Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #107

Discussion in 'Located Persons Discussion' started by Tricia, Apr 22, 2019.

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  1. Tricia

    Tricia Owner Websleuths.com Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    Welcome back to the Delphi Murders discussion thread.

    On the afternoon of Feb. 13th, 2017, best friends Abigail Williams and Liberty German were dropped off at a bridge in the town of Delphi. On Feb 14th their bodies were discovered around noon about 50 feet from the north bank of Deer Creek which is about 0.5 miles from the bridge.
    The Sheriff's office gave a press conference on 4/22/19 and we have some solid information. Please take a look below


    HERE IS THE NEW SKETCH FROM THE PRESS CONFERENCE ON 4/22/19
    [​IMG]


    HERE IS THE NEW AUDIO. IT'S-A BIT LONGER THAN THE FIRST AUDIO:
    https://www.in.gov/isp/files/Delphi_Audio_Edited_2019x3.wav

    Here is the old audio in a loop:

    http://www.in.gov/isp/files/Delphi_male_voice_loop.mp3

    LATEST PRESS CONFERENCE 4/22/19

    FOR MORE CLICK HERE FOR THE CARROL COUNTY SHERIFF'S OFFICE FACEBOOK PAGE.


    Anyone with information about this case, no matter how insignificant, is encouraged to call the Delphi Homicide Investigation Tip Line at (844) 459-5786.

    Information can also be reported by calling the Indiana State Police at(800) 382-7537, or the Carroll County Sheriff's Department at (765) 564-2413.

    Information can also be emailed to Abbyandlibbytip@cacoshrf.com

    video of press conference from 2017 02/22/17: https://www.facebook.com/NewsCenter1...4728963476130/

    Let's do this. Let's commit to getting this killer's picture and voice out there any possible way we can.


    Pictures of Abby and Libby

    link to post with all threads 1-99 (courtesy of margarita25)

    THREAD #84
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    *Media Maps & Timelines*
    IMAGE Discussion Thread
    Scanner Thread
    Rules Etiquette & Information
    Case map by skibaboo updated with grayhuze crime flow video
    grayhuze youtube channel

    Verified Insiders: None in this case at this time. Verified Professional, Member michael.gartley, is a Verified Expert in Imaging Science.

    RULES OF THIS DISCUSSION

    DO NOT post photos of random individuals (including persons featured in MSM articles about other area crimes) to compare to the images of unidentified suspect on the bridge.


    PLEASE DO NOT POST PICTURES OF SEX OFFENDERS!

    Do not sleuth family, PERIOD. This includes previous public records which have nothing to do with this case. They are victims here. Plain and simple.

    4) If you feel you have a tip, by all means, phone it in. Do NOT discuss your tip here. Contact the authorities and give them time to follow your lead.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 21, 2019
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  2. Tricia

    Tricia Owner Websleuths.com Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    There is a lot to discuss in the Delphi case with all the very big developments.

    We have a very strong rule on Websleuths. Do not ask someone to PM you on a discussion thread. Why? You saw what happens on this thread. The thread was almost taken over by people saying "PM ME PM ME". We couldn't keep up with removing the posts.
    If you want someone to PM you then what you do is you PRIVATE MESSAGE THEM FIRST and ask them whatever.

    You do not stop the whole discussion and ask someone to PM you.

    We will be giving long time-outs to anyone who says they have the information they can only share in PM's or words to that effect.

    We call that "baiting" and it makes me crazy. It is so frustrating to try and get things under control when someone recklessly posts a cryptic post creating a frenzy of posts asking to be PM'd.
    Please be mindful of our rules.
    Thank you,
    Tricia
     
  3. dotr

    dotr Well-Known Member

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  4. dotr

    dotr Well-Known Member

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    ISP: Delphi Homicide Investigation
    "On Monday, February 13th, at approximately 1:00 p.m., the two young girls were let off near the Monon High Bridge, an abandoned rail bridge over Deer Creek to walk around and hang out. They were to be picked up later in the afternoon, but did not show up there at the previously arranged time. Following an extensive search, at approximately 12:15 p.m. on February 14, 2017, the bodies of the two girls were found in a wooded area near the Delphi Historic Trail, approximately one-half mile upstream from the bridge.

