Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #177

[Tricia]

Welcome back to the Delphi Murders discussion thread.

On the afternoon of Feb. 13th, 2017, best friends Abigail Williams and Liberty German were dropped off at a bridge in the town of Delphi. On Feb 14th their bodies were discovered around noon about 50 feet from the north bank of Deer Creek which is about 0.5 miles from the bridge.

Richard Allen has been arrested and charged with the murders of Abby and Libby

ISP page dedicated to the investigation (includes audio of suspect)

FOR MORE CLICK HERE FOR THE CARROL COUNTY SHERIFF'S OFFICE FACEBOOK PAGE.

Anyone with information about this case, no matter how insignificant, is encouraged to call the Delphi Homicide Investigation Tip Line at (844) 459-5786.

Information can also be reported by calling the Indiana State Police at(800) 382-7537, or the Carroll County Sheriff's Department at (765) 564-2413.

Information can also be emailed to Abbyandlibbytip@cacoshrf.com

PICTURES OF ABBY AND LIBBY
Link to post with all threads 1 - 98 (Courtesy of margarita25)
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Link to Media Maps & Timelines *No Discussion*
Link to Media Maps & Timelines #2 *No Discussion*
IMAGE Discussion Thread

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Rules Etiquette & Information

Case map by skibaboo updated with grayhuze crime flow video

Grayhuze youtube channel
Murder sheet YouTube

Verified Insiders: None in this case at this time. Verified Professional, Member michael.gartley, is a Verified Expert in Imaging Science.

RULES OF THIS DISCUSSION
DO NOT post photos of random individuals (including persons featured in MSM articles about other area crimes) to compare to the images of unidentified suspect on the bridge.

PLEASE DO NOT POST PICTURES OF SEX OFFENDERS!

Do not sleuth family, PERIOD. This includes previous public records which have nothing to do with this case. They are victims here. Plain and simple.

If you feel you have a tip, by all means, phone it in. Do NOT discuss your tip here. Contact the authorities and give them time to follow your lead.

NOTE - per Tricia and Sillybilly’s 5.28.2021 post here, JBC as a poi is now open for discussion in the Delphi thread.

Added 12/12/21
For general discussion on KAK’s current case please use his thread.
IN, Peru - Kegan Anthony Kline, 27, arrested Aug 29, 2020, 30 Counts associated with CSAM

 

[Tricia]

A consolidation of ADMIN & MOD notes (edited November 24, 2022):

- Members are allowed to discuss Richard Allen's voice as heard on the Gray Hughes podcast. Members may NOT link directly to RA's wife’s social media accounts.

- Speculation about RA’s possible involvement in other cases belongs in the OTHER CASES thread.

- Speculation that is not based on known fact is not allowed.

- Please use initials only for anyone other than victims or perps.

- If you have questions about rules or moderation, please do not ask them on the thread. Just jump off any post to use the Report feature to ask and a Mod or Admin will respond as soon as possible.

- Rumors are not allowed. If you can't link information to Websleuths approved sources, do NOT post it with "I read it somewhere" or "I'll find the link later ...".

- Sleuthing or discussing RSOs just because they are on the registry is not allowed. A thread specific exception may be made by Tricia or an Admin depending on geographical location in relation a crime.

- Photo alterations or side-by-side comparisons of unrelated pictures are not allowed.

 

[Tricia]

Mod Note:
For general JBC II discussions please use his thread. In Abby & Libby’s thread, JBC II should only be discussed in the context of a possible connection to Abby & Libby’s case.
Thanks Everyone!

JBC II Thread:
IN - James Chadwell II, 42, arrested after girl 9, found in his home, Lafayette, 19 Apr 2021 #3

Added 12/12/21
For general discussion on KAK’s current case please use his thread.
IN, Peru - Kegan Anthony Kline, 27, arrested Aug 29, 2020, 30 Counts associated with CSAM

 

[Tricia]

ADMIN NOTE:

Sorry folks, but statement analysis, body language analysis, amateur handwriting analysis is not allowed unless sourced to a credentialed, forensic specialist involved in the case under discussion.

This discussion is dedicated to Abby and Libby. Posts that do not relate directly to their case are off topic and such posts get removed. If you wish to discuss personal matters, please do so with your WS friends through PM or in the basement.

