Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #38

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MoM3tzger said:
Researched “pink frothy sputum (thick mucus) ” which led me to Pulmonary Edema and that led me to AC’s autopsy report where Cause of Death states “Bilateral Pulmonary Thromboemboli” which is also known as pulmonary embolism.

A comparison of Pulmonary Edema and Embolism found:

>Both can result in discharging pink frothy sputum/mucus

>Pulmonary embolism (AC) mimics the features of acute pulmonary edema (TD?) but has been rarely reported

Poisons and drugs can cause pulmonary embolism—specifically ethylene glycol and propylene glycol toxicity—according to the Agency for Toxic Substances and Disease Registry.

I hope the investigators read read this thread.

*******************************************************************
Source: American Journal of Emergency Medicine
Snipped from paid article: “We report a patient who presented with typical features of cardiogenic pulmonary edema; however, massive pulmonary embolism was ultimately diagnosed. Pulmonary embolism masquerading as acute pulmonary edema has been rarely reported...
...Patients in whom pulmonary embolism mimics the features of pulmonary edema represent a subset raising strong diagnostic challenges.”

Source: Agency for Toxic Substances and Disease Registry
Snipped from article:
  • Ethylene glycol poisoning through ingestion can cause noncardiogenic pulmonary edema and ARDS.
  • Ethylene glycol poisoning can cause dysrhythmias and heart failure
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Isn’t that antifreeze?
 
PingTheRouter said:
wow for a family crime forum we talked a lot about gruesome things
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Isn't that the truth! For the second time in my life, and both cases this year I found myself hoping the remains of 3 children were well preserved by being frozen so the better chance of the perpetrator being brought to justice. That is just contrary to the conscious and difficult to reconcile.
 
So I’ve read through the first 3 parts of the timeline twice, and I’m really horrified at too much to post.
But one thing is really hitting me right now. I cannot believe the failure of the police in CV’s murder. It seems clear to me that the man was set up and ambushed. I can’t believe they got away with it. And I can’t believe how hard he fought to get away from her, did so much to protect and care for JJ, only to end up right back into the situation and his own demise. The woman is diabolical. Jmo
 
based on previous reports, Lori does have a history of being a bit histrionic when angry IIRC. She stood in the street and shouted that AC had brought "shame to the family" - wow can you imagine the atrocities? (this was way before children started missing I think)
Her previous divorce parenting plan requested cameras be placed in the home for the safety of the children (ie: Colby & TR)
the text to JJ's Grandparents about not getting any money
the running around the house keeping CV's phone, the taking of the truck/money/flight from CV, etc.
I would absolutely expect this pattern of behavior to continue when she learns that she is in big shot trouble because her kids bodies were just found in the hubs backyard.
I am probably not correct on all the details here but more about a pattern of behavior for Lori.
 
CrimeDawg123 said:
I admit to a fair amount of schadenfreude at watching these two dirt bags incarcerated and going down in flames. Go to ****, *******.
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Schadenfreude means happy for the misery or misfortune of others? I just heard this word in a movie an hour ago and I didnt know what it meant till then. Haha
 
gumchew said:
I think Lori had a psychotic break not long before she met Chad. Or maybe when she met him, maybe even as a result(?) of meeting him. I think Chad's a fantasist and a liar who tells stories to make himself feel bigger and more important. Writing is an obvious outlet for that, but imagine the power you feel when you can find people who will see you and treat you as their prophet in real life!? In Lori, he found someone suggestible who would hang on his every word, have sex with him, and help weaponize his fantasies into action. She was his True Believer. She not only believed everything he said, but was willing to act on it, either directly, or through her brother Alex as a proxy, to violent ends if needed.

Everything we've heard from Melanie Gibb suggests that Lori really believed all the bulls**t that CD was spinning. Her irritatingly smug demeanor in court and elsewhere has always telegraphed "you're all full of crap, because you don't know what I know". Not so much a criminal who thinks they've gotten away with something we can never figure out, but more like "I am not guilty of anything, I have done the right thing, and you can't comprehend that because you are not a Translated Being(tm)".