    [​IMG]
    Delphi homicide suspect
    On Wednesday, February 15th, law enforcement officers distributed a photograph of a person observed on the Delphi Historic Trail. The photograph appears to depict a white male wearing blue jeans, a blue coat/jacket, and a hoodie. During the course of the investigation, preliminary evidence has led investigators to believe the person, in the distributed photograph, is a suspect in the investigation of the homicides of Abigail Williams and Liberty German.

    Additionally, investigators have released an updated voice recording and video of the suspect not previously released that was extracted from Liberty “Libby” German’s cell phone."

    LISTEN: Police release audio of Delphi, Ind. murder suspect
     
  5. liltexans

    liltexans Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Jumping off this post to remind everyone that you need to call or email the police if you think you have a tip or have discovered a person who matches the sketch or sketches. DO NOT post what you think you have found here on the forum.

    Take any and all sleuthing of non-POIs to your private conversations and DO NOT mention them here. It is a major TOS violation to sleuth non-POIs on the forum. It's even worse if you are implicating a minor child in your posts. And baiting is against our rules, so DO NOT hint that you have uncovered information that you can't share openly here.

    If you think you know something, call the police.
     
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  6. CrimeDawg123

    CrimeDawg123 Well-Known Member

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    April 22 Press Conference transcript:

    <news announcer>
    Doug Carter and he has taken the stand. We'll take a listen in.

    <audio cuts in to Superintendent Carter>
    ... the Delphi community how grateful I am you inspire people you don't even understand and you don't even understand why. Information is being released today is the result of literally thousands and thousands of hours of extraordinary investigative efforts by Delphi Carroll County, the FBI, the Indiana State Police and countless other agencies. This community surrounded us some twenty six months ago and you did everything you could to support us but most importantly you surrounded the family of these two little girls. Gosh I'll never forget it. After you hear what we're going to release today I'm going to ask for your continued support, your continued understanding, your empathy and compassion as we move forward to find out who did this and we will.

    We're seeking the public's help to identify the driver of a vehicle that was parked at the old CPS DCS welfare building in the city of Delphi that was abandoned on the east side of County Road 300 North next to the Hoosier Heartland highway between the hours of noon to 5:00 on February 14th 2017. If you were parked there or know who was parked there please contact the officers at the command post at the Delphi city building.

    We are releasing additional portions of the audio recorded from that day. Please keep in mind the person talking is one person and is the person on the bridge with the girls. This is not two different people speaking. Please listen to it very, very carefully. We are also releasing video recovered from Libby's phone. This video has never before been previously released. The video shows a suspect walking on the bridge. When you see the video watch the watch the person's mannerisms as they walk. Watch the mannerisms as he walks. Do you recognize the mannerisms as being someone that you might know? Remember he is walking on a former railroad bridge. Because of the deteriorated condition of the bridge the suspect is not walking naturally due to the spacing between the ties.

    During the course of this investigation we have concluded the first sketch released will become secondary as of today. The result of the new information and intelligence over time leads us to believe the sketch which you will see shortly is the person responsible for the murders of these two little girls. We also believe this person is from Delphi. Currently or has previously lived here, visits Delphi on a regular basis or works here. We believe this person is currently between the age range of 18 and 40 but might appear younger than its true age.

    Directly to the killer who may be in this room. We believe you are hiding in plain sight. For more than two years you never thought we would shift gears to a different investigative strategy but we have. We likely have interviewed you or someone close to you. We know that this is about power to you and you want to know what we know. And one day you will.

    The question to you: what will those closest to you think of they find out that you brutally murdered two little girls, two children? Only a coward would do such a thing.

    We are confident that you have told someone what you have done or at the very least they know because how different you are since the murders. We try so hard to understand how a person could do something like this to to two chil to two children. I recently watched a movie called The Shack and there's also a book that talks so well about evil, about death and about eternity. To the murderer I believe you have just a little bit of a conscience left and I can assure you that how you left them in that woods is not, is not what they are experiencing today.

    The family. I hope that you all will give them some time because we're going to be asking that there's no media inquiry or no media response for at least the next two weeks and I hope you understand why. The family found out about this about this information this morning. I just want the family to know that when I take my last breath on this earth I'll be thinking of them. There's going to be a tremendous amount of <unintelligble> I know that. I know that. Never in my career have I stood in front of something like this. Please be patient with us. Please. We're just beginning. We are we are just now beginning. That I can tell you on behalf of the sheriff and the police chief so many other partners that have stood with us over this period of time that we will not stop.

