CO - Jessica Ridgeway, 10, Westminster, 5 Oct 2012 - #19

[tlcya]

I personally don't care if he was hung upside down by his toes every day of his life. It is no defense for what he has done. A lot of people grow up in very dysfunctional families and don't turn out to be sycophants who murder.

So, it wasn't sexually motivated then. Even more sickening that it appears to be a thrill kill. UGH
[/B]

I agree, whatever created this montrous darkness in no way mitigates what he has done. That said, i don't think anyone is attempting to "excuse"AS or his crimes. Part of what interests many of us here, after arrest, is what made the perp who he has become. What factors played a role in his becoming someone so heinous? Maybe, just maybe, if we can answer those questions we can halt this before it ends in the death of a lovely young child.

I haven' t seen anyone trying to excuse AS - only members asking why, how, could this have been prevented?

IMO it is not enough to solve crimes. We as a society need to arm ourselves with knowledge with an eye towards prevention.

 

[CHERIE.T]

I personally don't care if he was hung upside down by his toes every day of his life. It is no defense for what he has done. A lot of people grow up in very dysfunctional families and don't turn out to be sycophants who murder.

So, it wasn't sexually motivated then. Even more sickening that it appears to be a thrill kill. UGH
[/B]

Yes ma'm , it seems it was a thrill kill.

 

[Boodles]

If I were his mother, I don't think I could stay in the house!

I hope she has some serious support in the way of family and/or friends...ugh, that poor woman.

 

[matou]

Sigg does not appear on any Colorado sex offender lists and since he is a juvenile, his previous record has been sealed.

He is being held at the Mount View Youth Services Detention Center.

So he has a criminal history?

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/new...ent-in-jessica-ridgeway-abduction-murder-case

 

[Wondergirl]

I believe he was possibly analyzing the decomposition of his poor victim.

How awful.

Sigg also took forensic science class last year at WarrenTech. A classmate who took the course with Sigg says they studied DNA and crime scenes.

Meaghan Barker said Sigg did a project exploring how bodies decompose. He used skinned rats and placed them in several different environments, including freezing temperatures, covered in dirt and out in the open.

http://www.9news.com/rss/article/29...ate?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

 

[perfectingpink]

The parents of a murderer also lose their child, either to death penalty or imprisonment, and definitely lose the child they thought they had. I do not even want to address the idea of parents being complicit, because I think that is terribly, terribly unfair.

JMO

I have struggled for a while this evening trying to decide how to address the idea of parental complicity with an offender equal to the one discussed here.

I do agree it must be difficult for parents of offenders to admit the child they raised was capable of horrific things. However, what experience has shown me is nature, nurture and denial all play a strong role in the development of a child who becomes a murder. One of my cousins murdered a wonderfully sweet girl and I guarantee you all of those things played a factor. I have never been shy to state my opinion of this and I never will!!

 

[Foxfire]

I personally don't care if he was hung upside down by his toes every day of his life. It is no defense for what he has done. A lot of people grow up in very dysfunctional families and don't turn out to be sycophants who murder.

So, it wasn't sexually motivated then. Even more sickening that it appears to be a thrill kill. UGH
[/B]

donnam, it doesn't mean the motive was not sexual.. If & when the truth is revealed about Austin Reed Sigg, I believe we are all in for a very bumpy ride..
Guess, about all we know so far is that he was aware of jurisdictional blindness, deflective, and prolly a collector.. ARS was forensically aware, but left dna at least, at two crime scenes, which indicates a beginner, imo. Time will tell..
Now that we know who he is. Due to his immaturity and physical description. It makes sense that he lowered his victim preference to a child after being overpowered in May 2012, by the adult female jogger..

 

[SmoothOperator]

This 17 yr old monster got "lucky."

Turns out the perp was not someone who:

- knew the mother's schedule of working
- knew that JR's mother turned off her cell phone or put it elsewhere so she could get some sleep & plotted the crime based on that
- was a classmate's father
- was a member of the Ridgeway family
- was a member of the clergy
- didn't have a vehicle
- had murdered any other children
- was a RSO
- had previous prison time
- was sophisticated
- was leaving secret messages
- followed JR on foot that morning
- was in a gang
- was part of a drug or gun running or Mexican cartel
- was being initiated into some gang and this was his test

Again i would respectfully reiterate that MANY OF THE LIST ENTRIES ABOVE along with other entries listed earlier are by no means whatsoever KNOWN BY ANY OF US HERE..nor will many of them be known to us in any valid capacity til the time when all information and details of the entire crime and the perpetrator who committed said crimes will be known to the public via trial(should this go to trial)..

Until then with the details of these crimes being officially sealed its merely speculation at best wrt many of the list entries..

 

[SailorMoon]

at first I thought "what kind of 17 year old is up and about at 8:30am?", then I heard on the news that he drove his brother to school every morning. That's why :/

Haven't heard this but I wondered why he would be up as well and figured he was going to class or something. Like I said - I feel so sorry the lil brother. I know my lil one would be devastated if he his brother did anything bad. So hard for them to understand. Heck, who does??

