRPORT from where MH17 left is about 12 kms.


925 reports:
http://925.nl/archief/2014/07/18/dodelijke-raket-mh17-met-de-groeten-van-de-zuidas

De maker van de dodelijke raketten (en nog veel meer naar wapentuig) zit gewoon op de Zuidas. Dankzij een reeks daar gevestigde bv’s hoeft dat bedrijf, het Russische Rostec minder belasting te betalen.

Translation:

The maker of the deadly missile (and more ugly weaponry) is located simply on the Zuidas. Thanks to a series of private limited companies they have established there, that company, the Russian Rostec to pay less tax.

Elk van de potentiële wapens worden wereldwijd verkocht aan landen die door de VS en de EU worden geboycot en daarom geen westerse wapens mogen kopen, zoals Noord-Korea. Rusland heeft al die producten gebundeld in het bedrijf Rosboronexport.

De aandelen van dat bedrijf zijn voor 100% in handen van een ander bedrijf, Rostec. Dat behartigt de belangen van alle Russische bedrijven, niet alleen de wapenindustrie. Dat bedrijf wordt sinds gisteren geboycot door de VS. De zetel van de directeur, Sergey Chemezov, bevindt zich op de Amsterdamse Zuidas, aan de Jachthavenweg 130. Door een zetel in Nederland kan het bedrijf gebruik maken van de Nederlandse deelnemingsvrijstelling. Zo helpen we Rostec om minder belasting over de winst te hoeven betalen.

Translation:

Each of the potential lethal weapons are sold worldwide to countries that are boycotted by the US and the EU and therefore cannot buy Western weapons, such as North Korea. Russia has bundled all those products in the company Rosboronexport.

The shares of that company are 100% owned by another company, Rostec. That represents the interests of all Russian companies, not just the arms industry. Since yesterday that company is boycotted by the US. The seat of the Director, Sergey Chemezov, is Amsterdam's Zuidas, on the Jachthavenweg 130. Because of their seat in the Netherlands the company can use the Dutch participation exemption. So we help Rostec to having to pay less tax on the profit.

List of weapons on offer:
http://www.roe.ru/mmc/index.html


The Dutch Parliament is on vacation.
They are not coming back for a debate or to question the Government.

To many who know The Netherlands, this us no surprise.
The Netherlands cherish the image of a peaceful nation, yet when it comes to trade and profit and tax-havens for international companies like ROSTEC we are participating in almost every conflict on this planet.

 

[zwiebel]

Hearing news on the radio - 38 bodies have been 'taken away', probably to a mortuary in Kiev.

Both sides are accusing the other of being responsible, but as pro-Russian rebels are in complete control of the area, I think there can only be one group able to have done that.

BBC Radio News. Site is too slow to link at moment.

 

[Steely Dan]

Yes dear Steely you have met older than dirt...... I agree this is an opportunity for good people to confront the bad boy (Putin) by showing up in white hats
but let's outclass him

Just a couple things here.

First, I guess you are saying that I'm on the cusp of older than dirt. :snooty: HARUMPH! I reiterate, HARUMPH! :snooty:

Second, a dog lighting his own farts could outclass Putin.

 

[Trident]

The missile that brought down MH17 was produced by a company named ROSTEC.
Headquarters of ROSTEC are in AMSTERDAM, ZUIDAS-location.
Distance to SCHIPHOL AMSTERDAM AIRPORT from where MH17 left is about 12 kms.


925 reports:
http://925.nl/archief/2014/07/18/dodelijke-raket-mh17-met-de-groeten-van-de-zuidas



Translation:





Translation:



List of weapons on offer:
http://www.roe.ru/mmc/index.html


The Dutch Parliament is on vacation.
They are not coming back for a debate or to question the Government.

To many who know The Netherlands, this us no surprise.
The Netherlands cherish the image of a peaceful nation, yet when it comes to trade and profit and tax-havens for international companies like ROSTEC we are participating in almost every conflict on this planet.[/QUOTE]

How sadly ironic.

 

[zwiebel]

Here is the BBC website link. It's been crashing under 'abnormal traffic.' I wonder if that's because of the plane crash?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/

 

[Steely Dan]

I no longer believe any hat is pure white. There is enough dirt, one way or another, to besmirch them all.

JMO, but Putin's hat is darker than an all black cat on a moonless and starless night.

The missile that brought down MH17 was produced by a company named ROSTEC.
Headquarters of ROSTEC are in AMSTERDAM, ZUIDAS-location.
Distance to SCHIPHOL AMSTERDAM AIRPORT from where MH17 left is about 12 kms.


925 reports:
http://925.nl/archief/2014/07/18/dodelijke-raket-mh17-met-de-groeten-van-de-zuidas



Translation:





Translation:



List of weapons on offer:
http://www.roe.ru/mmc/index.html


The Dutch Parliament is on vacation.
They are not coming back for a debate or to question the Government.