    -- Other officer ..
    I just unveiled the person that we believe responsible for the murder of these two little girls so I invite media to take a look at that now. Kim.

    We're also going to show you a video not previously released that superintendent spoke to and also the audio that's additional to what's been previously released. It's only a slight change in it. So give Sergeant Riley just a second as he gets that up and ready.
    <plays audio>
    Stand by for the video please. There is no sound of the video.
    <plays video> As Superintendent Carter mentioned. He is on the railway bridge. You have to take different steps to get to it. This information later this afternoon will be on the state police website. For the community that's here we have 100 copies of the news release. If you put in that URL you'll be able to get to that site to play it. And we also have that same release for you in the media and the rest of the state we'll get that released in about 15 minutes. So we appreciate those of you that came here. This concludes our announcement. Thank you for your time patience and courtesy.
    <end>

     
  7. Harmony 2

    Harmony 2 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    Admin note: Be sure to read the parameters for posting laid out in post #1 and 2 by Tricia.

    Pay particular attention to this quote from Tricia:

    DO NOT post photos of random individuals (including persons featured in MSM articles about other area crimes) to compare to the images of unidentified suspect on the bridge.

    Members who insist on breaking our rules by continually casting suspicion on people who have not been designated as suspects or POIs have and will be placed on thread reply bans.


     
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  8. Harmony 2

    Harmony 2 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    A few reminders:
    *When posting statements of fact a link to MSM must be provided.
    *Information from Topix and Reddit are not allowed here.
    *Before discussing podcasts, etc please check with a moderator, an admin or Tricia to see if it is approved to be posted here. (note: the the Podcast Best case Worst Case - a discussion between three former FBI agents is fine to discuss)
    *It is against our TOS to discuss the comments of visitors on social media.
    *
    Information on the scanner threads remains on those threads.

    *There are no named POIs in this case. Do not make insinuations or veiled accusations about random people.
     
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  9. gregjrichards

    gregjrichards Well-Known Member

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  10. sillybilly

    sillybilly WS Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    This thread is dedicated to discussing details of Abby's and Libby's case.

    Please keep details related to other cases in their own dedicated thread. It gets confusing to read a post, wonder what the heck it is about, and then realize it pertains to another case entirely.

     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2019
  11. sillybilly

    sillybilly WS Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    Please note the above opening posts and continue discussion of Abby and Libby's case here.
     
  12. Nerissa

    Nerissa Well-Known Member

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    I am open to the idea of them either deliberately meeting up with someone - and more so, that the perp is someone they know: perhaps just an acquaintance or that 'guy' (who works wherever or they've previously seen wherever: including the trails/bridge)

    Hate to say it but the fact that Abby (sorry or is it Libby - the phonetic quality of their names gets jumbled in my brain!) was banned by her parents to cross the bridge: well: look what she was doing! Now, IMO, that's kids for ya.....but, we cannot just think: oh, they would never do this or that or would always tell their parents. Again: no value judgment on them: that's kids for ya (including me when I was one!)

    I'd like to know how often they went to these trails - assuming wasn't uncommon - especially if kid hang out - & most especially if some older teens: make them feel like they, too, are more mature, etc. Also Libby only lived a mile from the place - wonder how often she went there alone, if at all? I'm wondering how 'odd' it was to at the last moment just have to go out there.....? Not that I think it's odd in & of itself: but why that destination, that day, that spur of the moment...? Maybe nothing: but considering they were murdered....hard IMO to just shrug off.

    I can see why some think they were meeting someone: there they are apparently 'waiting' - and here this guy comes & they apparently go with him....

    NOW what I will say is knowing this was a kid hang out spot this creep may have over time come up with his plan - & waited & waited for good opportunity. Maybe he was getting impatient. Sees these two gals - takes his chances...

    And it WAS quite the risk. Twenty people at one point were hanging out. Anyone could have saw him, the girls.....anyone could have been approaching behind him on bridge (hard to see if anyone coming - long bridge).....but most of all why would he target TWO victims together like that?