 

[Pensfan]

With respect, this particular crime (in its totality -- not just the murder) appears far too organized to be the work of someone with a psychotic disorder. 17 is also on the younger end of the spectrum when discussing the onset of a psychotic disorder -- although certainly not implausible. I am putting my bet on a diagnosis of antisocial personality disorder, as characterized by at least 3 of the following:

1) Callous unconcern for the feelings of others.
2) Gross and persistent attitude of irresponsibility and disregard for social norms, rules, and obligations.
3) Incapacity to maintain enduring relationships, though having no difficulty in establishing them.
4) Very low tolerance to frustration and a low threshold for discharge of aggression, including violence.
5) Incapacity to experience guilt or to profit from experience, particularly punishment.
6) Markedly prone to blame others or to offer plausible rationalizations for the behavior that has brought the person into conflict with society

I would also not be surprised by an above-average IQ with this one....

There are hundreds of children under 18 in locked psychiatric wards right now with the correct diagnosis of schizophrenia or schizophreniform disorder.

People suffering from delusions can appear to be very normal UNTIL the subject of their delusion is brought into the conversation. Such delusional people get up every morning, eat their breakfast, take a shower, and finish the rest of their activities of daily living with the delusion occupying their mind. It is incorrect to think that people suffering with delusions are grossly disorganized in every aspect of their lives and incapable of hiding their crimes. Recent top headline crimes show they are capable of accumulating huge arsenals of weapons, driving long distances to participate in their delusions, and secretly grabbing victims on busy streets like in Brooklyn.

Pensfan
verified psychiatric mental health nurse

 

[NC Analyzer]

This 17 yr old monster got "lucky."

Turns out the perp was not someone who:

- knew the mother's schedule of working
- knew that JR's mother turned off her cell phone or put it elsewhere so she could get some sleep & plotted the crime based on that
- was a classmate's father
- was a member of the Ridgeway family
- was a member of the clergy
- didn't have a vehicle
- had murdered any other children
- was a RSO
- had previous prison time
- was sophisticated
- was leaving secret messages
- followed JR on foot that morning
- was in a gang
- was part of a drug or gun running or Mexican cartel
- was being initiated into some gang and this was his test

Have to say, I agree with all of these points. :rocker:

 

[gitana1]

Ironically the most visceral one is that from the paternal great-grandmother of Jessica. :-#

Well, I can excuse family, no matter how far up the tree.

I believe that the prevailing theory on psychopathy is that it is the result of both genetics and environment.

So take someone who does not have a genetic predisposition, give them a horrible childhood and no psychopathy. Take someone who does have genes predisposing them and give them an adequate childhood, no psychopathy.

Take someone who has the genetic predispostion, combine it with childhood trauma and... high risk for psychopathy. In this theory, it's a perfect storm type combination.

I don't think it is an excuse, which to me implies some sort of "well, it's okay" quality. I do think there are reasons, which do not make it okay but can point the way to how to prevent such things from happening.

I can honestly say that I have never wanted to seriously harm anyone or anything in my entire life. I'm not making a decision not to murder anyone, I'm genuinely not at all interested in doing so.

Since I am the only person whose head I can actually peek into, I tend to assume that the vast majority of people don't have any wish to murder. And that is why most people don't commit murder.

I know it's idealistic to think that things like psychopathy could someday be prevented or at least treated so that no one would be hurt but hey, I come from a religious tradition that says that the truly enlightened will refuse nirvana until all living beings are ready to enter it together (Mahayana Buddhism).

<humming "Imagine">

I don't actually disagree with you. At least not totally. I believe that if caught early enough, at risk kids or kids diagnosed with conduct disorder, but still young, can be treated or criminal conduct prevented through a change in their brain waves. I'm basing that on things I have read by Dr. Robert Hare.

But while you may not be using it as an excuse, per se, I think some kind of do. At least, in the sense that due to whatever diagnoses the perp had, he or she had no choice. Except in extreme cases, I disagree with that.

I also think a lot of people jump to grasp onto a psychiatric or psychological explanation for such evil acts because then they can comfort themselves that none of their kids or loved ones could do such a thing. Or, that if they did, there would be a rational reason. A mental problem of some sort.

I know you said you don't believe in evil (IIRC). The alternative though, is lack of choice because all evil is is extreme, profound immortality. I believe that in 99.9999999999999% of murder cases, choice exists.

What about his demeanor or actions makes you think that he will be diagnosed?

Not being snarky but since your verifed as a Mental Health Expert would love your thoughts on why.

That Finnish study on teenagers who murder linked above would suggest the probability that this killer is either personality disordered (sociopathic, narcissistic, borderline, which is not insane, IMO), or not mentally ill at all. Only 7% of the homicidal teenagers they studied were schizophrenic.