To many who know The Netherlands, this us no surprise.
The Netherlands cherish the image of a peaceful nation, yet when it comes to trade and profit and tax-havens for international companies like ROSTEC we are participating in almost every conflict on this planet.

Thanks wasn't enough. That's a great read and something I didn't know about The Netherlands.

 

[zwiebel]

'In a statement, the Ukrainian government complained that "the terrorists" had taken 38 bodies to a morgue in the rebel-held city of Donetsk.

It said the rebels were also trying to transport the plane's wreckage to Russia.'

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-28383625

 

[newone]

I no longer believe any hat is pure white. There is enough dirt, one way or another, to besmirch them all.

Sad to say I agree with you....some of us just keep praying harder
so many of us ''common people'' do have white hats that match our hearts

 

[zwiebel]

'KUALA LUMPUR, Malaysia - Malaysian authorities were alarmed that officials were not being given proper access to the MH17 crash site in eastern Ukraine, a government source told NBC News on Saturday. "Malaysia is increasingly concerned about the recovery of bodies and the fact that they are not being treated with dignity and respect.'

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/uk...rried-mh17-bodies-not-treated-dignity-n160096

 

[newone]

Just a couple things here.

First, I guess you are saying that I'm on the cusp of older than dirt. :snooty: HARUMPH! I reiterate, HARUMPH! :snooty:

Second, a dog lighting his own farts could outclass Putin.

au contraire darling....you are younger than older than dirt

I'm older than dirt....

 

[Steely Dan]

'In a statement, the Ukrainian government complained that "the terrorists" had taken 38 bodies to a morgue in the rebel-held city of Donetsk.

It said the rebels were also trying to transport the plane's wreckage to Russia.'

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-28383625

BBM

I'm very glad to hear that, because it's the exact worst thing they can do. Putin might have been able to extricate his :butthead: from this if he had fully cooperated and helped determine that rebels had actually done it.

This looks like he's going into cover up mode overdrive. That's a big, big mistake right now. JMO

 

[Lyra500]

I have seen nothing to back this up. It's only a guess. They might be trying to bargain site access for a: "It was an unfortunate accident by rebels who believed they were under attack by the Ukrainian air force, and that's what caused the problem. We now close this case." I don't think they'll get far with that. They can't hold out much longer.

I have just seen film of the rebel commander on the site turning OSCE investigators away and telling them if they remain they will be "dealth with accordingly".

If the rebels are so blameless, why won't they allow the experts to carry out the investigation?

And if they were not responsible for shooting down the plane (as both they and Russia keep stating) why are they removing evidence from the site without having agreed the parameters of the investigation in an open and transparent way?

 

[ZaZara]

JMO, but Putin's hat is darker than an all black cat on a moonless and starless night.



Thanks wasn't enough. That's a great read and something I didn't know about The Netherlands.

Steely, the Dutch Parliament is on vacation. They are not returning. Among the 193 Dutch who were killed was Willem Witteveen, member of the Senate......

The Dutch PM has been praised for his restraint.
His words can be interpreted differently:
He was carefully trying to avoid offending anyone, including Russia.
He later announced that he will 'leave no stone unturned'.
Sure, and pigs will fly.

 

[newone]

'KUALA LUMPUR, Malaysia - Malaysian authorities were alarmed that officials were not being given proper access to the MH17 crash site in eastern Ukraine, a government source told NBC News on Saturday. "Malaysia is increasingly concerned about the recovery of bodies and the fact that they are not being treated with dignity and respect.'

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/uk...rried-mh17-bodies-not-treated-dignity-n160096

forgive me: but what is the sudden interest???

they didn't seem to have the same level of interest in MH370 .... I am very very aware of the need of proper rest within 24 hours in Muslim religion but this latest ''protest'' from Malaysia is ''lame''((MOO))


MAL is self serving and fake (MOO)

 

[Steely Dan]

'KUALA LUMPUR, Malaysia - Malaysian authorities were alarmed that officials were not being given proper access to the MH17 crash site in eastern Ukraine, a government source told NBC News on Saturday. "Malaysia is increasingly concerned about the recovery of bodies and the fact that they are not being treated with dignity and respect.'

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/uk...rried-mh17-bodies-not-treated-dignity-n160096

Even better. Keep handling this in the worst possible way Vladimir. It's helping us to get your :butthead: out of office. One way or another.

 

[Steely Dan]

forgive me: but what is the sudden interest???

they didn't seem to have the same level of interest in MH370 .... I am very very aware of the need of proper rest within 24 hours in Muslim religion but this latest ''protest'' from Malaysia is ''lame''((MOO))


MAL is self serving and fake (MOO)

I don't know why, but it could be for a couple of reasons. One is to draw attention away MH370 and towards this, which wasn't their fault at all.

The other one I can think of is that they've been quietly asked to add their voices to the escalating worldwide outrage. They are probably going to go public about everything the Russians do to keep them away. JMO

 

[zwiebel]

The conversation with the Dutch PM was the subject of the Kremlin's last tweet, which was a long 18 hours ago.

https://mobile.twitter.com/KremlinRussia_E