Also, the presumption of innocence is part and parcel of the judicial process. It does not apply to the general public who are entitled to express their opinion. Members are not here to be lectured or chastised by others for expressing their personal opinions. If you have an issue, use the Report feature and let Mods or Admins determine what is or is not okay to post.

Thanks.

Sillybilly
WS Administrator

Click here for The Rules

 

[Knitty]

Please continue here.

 

[FrostedGlass]

@DeDee regarding your post from the closed thread.

Unless I missed one, here are the ex parte motions from the D. I've lost the pdf of Nick's motion to withdraw the motion for medical records but I think he only listed 4 that he saw.

12/08/2022 *** Applications for Cost of Representation Including Expert Fees and Expenses
Motion Filed
Motion for Leave to Proceed Ex Parte
Filed By:Allen, Richard M.

12/21/2022
Motion Filed
Ex Parte Motion Authorizing Funding for Fact Investigator
Filed By:Allen, Richard M.

06/06/2023
Motion Filed
MOTION FOR EX PARTE DETERMINATION OF DEFENDANT'S MOTION FOR APPOINTMENT OF EXPERTS
Filed By:Allen, Richard M.

06/16/2023
Motion Filed
Ex Parte Motion for Order Authorizing Expert at a Public Expense, Incorporating Memorandum in Support
Filed By:Allen, Richard M.

02/26/2024
Motion Filed
Verified Ex Parte Motion for Hearing on Funding for Expert Services
Filed By:Allen, Richard M.

 

[DeDee]

Thread #177

This is, in part, what Mr Moore says about the P's blunder

"It definitely raised questions on how an ex parte motion would be available to a party or to the public,” said Michael Moore, assistant executive director of the Indiana Public Defender Council. “An ex parte motion is a motion that is filed under seal to the court, and only the court should have access to that motion."

I take this to mean that the P should not have access to any ex parte hearing materials requested by the D which is what you've posted as ordered by JG. It's a serious infraction worthy of sanctions; never mind if it's oft repeated offences. How much of the law does Mc not understand?

March 8, 2024
Questions raised about how Delphi murders prosecutor learned information in private defense motion

 

[mrjitty]

While it's clear NcL should not have read the ex-parte motion, it seems clear how he got it now?

I presume this is all going to come out in discovery soon anyway if the defence intends to make these arguments. I presume they will try to avoid placing his actual medical records at issue. All this does at least suggest that the defence sees the admissions as a significant problem that they need to explain away using an expert witness.

It's great that we'll be able to get on to trial issues.

 

[layer]

While it's clear NcL should not have read the ex-parte motion, it seems clear how he got it now?

It does? Can you share?

 

[Vaderman]

I've mostly stopped following this case as it's just devolved into a never-ending mess, and WOW am I really out of the loop. The defendant's original attorneys have been re-instated? I REALLY didn't see that one coming.

Does anyone have a good recommendation on where to go to get caught up on this case? I've been trying to find simple explanations in MSM, YouTube videos, etc., but it is difficult to find clear and concise explanations on where things stand now.

 

[Cyber sleuth]

@DeDee regarding your post from the closed thread.

Unless I missed one, here are the ex parte motions from the D. I've lost the pdf of Nick's motion to withdraw the motion for medical records but I think he only listed 4 that he saw.

12/08/2022 *** Applications for Cost of Representation Including Expert Fees and Expenses
Motion Filed
Motion for Leave to Proceed Ex Parte
Filed By:Allen, Richard M.

12/21/2022
Motion Filed
Ex Parte Motion Authorizing Funding for Fact Investigator
Filed By:Allen, Richard M.

06/06/2023
Motion Filed
MOTION FOR EX PARTE DETERMINATION OF DEFENDANT'S MOTION FOR APPOINTMENT OF EXPERTS
Filed By:Allen, Richard M.

06/16/2023
Motion Filed
Ex Parte Motion for Order Authorizing Expert at a Public Expense, Incorporating Memorandum in Support
Filed By:Allen, Richard M.

02/26/2024
Motion Filed
Verified Ex Parte Motion for Hearing on Funding for Expert Services
Filed By:Allen, Richard M.