I have to defer to experts though, like Pensfan and Rougelatete. Hopefully, they will reach a consensus!!!!!!

 

[Wondergirl]

From his friend:

They also examined the contents of what looks like a construction trash bin across the street from Sigg's home.

AC, 17, is a student at Standley Lake High School and said Sigg used to attend there.

AC has known Sigg since elementary school, although he said they have been out of touch the last year.

When AC heard the news of Sigg's arrest, he said he thought, "God, don't let it be him," then "Why?"

AC said Sigg "was always egotistical, but I never thought he would go this far." He added, "I'd expect him to get into a fight before leaving high school &#8212; not murder someone."

He said Sigg was really into Japanese culture like anime, and liked play computer games. The two shared an interest in collecting knives.

"We got into a lot of verbal fights," AC recalled.


Read more: Police: Suspect in Jessica Ridgeway murder is 17-year-old boy - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_21844711/arrest-made-jessica-ridgeway-case#ixzz2AGugUPRy
Read The Denver Post's Terms of Use of its content: http://www.denverpost.com/termsofuse

 

[GrainneDhu]

This 17 yr old monster got "lucky."

Turns out the perp was not someone who:

- knew the mother's schedule of working
- knew that JR's mother turned off her cell phone or put it elsewhere so she could get some sleep & plotted the crime based on that
- was a classmate's father
- was a member of the Ridgeway family
- was a member of the clergy
- didn't have a vehicle
- had murdered any other children
- was a RSO
- had previous prison time
- was sophisticated
- was leaving secret messages
- followed JR on foot that morning
- was in a gang
- was part of a drug or gun running or Mexican cartel
- was being initiated into some gang and this was his test

My sample is definitely skewed since it is mine. But with that in mind...

I have followed far more cases where the perp benefited from the way circumstances happened to fall together than I have read about cases where the perp meticulously planned and carried out their crime with great skill.

Even in cases where the perp premeditates, such as the murders of Jo Ann and Adrienne Bain, it usually reads more like the Three Stooges than some sort of criminal mastermind.

There are almost always elements of a crime scene that seem like it just could not possibly have happened randomly and yet, time after time, it turns out that yes, things really did happen that randomly.

 

[LotusPawprint]

Omg, Criminal minds is on now and
is about a perp having mortician training and well....

I don't know why I foolishly decided to watch tonight's episode. Bad idea! Really bad idea.

 

[Isabelle]

wonder if this mother ever reported this?
instincts are sometimes right on point!

If the mom reported her daughter saying the perp had a creepy stare, LE couldn't do anything at all. I might be tempted to ask him to not be around when my child was out, but that could provoke him. My poor granddaughter won't be going anywhere alone until I don't know when.

 

[Jules71]

I had to pause it, but it is so obvious.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4O7cCZAqWGQ

Wow! Thanks for posting this! I bet his family did recognize the cross. What is the date of this vid?

Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2

 

[matou]

Sigg's former classmates at Standley Lake High said he was smart and nice and walked and talked to kids who looked like they were alone. He enjoyed computers, liked computer games, helped in the computer lab and bragged about his skills to hack into computer programs.

They say Sigg walked his younger brother to school every day.

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/new...ent-in-jessica-ridgeway-abduction-murder-case

 

[cluciano63]

I am anxious to learn more about this suspect; so far, there has been nothing released that shows him to be off-the-charts unusual, other than possibly a child saying he looked at her strangely, and to be honest, I am not 100% convinced that the child ID'd this particular suspect. But even if true-so far, he sounds like a quiet, slightly odd teenager whose parents would probably have seen as "doing his own thing" "introspective" "unusual" etc...the type of teenage boy that many people have living in their homes. Yes, his interests seem unusual, but forensics is very hot right now, so that in itself is not that creepy, without knowing what we know now.

So, what are the warning signs here? Are there any?

 

[Theforeigner]

Christopher Wayne Jones, 28, arrested in connection with the Fort Collins robbery.

"FORT COLLINS -- On Wednesday afternoon, Fort Collins Police arrested 28-year-old Christopher Wayne Jones of Fort Collins for the October 18 armed robbery of the One Stop Gas Station, 2025 S. College Avenue, according to a press release from Fort Collins Police.

Jones was contacted by Fort Collins Police Wednesday morning at approximately 8:30 and voluntarily came to the police station for a consensual interview where he was later arrested around 4 p.m."

So, it is not AS.

http://www.reporterherald.com/news/...her-wayne-jones-arrested-fort-collins-robbery

Yes I saw that, and I belive that is probably correct, however I find it kind of odd that Fort Collins Police choose NOT to share a mugshot, bc PD usualy do share a mugshot to the media when the guy is caught, , especially when they have officially put out a picture of the criminal and asked the population to help give tips/info on the criminal.
Well I guess they got their guy, but the picture they sent out IMHO, INDEED looked a LOT line Austin Reed Sigg.