On the other hand, CD is not so smug. Neither his photos nor his on-camera demeanor suggest that to me. He has always known he was making all this **** up, and that was all OK, right up until the point that Lori/Alex killed Charles. He had purpose-built a narrative to drive her away from her husband and her children... the whole 'zombie' and 'light/dark' scale, his card game rating system including the sexual prowess of Translated Beings (all totally self-serving). The only thing that's not clear to me is whether he knowingly incited her to kill Charles or not. Everything beyond that--to Chad-- was damage control. Tylee, JJ, and Tammy (and maybe Alex) were all big risks and knew too much. They all knew something and they all stood in the way.They had to go. I wonder if Lori even knew that he had killed the kids? Did she believe he really teleported them to the other side of the veil?

What do you all think? Was Lori the mastermind, or did she fall under Chad's spell and things went out of control?
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RSBM

Comparing LV and CD's lives from the excellent timeline in the reference page:

LV. CD is her 5th husband. She had prolonged and major fallings out with two of her ex-husbands involving court cases, serious allegations about her mental health, going missing for periods, being sent for several psych evaluations which she would avoid, custody battles, citings of contempt for violating custody orders, threats of killing someone rather than giving in, physical attacks and killing by her brother, and former friends and family coming forward to state that she seemed obsessed or crazy. This one supposedly dates back the oldest:
2007 – CV’s 2nd ex-wife begins to have concerns about Lori’s mental health. “She just seemed off. There were a lot of strange goings-on at their home to the point that a judge ordered cameras to be put in their home to protect the children,” Cheryl says (East Idaho News).

CD. LV is his 2nd wife. Previously married for 30 years. No reports of conflict with anyone. Made his living mostly by writing books. Very interested in near death experiences, receiving messages from people on the other side, and having prophetic visions and voices.

I don't know how either of these two could be considered 'masterminds', because neither of them seem to act from any truly rational motives. I think LV was chaotic, but in general was motivated to take revenge against people, and would stop at nothing to get her own way. I think CD could persuade himself that he was part of a larger plan, and his desires were justifiable because he was a prophet.
 
Hey Everyone

So Tammy Daybell reportedly had "pink foam" coming out of her mouth.
It was reported by KSL TV but here is the link to the East Idaho News with the link about the pink foam
Joseph Scott Morgan will hopefully join us tonight to tell us what that could mean. I say hopefully because he is traveling and his service might be a bit sketchy. Keep your fingers crossed CLICK HERE TO JOIN US AT 10 PM WASTERN TONIGHT
 
Hrh_LadyJ said:
Yeah, sadly I've been present for a few family members deaths, and never any foam.

I read about Stage 3 of natural death on that Body Farm link, and it stated that after 72hrs (IIRC) the mouth and nose can have fluids coming out, along with blood settling and blackening at lower points of the body.... Gross I know!

But nothing about foaming directly after death.... It does NOT seem natural, IMO!
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I think my neighbor had been dead close to 12 hours when I found her. No foam. She was sitting up, though. I think it was probably a heart attack. Jmo
 
Hippononymous said:
In some circles, this isn't exactly a fringe belief. I know some who definitely believe this way--that the "end of the world" (AKA the second coming of Christ) is imminent.
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It's ALWAYS imminent. That's why end-of-the-world predictions come and go. I'm sure the Depression was considered a sign of the end. WWI, WWII, cancer, polio, AIDS, SARS, Ebola, and CoVid19. Anyone who believes in the predicted rapture will see these events as signs.
 
Hrh_LadyJ said:
Agreed! And I've said it before but Chad is sort of the poster child for Midlife crisis mixed with a very pathetic Beta male, gutless personality. He loved and craved the tiny bit of attention he received from being a 'self proclaimed Prophet'. It was more convenience then true belief...

His NDE was SO PATHETIC! Infact he never claimed to have experienced such a thing until AFTER he published the JR NDE books.... and his brush with death.... wait for it..... A scary wave with mild undertow knocked him into the water.... GIVE ME A BREAK!