    Also: why when he approached when he was quite far from them start shouting ( I think that's why the video was made: he was being belligerent well before the video started) - ? It's like he may as well be waving a red flag & shouting 'crazy psycho killer coming your way, run!!' I'm not joking either - it makes no sense to me.

    More than likely the girls crossed bridge - for the thrill of it - were going back - guy is crossing: decide to wait until he's crossed & off bridge & then they'll head off - guy starts shouting: they decide to record him with no idea of course he's going to harm them......at some point as he nears he draws out a weapon, more than likely gun - "down the hill..."
     
  13. tresir2012

    tresir2012 Oh! What a tangled web we weave....

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    No it's not new or different, the ISP time is old. BP only agreed they could go if they arranged a lift back because she told Libby she was busy and couldn't pick them up. Libby said my Dad will pick me up and BP said in the interview she knew he would and explained DG was on an errand for her so she left it up to Libby to arrange the pick up, which Libby did when she was in the car at the trail head. I think this is all in the one interview - probably the Grey Hughes one, perhaps someone else remembers it exactly, but that was how we got more exact times. At least it is a better source than an unauthorised blog that is now deleted. As to why ISP still has 1 p.m. IDK but take it as 1 p.m. if you would rather, I don't mind. It just goes to emphasize that LE info is not always accurate or even up to date. The sketch fiasco is a prime example. We just have to go with what we see and what we got and then our own take and interpretations. HTH.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2019
  14. Nerissa

    Nerissa Well-Known Member

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    Thinking more upon it if Abby (?) was banned from the bridge - suggests to me she went there often enough

    Knowing it's a teen hang out makes even more sense that, not knowing what else to do, decided to go hang there, walk around - maybe hoping some other kids they know might be there, some guy they might have a crush on: kid stuff........

    One can only assume though the angle of meeting someone there would have been turned inside out upside down & then tossed around the solar system & subjected to some quantum eraser experiment and then put into a black hole: where it'd disappear because there's no reason to believe it...
    Or something like that........

    Still my hinky-o-meter about the forensic classes is still going off.....
     
  15. rosesfromangels

    rosesfromangels Amateur speculations and opinion only

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    Respectfully snipped for focus
    It's been a long week, so forgive my ignorance.
    I have absolutely no idea what this means.
    Huh?

    Amateur opinion and speculation
     
  16. rosesfromangels

    rosesfromangels Amateur speculations and opinion only

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    Just jumping back in to this fast moving thread after a busy week at work.
    What happened with the super interesting notion of a connection to the storage facility close by? I think the idea he could have used that facility/shed as his base camp is really interesting. Any new on that exploration?

    Amateur opinion and speculation
     
  17. max99

    max99 Well-Known Member

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    bbm
     
  18. TL4S

    TL4S Dumbified Clown

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    Maybe 1pm takes into account the time from when the girls decided to go and/or were getting ready to leave for the trails. That's when things set into motion for the girls, so LE includes that for the possibility they ran into BG somewhere between home and the park? I don't really think this is the case, but I guess nothing's off the table.
     
  19. Nerissa

    Nerissa Well-Known Member

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    The forensic classes COULD be simple coincidence...

    But this also could tie into IMO LE saying the motive in the last press conference: that they know it's all about power with the perp...

    A perp who plans to commit the perfect heinous crime - to elude LE, & the manner in which he eludes them (which only LE knows) - the manner of death (which only LE knows), whatever it is he did to the girls (didn't LE say something to the effect that Abby & Libby would not spend eternity as he left them...?? ODD)

    Sounds like a perp who might be into forensics himself - not just some 'opportunity strikes' type

    Regardless of the forensics classes - IMO I do take 'power' to be the perps motive as per LE & their PC....maybe that is NOT what LE meant...but it was a pretty darn specific statement
     
  20. tresir2012

    tresir2012 Oh! What a tangled web we weave....

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    When trying to work out distances from crime scene to e.g. storage or CPS or car park, we all started discussing exact known location of crime scene and flowers. I think we are going to use the case map by skibaboo in post 1.

    Now I think it is about half a mile to that storage building and I agree he could have used it to change into/out of his clothes and to keep weapons, drugs etc lie low and then join search.
     
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