Per prosecutions motion the 12/8/22, 6/6/23,6/16/23 and 2/26/24 filings were all filed without seal and available to all parties to the case.
On 3/7/24 defense emailed JG and cc’d NMcL stating that the 2/26/25 ex parte motion was filed incorrectly and should have been filed under seal.
IMO above email occurred after NMcL filed his third party records request. D must have their filings auto set to file publicly.

 

[mrjitty]

Per prosecutions motion the 12/8/22, 6/6/23,6/16/23 and 2/26/24 filings were all filed without seal and available to all parties to the case.
On 3/7/24 defense emailed JG and cc’d NMcL stating that the 2/26/25 ex parte motion was filed incorrectly and should have been filed under seal.
IMO above email occurred after NMcL filed his third party records request. D must have their filings auto set to file publicly.

Yeah. Not surprised he read it but it was obviously dumb to reveal that he had read it lol

 

[mrjitty]

I've mostly stopped following this case as it's just devolved into a never-ending mess, and WOW am I really out of the loop. The defendant's original attorneys have been re-instated? I REALLY didn't see that one coming.

Does anyone have a good recommendation on where to go to get caught up on this case? I've been trying to find simple explanations in MSM, YouTube videos, etc., but it is difficult to find clear and concise explanations on where things stand now.

Honestly you could just wait for the opening arguments. 99% of what has been discussed pre-trial will be of no relevance at trial.

 

[Cyber sleuth]

Yeah. Not surprised he read it but it was obviously dumb to reveal that he had read it lol

Agree
Not an excuse but I bet he got tired of the mud slinging from defense that was being done publicly. I think he made a bad judgement call and buckled under the temptation to publicly air that defense is stressed about those confessions.
My guess is the confessions are pretty damning and since they weren’t done in a typical police interrogation setting defense needs a top expert in the field (that works the trial circuit) to sway the jury.
I think it probably felt good for a second to sock it to defense but was short lived as now he sullied his own reputation; no matter how innocently he gained access to the motions.

 

[layer]

So the D accidentally sent the docs unsealed. And The P just couldn't resist. This is all a joke, right? Should they just get a special prosecutor, new judge, and start over from scratch?

 

[mrjitty]

Agree
Not an excuse but I bet he got tired of the mud slinging from defense that was being done publicly. I think he made a bad judgement call and buckled under the temptation to publicly air that defense is stressed about those confessions.
My guess is the confessions are pretty damning and since they weren’t done in a typical police interrogation setting defense needs a top expert in the field (that works the trial circuit) to sway the jury.
I think it probably felt good for a second to sock it to defense but was short lived as now he sullied his own reputation; no matter how innocently he gained access to the motions.

I am surprised the extent to which people have priced in the admissions.

In all the other cases I have followed, recorded confessions as a free bonus on top of the evidence that led to charges would have been a huge tilt.

it won't be particularly easy to explain them away.

 

[Cyber sleuth]

So the D accidentally sent the docs unsealed. And The P just couldn't resist. This is all a joke, right? Should they just get a special prosecutor, new judge, and start over from scratch?

You are a stronger person than most. I don’t think D would have resisted if it was reversed.
Why couldn’t D learn to file motions properly. I mean JG went over it in chambers. I thought AB was using weaponized incompetence in regards
to incorrectly filing the Frank’s motion. But now it looks like it’s been an ongoing problem.
Why didn’t the fix it then? Did they mean to let P know their strategy? These seems very incompetent IMO

 

[WildHuncher]

DBM

Replied to wrong post. Dog jumped in my lap and ate my homework.

 

[GoBuckeyes]

So the D accidentally sent the docs unsealed. And The P just couldn't resist. This is all a joke, right? Should they just get a special prosecutor, new judge, and start over from scratch?

It feels like a really bad joke!

 

[layer]

Why didn’t the fix it then? Did they mean to let P know their strategy? These seems very incompetent IMO

I would consider it to be a sneaky D plan but history leads me to think incompetence. There is incompetence every way you turn here. The P either intended to get caught or didn't know any better. JG has given some the impression of being biased, and even more question her competence. All this coming on the tails of what is arguably one of the least competent double homicide investigations in modern memory.

All JMHO