Chad is a loser, he wasn't going anywhere and was desperate for a different life.... Well he got one! Too bad he had to run into delusional homicide Barbie.... A very toxic match made in Hades!

Okay, rant over!
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This is only my take on this, and by take, I mean how I feel intuitively combined with facts. Maybe my intuition is only a recollection of similar traits or occurrences from somewhere else.

So, from my past experience with writers, my impression is that Chad could always qualify to himself that he was first most, a writer by profession. So he could excuse himself as a liar, and rather thought of himself as an inspired writer who hoped to make a living selling his books. In his mind, it may have been perfectly legitimate to embellish his accounts of spiritual experiences for book sales, while simultaneously being a real believer in the believer's ability to speak with God and hear back .

I saw his son Garth on You Tube this evening, and doesn't he look like a fine healthy young man? And four other siblings, who you can bet will be the most honest of all among themselves. Somewhere, there is truth there. Garth seemed so cheerful, friendly, and confident. And, unafraid. What kind of parenting is responsible for that attitude?

For some reason, I don't get the feeling that Chad is a psychopath. You would have to be a psychopath to kill those kids that way.

Lori, on the other hand, screams psychopath to me.

They have been separated for several months now, and Chad has had a chance to stand outside of this and honestly look within.

MOO I do think Chad has a conscience, but his ego got in the way of his logic. Lori is a total manipulator.
 
Forever Young said:
This is only my take on this, and by take, I mean how I feel intuitively combined with facts. Maybe my intuition is only a recollection of similar traits or occurrences from somewhere else.

So, from my past experience with writers, my impression is that Chad could always qualify to himself that he was first most, a writer by profession. So he could excuse himself as a liar, and rather thought of himself as an inspired writer who hoped to make a living selling his books. In his mind, it may have been perfectly legitimate to embellish his accounts of spiritual experiences for book sales, while simultaneously being a real believer in the believer's ability to speak with God and hear back .

I saw his son Garth on You Tube this evening, and doesn't he look like a fine healthy young man? And four other siblings, who you can bet will be the most honest of all among themselves. Somewhere, there is truth there. Garth seemed so cheerful, friendly, and confident. And, unafraid. What kind of parenting is responsible for that attitude?

For some reason, I don't get the feeling that Chad is a psychopath. You would have to be a psychopath to kill those kids that way.

Lori, on the other hand, screams psychopath to me.

They have been separated for several months now, and Chad has had a chance to stand outside of this and honestly look within.

MOO I do think Chad has a conscience, but his ego got in the way of his logic. Lori is a total manipulator.
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That video of Garth was really heartbreaking. He was so kind and gracious to random strangers showing up with video cameras at his house. Tammy must have been a great mother.
 
Forever Young said:
This is only my take on this, and by take, I mean how I feel intuitively combined with facts. Maybe my intuition is only a recollection of similar traits or occurrences from somewhere else.

So, from my past experience with writers, my impression is that Chad could always qualify to himself that he was first most, a writer by profession. So he could excuse himself as a liar, and rather thought of himself as an inspired writer who hoped to make a living selling his books. In his mind, it may have been perfectly legitimate to embellish his accounts of spiritual experiences for book sales, while simultaneously being a real believer in the believer's ability to speak with God and hear back .

I saw his son Garth on You Tube this evening, and doesn't he look like a fine healthy young man? And four other siblings, who you can bet will be the most honest of all among themselves. Somewhere, there is truth there. Garth seemed so cheerful, friendly, and confident. And, unafraid. What kind of parenting is responsible for that attitude?

For some reason, I don't get the feeling that Chad is a psychopath. You would have to be a psychopath to kill those kids that way.

Lori, on the other hand, screams psychopath to me.

They have been separated for several months now, and Chad has had a chance to stand outside of this and honestly look within.

MOO I do think Chad has a conscience, but his ego got in the way of his logic. Lori is a total manipulator.
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BBM
I am having a really hard time with wrapping my brain around this part.
No one I have ever met with a conscience has ever buried two children in their backyard. (Of course I have not met the whole world but just saying).
 
Michael0808 said:
So I’ve read through the first 3 parts of the timeline twice, and I’m really horrified at too much to post.
But one thing is really hitting me right now. I cannot believe the failure of the police in CV’s murder. It seems clear to me that the man was set up and ambushed. I can’t believe they got away with it. And I can’t believe how hard he fought to get away from her, did so much to protect and care for JJ, only to end up right back into the situation and his own demise. The woman is diabolical. Jmo
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Agreed, but they did reopen his case..... so better late then never IMO.

Thank god he changed his life insurance policy to Kay.... Black Widow in the end never succeeded in her motive, I only wish he told her, as maybe he'd still be alive!
 
Michael0808 said:
Just wanted to suggest to new people like me that I’ve been going through the timelines on the first page of each thread and the amount of information here is incredible!
I’m finding it helpful to follow along with what others who have been exploring this case here longer are discussing and to learn more than I ever could imagine about the ins and outs of the case, the history of all the people involved, and the investigations. I really can’t think of any other place to get all of this info, it’s awesome! It does take a notebook and a pencil as suggested to me early on lol!

ETA: so much info that really digs deep and far back. Things like this:
2007 – CV’s 2nd ex-wife begins to have concerns about Lori’s mental health. “She just seemed off. There were a lot of strange goings-on at their home to the point that a judge ordered cameras to be put in their home to protect the children,” Cheryl says (East Idaho News).
Just a ton of information leading up to this terrible end result. I know I sound like an advertisement lol! But I’m excited to be digging into all of this information.
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LOL-- Welcome to WS
It is a treasure trove of information thanks to everyone who keeps the media/timelines threads up and running. We are blessed to have them here.
There is also a court date thread and @Niner is AWESOME at keeping that up along with everyone else that keeps it updated.

EDIT--I am trying to find the link to the Court hearing/ Trial thread.
Apparently, I need to clean out my "Watched Thread" queue as there are too many pages and I need to update them LOL
I will keep looking and post it when I find it.
 
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Forever Young said:
This is only my take on this, and by take, I mean how I feel intuitively combined with facts. Maybe my intuition is only a recollection of similar traits or occurrences from somewhere else.

So, from my past experience with writers, my impression is that Chad could always qualify to himself that he was first most, a writer by profession. So he could excuse himself as a liar, and rather thought of himself as an inspired writer who hoped to make a living selling his books. In his mind, it may have been perfectly legitimate to embellish his accounts of spiritual experiences for book sales, while simultaneously being a real believer in the believer's ability to speak with God and hear back .

I saw his son Garth on You Tube this evening, and doesn't he look like a fine healthy young man? And four other siblings, who you can bet will be the most honest of all among themselves. Somewhere, there is truth there. Garth seemed so cheerful, friendly, and confident. And, unafraid. What kind of parenting is responsible for that attitude?

For some reason, I don't get the feeling that Chad is a psychopath. You would have to be a psychopath to kill those kids that way.

Lori, on the other hand, screams psychopath to me.

They have been separated for several months now, and Chad has had a chance to stand outside of this and honestly look within.

MOO I do think Chad has a conscience, but his ego got in the way of his logic. Lori is a total manipulator.
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I respectfully have to disagree with this take on Chad. Based on reading through the timelines and the actions he took throughout his life and the way that he was able to manipulate and control others to get what he wanted , particularly Tammy, I don’t think that he was a real believer in anything but his ability to do just that. I also believe that he killed Tammy.

So as far as psychopath, I can’t diagnose that. I know Tammy is dead and it’s being investigated. I know 2 children have just been dug up in his backyard. The back yard of a house he has been living in everyday. Of a house his children live in.

So as far as parenting, I can only surmise that Tammy was a wonderful mother, And what you are seeing in Garth is a reflection of that. All Jmo.
 
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